Banner running bull Agm replacement (1 Viewer)

Feb 5, 2022
976
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40 years
Trying to replace my SINGLE hab battery for 2 x NO MAINTENANCE batteries. I’ve had the devils own job getting access to the hab battery! No wonder they don’t get looked after!
I DONT WANT LITHIUM
1.Are the lead carbon or lead calcium the best replacement for my AGM?

2. Are “gel” batteries better than liquid acid?
I turn to the collective for sage advice 😁
 

Lenny HB

LIFE MEMBER
Oct 18, 2007
54,140
152,909
On the coast in West Sussex
Funster No
658
MH
Hymer B678 DL
Exp
Since 2008 & many years tugging
Not much of a track record on the Lead Carbons yet and they are pricy. Lead Calcium is really a standard Lead Acid battery both Vatrta and Exide do good ones.
Of lead batteries Gel are my favorite they have a very long life so usually work out cheaper overall either Exide or Sonnenschine, both made in the same factory.

Whatever battery you decide on you need to make sure your charger supports them as you have a Brit van you may need to replace the charger if you go for Gel.
 
OP
OP
Gingernuts
Feb 5, 2022
976
2,314
Scotland
Funster No
86,710
MH
Possl 2 win
Exp
40 years
Not much of a track record on the Lead Carbons yet and they are pricy. Lead Calcium is really a standard Lead Acid battery both Vatrta and Exide do good ones.
Of lead batteries Gel are my favorite they have a very long life so usually work out cheaper overall either Exide or Sonnenschine, both made in the same factory.

Whatever battery you decide on you need to make sure your charger supports them as you have a Brit van you may need to replace the charger if you go for Gel.
Thanks Lenny, I’ve got a Possl 2 Win like a globe car don’t know how to change it in my avatar 😐
Used to have a Murvi 😏
 

Hoovie

Free Member
May 16, 2021
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Not much of a track record on the Lead Carbons yet and they are pricy. Lead Calcium is really a standard Lead Acid battery both Vatrta and Exide do good ones.
Of lead batteries Gel are my favorite they have a very long life so usually work out cheaper overall either Exide or Sonnenschine, both made in the same factory.

Whatever battery you decide on you need to make sure your charger supports them as you have a Brit van you may need to replace the charger if you go for Gel.
Why do you say there is not much of a track record on Lead Carbons yet? they have been around for way longer than Lithiums, for example, and I don't see people making that statement on Lithium as a reason not to consider.
Lead Carbon batteries are also not that much more expensive than decent 'standard' Lead Acid batteries.

If I were replacing a Lead Acid Battery in a motorhome, I would (and I did) get Lead Carbon, either the AGM version (nothing wrong with AGM) or the GEL version for those with an ABM phobia.
 
OP
OP
Gingernuts
Feb 5, 2022
976
2,314
Scotland
Funster No
86,710
MH
Possl 2 win
Exp
40 years
Not much of a track record on the Lead Carbons yet and they are pricy. Lead Calcium is really a standard Lead Acid battery both Vatrta and Exide do good ones.
Of lead batteries Gel are my favorite they have a very long life so usually work out cheaper overall either Exide or Sonnenschine, both made in the same factory.

Whatever battery you decide on you need to make sure your charger supports them as you have a Brit van you may need to replace the charger if you go for Gel.
Thanks Lenny, I’ve got a Possl 2 Win like a globe car don’t know how to change it in my avatar 😐
Used to have a Murvi
Why do you say there is not much of a track record on Lead Carbons yet? they have been around for way longer than Lithiums, for example, and I don't see people making that statement on Lithium as a reason not to consider.
Lead Carbon batteries are also not that much more expensive than decent 'standard' Lead Acid batteries.

If I were replacing a Lead Acid Battery in a motorhome, I would (and I did) get Lead Carbon, either the AGM version (nothing wrong with AGM) or the GEL version for those with an ABM phobia.
hi hoovie, which lead carbon gel batteries did you use please?
Alex

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Apr 27, 2016
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Thin plates made of pure lead are too soft to use in a vehicle battery, so an alloy is used. Originally lead-antimony was used, for batteries that produce gas as they work, needing vents and a method of topping up. Then they discovered it was the antimony causing the gassing, so came up with lead-calcium, sometimes with a bit of silver too. So the batteries could be sealed, with a pressure release valve just in case. That was back in the 1950s, but it's still presented as an 'innovation'.

Gel and AGM (Absorbent Glass Mat) are two ways of dealing with the liquid acid electrolyte so that it still works, but doesn't spill if the battery case is damaged or the battery is inverted. There are other advantages and disadvantages. Gels are not brilliant for starter batteries, which need very high amps for a few seconds, then recharge when the engine is running. They are best for lower amps over a long period, ideal for leisure batteries.

All lead-acid batteries are susceptible to 'sulfation'. The plate materials (lead, lead oxide) turn into lead sulfate as the battery discharges. It's a kind of gooey mush that turns back into the plate materials during recharging. So far so normal. If the battery is left in a discharged state for a long time (say more than a month) the gooey mush crystallises and the larger crystals are impossible to turn back into the plate materials when recharging. So the battery loses capacity, due to this sulfation. That's why all lead-acid batteries need to be fully charged to 100% at least once a month, to get rid of all the sulfate.

The only lead-acid type that attempts to solve this problem is lead-carbon, where the plates are covered with a kind of matrix of carbon, which allows the normal battery operation but stops the sulfation forming large crystals. If your usage is that you find it difficult to charge the batteries to 100% every month (relying on solar in winter for example), then worth considering lead-carbon.

Lithiums don't suffer from sulfation, and can be left partially charged indefinitely with no deterioration.
 

Hoovie

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May 16, 2021
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Thanks Lenny, I’ve got a Possl 2 Win like a globe car don’t know how to change it in my avatar 😐
Used to have a Murvi

hi hoovie, which lead carbon gel batteries did you use please?
Alex
I currently have the Ritar Lead Carbon AGM batteries I got from Alpha Batteries. They have a number of different Lead Carbon AGMs so they have switched the Ritars to Lead Carbon GEL instead - Around £190 for 110Ah. Sold under the Explorer Expedition brand by them I think?
I previously ran Northstar Blue+ Lead Carbon AGMs in my Campervan, which was an all-electric setup so ran the induction hob and water heater from the batteries via a Victron Multiplus.

I have posted about Lead Carbons before here but they are ideally suited to a Motorhome environment, and far more so than a standard lead acid battery as they can be discharged further, they don't mind being left in a partial state of charge (PSOC), unlike Lead Acid which really want to be recharged to full ASAP and they typically have a little lower charge voltage so can suit more standard chargers than the basic Lead Acid battery.

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OP
OP
Gingernuts
Feb 5, 2022
976
2,314
Scotland
Funster No
86,710
MH
Possl 2 win
Exp
40 years
I currently have the Ritar Lead Carbon AGM batteries I got from Alpha Batteries. They have a number of different Lead Carbon AGMs so they have switched the Ritars to Lead Carbon GEL instead - Around £190 for 110Ah. Sold under the Explorer Expedition brand by them I think?
I previously ran Northstar Blue+ Lead Carbon AGMs in my Campervan, which was an all-electric setup so ran the induction hob and water heater from the batteries via a Victron Multiplus.

I have posted about Lead Carbons before here but they are ideally suited to a Motorhome environment, and far more so than a standard lead acid battery as they can be discharged further, they don't mind being left in a partial state of charge (PSOC), unlike Lead Acid which really want to be recharged to full ASAP and they typically have a little lower charge voltage so can suit more standard chargers than the basic Lead Acid battery.
Hi Hoovie, unfortunately Ritar lead carbon are too tall for my underseat application!
My dims are L 350 x W172 x H194 😐
 

Hoovie

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May 16, 2021
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Hi Hoovie, unfortunately Ritar lead carbon are too tall for my underseat application!
My dims are L 350 x W172 x H194 😐
You are going to pretty limited generally with that height restriction.

A battery I used to fit for underseat placement on VW T4 and T5 conversions is the Leoch XR1750 AGM Battery. Rated at 100Ah and is a pretty good battery at around £150. It does have a fairly high 14.7V charge requirement so if you don't have a B2B you would need to be able to charge via a decent Mains or Solar charger occasion
 
May 31, 2015
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You won’t go far wrong with these, I think they fit into your van (Citroen) if you have a gel setting on your charger…😎

 
Last edited:
OP
OP
Gingernuts
Feb 5, 2022
976
2,314
Scotland
Funster No
86,710
MH
Possl 2 win
Exp
40 years
You won’t go far wrong with these, I think they fit into your van (citron) if you have a gel setting on your charger…😎

Thanks, I will check these out too!
Don’t know if I have a gel setting on my charger yet. It’s taken me ages to get the pax seat dismantled to get the hab battery out to measure it!
My van looks like a bomb has exploded in it 😂

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OP
OP
Gingernuts
Feb 5, 2022
976
2,314
Scotland
Funster No
86,710
MH
Possl 2 win
Exp
40 years
Thanks, I will check these out too!
Don’t know if I have a gel setting on my charger yet. It’s taken me ages to get the pax seat dismantled to get the hab battery out to measure it!
My van looks like a bomb has exploded in it 😂
Thanks, I will check these out too!
Don’t know if I have a gel setting on my charger yet. It’s taken me ages to get the pax seat dismantled to get the hab battery out to measure it!
My van looks like a bomb has exploded in it 😂
the exides only have 6 months warranty if used in a motorhome!!!!
 

Lenny HB

LIFE MEMBER
Oct 18, 2007
54,140
152,909
On the coast in West Sussex
Funster No
658
MH
Hymer B678 DL
Exp
Since 2008 & many years tugging
You are reading the info wrong that only applies to commercial or live aboard ( I assume means full time) leisure use .
Gels generally last up to 10 years or more.
 

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