Sorting Oxygen Problems

Discussion in 'Motorhomes for the Disabled' started by midlander9, Jun 29, 2009.

  1. midlander9

    midlander9 Read Only Funster

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    Hi all, been rather busy of late due to wifey being in hospital, she is out now and recuperating at home, but due to respiritory problems she now has to be on Oxygen 24/7, my first thought was well goodbye van due to restricted touring and low times on travelling bottles of gas, but it seems that the mains powered Oxygen machine could possibly be carried in the van whilst travelling and powered via an inverter from the leisure battery, and then be plugged into the mains on hook up, if anyone has any ideas or info on this any suggestions would be welcome, I`ve hopefully got it right, the mains oxygen machine only draws 2amps on mains voltage, so hopefully I dont see any problems to my way of thinking, and if I am right we can carry on camping, so to speak.

    Pearl and Mike
     
  2. SwiftGroup

    SwiftGroup Read Only Funster

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    Hi,

    Sorry to hear about your wife, hope she is feeling better now.

    An inverter will "upscale" the voltage, by 20, from 12V to 230 /240V, but this also upscales the amps by a factor of 20.

    Therefore, your 2 amp draw on 230V becomes nearly 40Amps when inverted from 12V. A 120AH lesiure battery will last a maximum of 3 hours, if the machine is on all the time.

    Ash
     
  3. Diabalo

    Diabalo Funster

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    Hi Mike,

    Sorry to hear the good lady has a few problems THIS site may help
     
  4. wasp

    wasp Funster

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    You could also use a small suitcase type genny perhaps ,they dont take up a lot of space and you can run during daylight hours, and to charge the battery, also you might consider doubling up on batteries:thumb::thumb::thumb:Cheers RobW
     
  5. smithyd1951

    smithyd1951 Read Only Funster

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    Hi Mike
    I have had the same problem, my wife also needs oxygen 24hrs, i have purchased a portable oxygen concentrator. I have a Sequal eclipse portable machine, the cost is around £3,500, however it seems that the companies that supply your oxygen at home are trying the concentrators at home. I can run the Sequal for around 13 hrs form my inverter wile standing, and still have power, when travaling there is no problems. I do however have three 110 amp batteries and a 75 wat solar. I also carry a Honda 750 gen. I think i have gone a little mad with the equipment but it makes my wife feal better about traveling. We have been using the equipment for 2 years now without problems, and we use the motorhome of mains power. My wife is now on 4lts fer hr.
    Good look and try to see if your oxygen company will supply you with a sequal eclipse.
    Dave
     
  6. midlander9

    midlander9 Read Only Funster

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    Re: Oxygen problems

    Hi again all, thanks for the replies and suggestions from Ash, Diabalo, Wasp, Smithy1951, Seems as though I still have a problem as I only have one 110amp leisure battery, I did think that whilst travelling to and from sites that with the help of an invertor I would be able to run the home oxygen converter for the wifey, and then once on site and on mains hookup swop over to that,but from reading some of the replies this now seems doubtful,problems, problems.
    If you read my reply Smithy1951, my wife also is on 4litres per minute, and at what you say the portable oxygen generator cost you, well I`m afraid the cost is out of the question at this time, there has to be another way round this somehow, I will give our oxygen supply people a ring and see if they are able to supply a portable which runs from battery and mains, but I have my doubts, thanks for your imput anyway, it`s appreciated, and I shall have to stop scratching my head, or I`ll get splinters in my fingers :Eeek:

    Mike and Pearl
     
  7. pappajohn

    pappajohn Funster Life Member

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    hi mike,

    if you only intend running the machine on the inverter while driving there should be no problem.
    your engine alternator will have no problems providing 40ah while driving.
    i reckon you will need, at least, a 500w inverter and running continuously i would go for a larger one.....maybe a 1000w as it will run cooler and last longer.
    i dont know how the machine works but if it has an electric motor of some type then you may need a pure sinewave inverter, unfortunately more expensive....most motors wont run properly on cheaper, modified sinewave inverters
    and with something as important as a medical oxygen machine you want reliability.

    ps.....at 40amps you will probably need the inverter connecting directly to your battery. not a difficult job
     
    Last edited: Jun 30, 2009
  8. Geo

    Geo Trader - Funster

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    I have absolutly no idea what a cylinder holds in terms of Ltrs but why not mount a cylinder on board or even a cradle underneath and pipe in a supply just for traveling and then revert back to the machine when on hook up:thumb:
    Geo
     
  9. pappajohn

    pappajohn Funster Life Member

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    it appears to be the cylinders that are the problem Geo....not big enough capacity for a decent length trip.:Sad:
     
  10. midlander9

    midlander9 Read Only Funster

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    Oxygen Problems

    Hi all, I`ve been in touch with one of Air Supply`s technical people today, they supply the Oxygen equipment for the wifey, and put the question to them concerning travelling and using the Oxygen converter machine in the van via a Sine Wave 1000watt invertor whilst driving to and from sites, the plain and simple answer was that the invertor would run it, but the battery would drain flat in roughly three or four hours, so thats a no go, but they did say that the wife`s standby bottles could be fitted with a constrictor type mechanism which would double the length of time they would last, approx: 9 hours, and if we give our local GP the dates and times we were going away, and where, local oxygen would be supplied to the site we were on, so all in all I think problem solved :thumb:
    All I need to do now is find someone who wants to buy an unused 1000 watt Pure Sine Wave Invertor brand new still in the box :Eeek: Thanks to all who tried to help with suggestions, much appreciated.

    Pearl amd Mike
     
  11. pappajohn

    pappajohn Funster Life Member

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    they definately got the wrong end of the stick:Doh:

    if you ONLY use the machine on an inverter WHILST DRIVING it will run as long as the engine is running, and the alternator is working as it should, then the battery WILL NOT discharge at all.

    if it was as they state then driving with headlights, heater, radio etc would also flatten the battery . but it doesnt, does it!:thumb:

    on the other hand if you stop the engine then the inverter WILL start to drain the battery as it has nothing to keep it charged.
    which is what they appear to have advised you on.:Doh:

    it strikes me if these people want to give advise they should actually study and understand what they are giving advise on first:Angry:
     
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  12. midlander9

    midlander9 Read Only Funster

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    Re: oxygen

    Hi Pappajohn, thanks for the reply, basically I seem to think that the oxygen people are more concerned about protecting there equipment, and this puts me right in the middle, either take the risk and use there machine on an invertor, or follow there guidance and not do so, no idea how much this equipment costs? and who`s liable if anything goes wrong, so take the safe route I think and put their restrictor to use when it gets here.

    Thanks for the input anyway, much appreciated from yourself and other members

    Pearl and Mike
     
  13. camcondor

    camcondor Read Only Funster

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    Hi Midlander9,

    Have just read this thread and can understand Pappajohns frustration with the very foolish "advice" you have been given. I'm a medical doctor as well as a motorhomer and I have some electronics knowledge as well with a Full Radio Amateur licence, so I also know exactly what I'm talking about and can verify that the "advice" that the oxygen machine will "run your battery flat" while using the sine wave inverter WHILE DRIVING the van is complete and utter b**llocks, no-one with any undertsanding of how vehicle ignition systems work could possibly have given such nonsensical "advice", unless they made a mistake and thought you were hooking up to a battery NOT CONNECTED TO THE VEHICLE battery while driving the van, in other words just a "spare" loose battery inside the van, stupid though that may sound, as not everyone knows how leisure batteries or motorhome batteries are connected. Your oxygen machine will not suffer ANY damage if connected to an adequate Sine Wave inverter, which you run off your van WHILE TRAVELLING - this way, your alternator keeps the battery charged and the machine runs off it quite happily, protected by the extra protection of the Sine Wave inverter.

    It makes me mad when people spout off rubbish to vulnerable folk :Eeek::Doh::Angry:

    Obviously its your choice in the end, but please make a proper decision based on ACCURATE facts, and not silly nonsense which makes no sense electronically at all!!!:Eeek:

    I do hope your wife continues to recover and that you enjoy your travels, anyway. :thumb:
     
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  14. pappajohn

    pappajohn Funster Life Member

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    im with Laurie (camconder) on this....no equipment damage will occure running on an inverter.

    if they can fit a restrictor valve to double the use time per bottle, does that mean that under normal circumstances the bottle is expelling too much oxygen.......or does your wife have to go on reduced intake when in the van.

    i have no idea of the cost of medical oxygen to the NHS or to private indiviuals but i should imagine it isnt cheap.

    if the restrictor still allows an adequate supply then why dont they fit it as standard and save the tax payers money.

    this isnt aimed at you personally but is an observation on my part.
     
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  15. ourcampersbeentrashed

    ourcampersbeentrashed Funster

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    The reality is, that whatever a persons disability - provided journeys are well planned and planned in advance, there is no reason whatsoever for you and wifey to enjoy as normal a holiday/motorhome experience as possible.

    DO arrange in advance locations where you can swap oxygen bottles.

    DO give advance warning to the hospital local to where you may stay for a few days - incase the oxygen fails etc.

    DO speak to campsites etc - they will often take an oxygen delivery on your behalf and can ensure it is their for you - the company can always collect the empties from you later i.e. better 2 much than 2 little.

    As an example - Butlins at Minehead used to have their own small store of oxygen too - dont know whether they still do though - they also take clients on dialysis.

    DO dial 999 if a bottle runs out too quickly and you are mid journey - certainly in london ambulances carry oxygen onboard.

    DO NOT stress out so much that you cant enjoy it

    Research your location before going and advise any charities etc that could possibly assist you too.

    It sounds a great deal of work, but once you get used to doing it - it becomes routine

    DO NOT GIVE UP MOTORHOMING xxxxx

    You can PM me if you want any specific advice xxxxx
     
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  16. midlander9

    midlander9 Read Only Funster

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    Re Oxygen

    Hi Pappajohn, thanks again for the input and re the restrictor, well as far as I have been informed it works like this, the main oxygen machine in the home draws in air and withdraws the oxygen content and then pumps this through tubing to a canulla fitted into the nostrils,but this method wastes oxygen due to the fact that it is pumping and producing oxygen whilst breathing in and out, whereas the restrictor will reduce the oxygen wastage by only allowing oxygen through when the patient is breathing in, hope this is clear to you but its the best way I can explain it.
    The restrictor is only a small unit and will only connect to the travelling bottles,but I am assured by the oxygen people that this will extend the usage of these bottles by up to nine hours.
    I have changed my mind about selling the invertor, and I think I will install it in the van connected to the leisure battery (110 amp) and try the mains oxygen machine out connected to this on one or two short journeys, as a trial, and see how things pan out, I`m no electronics expert,but for the life of me I cannot see why it should`nt perform adequately,will let you know how things progress.

    Mike and Pearl
     
  17. midlander9

    midlander9 Read Only Funster

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    Oxygen

    Hi Camconder, thanks for your reply, I am no electronics expert but I could not really believe that a mains machine using 2amps max could not be connected to an invertor via the leisure battery in the van, and used whilst driving to and from sites.
    I have purchased a 1000watt pure sine wave inverter which I will be installing in the van, our leisure battery is a 110amp model, our van is nearly three years old and in very good mechanical condition, so I think everything should be ok there.
    The Wife is on a supply of 4 litres per minute of oxygen at the present time, this problem is all new to my Wife and I at the moment, she was only discharged from hospital three weeks ago with respritory and kidney problems, also a diabetic/insulin and has arthritus problems. I think I thought that our motorhoming days were over at first due to restricted supply on her travelling bottles, 1 hour 45 minutes on the one, and 1 hour 15 minutes on the second, but it seems that after talking with the oxygen supply people these times can be extended to 9 hours with a small restrictor mechanism, which only allows oxygen through when the patient breathes in, they are going to supply us with one, so this will improve matters no end,but I will still try on a trial basis the main machine while travelling.
    Anyway thankyou for your input, every suggestion helps in its way.

    Pearl and Mike
     
  18. midlander9

    midlander9 Read Only Funster

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    oxygen Problems Sorted

    Hi all, just an update on oxygen problems, the technician called today to bring us the small restrictor box which can be fitted from bottle to bottle, the small travelling bottles will now last approx: 9 hours, and the large bottle will last 26 hours. But while he was here I put the question to him concerning the invertor, he looked at me for a few seconds and then took me to his van and opened the rear door, inside was a small work bench with his tools and such, he then pointed to the floor and there for all to see was an invertor, and he said that he plugged the mains operated machines in when he was servicing them, and he had never had any problems, and he said he could see no problem with using an invertor whilst motoring to sites with the mains machine plugged in, but that another way round any problems was to phone in and ask for extra bottles for travelling, so thanks again to all of you, but problem now solved, with a bit of forward planning we will be able to go where we please.

    Pearl and Mike :thumb: :thumb:
     
  19. bmb1uk

    bmb1uk Read Only Funster

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    Hi a revisit to an old thread, i have oxygen machine,first it has a mains adapter which reduces from 240v to 28v at 6.4 amp to run though a 300w inverter from 3x 110ah batteries +100w solar panel second it has a cigar lighter battery adapter which increases the output from 12 to 26.5v at 5a, what i am trying to work out is how long will the 3x 110 ah batteries last, just using oxygen machine. (with acknowledgement to other members help)
     
  20. pappajohn

    pappajohn Funster Life Member

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    having a problem juggling two maths at the same time so will need verifying but.

    12v to 26v converter will use around 11amp/hour from your batteries...or around 15hrs use to 50% discharge, I doubt your split charger will put 11amps/hr back in the leisure batteries when driving and you cant rely on the sun for solar charging

    12v (battery) to 240v (inverter) to 28v (adaptor output) via inverter will take around 60amp/hour from your batteries....or 2hr 15mins and just about indefinately if the inverter is connected to your engine battery when driving
     

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