juwlz
Free Member
We're looking for ideas for our next upgrade, and also hoping that this thread will act as a resource for anybody else looking for a similar style of Motorhome.
We're currently driving a 1993 Autosleepers Talisman (~5.4m long), which is our third motorhome, and the one that we've kept the longest of the three. Our first, bought in around 2003, was a 1987 Holdsworth panel van conversion, and since then we've gradually upgraded to slightly newer and larger vans as the years went by, but always sticking to minor variations of the same twin dinette / twin sofa convertible layout that our initial homework told us would work for us, right from the start. (Obviously, the homework paid off, as contrary to all the warnings and advice we read before we bought the first one, we DID get it right first time.)
As we've upgraded, we've moved away from using (and needing) driveaway awnings, etc. (in fact, that was specifically our reason for switching from our second panel van to a coachbuilt, inspired by a couple we met on a campsite one year), and towards being able to arrive, set up camp, and be ready to go out again with minimal fuss. We do use a "toilet tent" as an onsite shed if we take the folding bike and/or large reclining chairs away with us, and we have a wind-out awning with lightweight side panels, which we use if we're staying put for the day and the weather is right. But that's it.
We like many aspects of the inside space in the Talisman - we like the versatility of table positioning and clever tabletop and leg storage; both of us like lounging with our feet up on the twin bench "sofas", and we prefer single beds, rather than climbing over each other at night. It has drawers/cabinets/worktop space at the bedheads for our night time bits and bobs. There's also a decent wardrobe.
However, the mechanics of the base van are starting to show their age, and as we're not particularly mechanically minded (and not enthusiastic about tinkering), we'd like to upgrade again.
One of the downsides of the Talisman is that having the driver and passenger seats as part of the single beds means that making / unmaking of the beds is a slightly long-winded process (even though I've got it down to a fine art), whereby 'im indoors takes the dog for a short walk to give me some space while I swivel chairs and throw seat and backrest cushions around to reconfigure the interior, and optionally fold and store / retrieve and unfold a dog crate (used for travelling), depending on what we're planning to do/have been doing for the day. It's particularly inconvenient if we want to drive anywhere in the evening (or stop off on our way back from a day out), e.g. to go out to eat, and come home feeling ready to just drop into bed, rather than wanting to embark on a minor engineering exercise.
So I'm ready for a slightly easier Motorhoming life. We're finding that we use the dinette layout less and less often, and having done the rounds of some of the Motorhome Shows over the summer, have come to the conclusion that the layout that would suit us better now is a rear U-shaped lounge. That gives us the ability to have two single beds that we can leave made up when we want to, even if we're driving, or to use as sofas for feet-up lounging (we'd probably improvise some sort of bedside table / coffee table / small storage unit / folding dog crate fixings for the bottom bar of the "U"). For us, it would be the next step on the "minimal fuss" path. And having externally accessible storage for the outdoor stuff (whether in a garage or on a bike rack) would add to that.
Unlike even a twin bench + rear kitchen layout that doesn't include the front seats as part of the beds, a rear lounge gives us somewhere to put a dog crate (in the lounge) and still be able to access the rest of the 'van, including the front seats without having to climb over it / squeeze past it. Also, rear lounge models typically have a (small) "garage" under the rear lounge seat, for outside chairs, ramps, hoses, cables, a folding bike, etc. (all things that currently have to travel inside the washroom or other cubbyholes in the Talisman, and mostly need an onsite "shed" when we arrive at our destination); and, of course, the views from the lounge windows are a big attraction, as is being able to see out of the rear window when driving.
Unfortunately, things are complicated by the fact that we have a hard limit of 6.4m in length - the distance from the front wall of the house to the footpath - and even that includes the downpipe from the guttering! And sadly, we don't have unlimited funds
.
From the mechanical reliability / newness point of view, we'd be looking at something from 2000 or later (2002 would be even better, as we're close enough to London to potentially sometimes want to camp inside the M25 Low Emission Zone limit). But we won't be able to afford anything much newer than that. The ones I've seen so far would already be above what we'd ideally like to pay, so it seems we'll just have to stretch the budget to get what we want.
There's just the two of us (plus dog), so we only need 2 seatbelts and sleeping space for 2.
We like the Autosleeper monocoques and the tank-like build reputation of the Hymers as being designs that don't tend to have many weak points in seams for damp to get in. And with apologies to members who have them, I'm absolutely not a fan of the bulbous over-cab bump designs. We don't need the overcab height, or the increased wind resistance, and I'm afraid I find them horribly ugly.
Possibilities so far
I like the look of the Hymer B534, approx 6m (I've seen a RHD one advertised, but it had been sold before we could view it, so haven't confirmed the dimensions of the interior, and particularly the lounge seats). The garage access looks impressive. The drop down bed over the cab - and the fact that it drops down much lower than most overcab beds - is appealing. We probably wouldn't use it much, except to store bedding, but options are always good.
The pre-2006(ish) low profile Autocruise StarSpirit (6.15m) looks like another option. A local dealer currently has one in stock, so I'm planning to have a look today. (Newer models are longer.) On the downside, external storage access looks frankly pathetic - not much chance of getting a folding bike in that way!
Somebody elsewhere suggested the Bessacar E465 (6.1m), but I haven't been able to find any low-profile variants, and the corner seams on the roof always feel like a weak point for water ingress to me, which would make me wary of these, even if there were any low profile ones around.
Models that won't work for us (but might for others)
The Autosleepers Rienza that we saw at the Romsey show looked promising ... until I discovered that it's 6.8m long, so won't fit on the drive.
The Autosleepers Ascot at 6.4m is pushing the length right to the limit, and the lounge appears to be J-shaped, rather than U-shaped, so I doubt the shorter leg would be long enough to use as a bed, even for me. (It has a slightly larger kitchen, which takes up the space.)
The Autocruise StarDream (6.65m) is too long to fit on the drive.
The Swift Lifestyle 622 or Escape 622 (6.3m) would be possibilities, but they seem to be too recent for our budget to reach.
Any other ideas?
So, taking all that into account, can anybody suggest any other makes and models that meet our spec that we can search for? Unless anybody has any suggestions that meet all the requirements, I don't really want to get into a discussion about the pros and cons of rear lounges, as I'm pretty clear that that's what will work for us, although I do understand that different people like different things (or there wouldn't be other layouts to choose from).
In summary, our requirements are:
Thanks
Julie
We're currently driving a 1993 Autosleepers Talisman (~5.4m long), which is our third motorhome, and the one that we've kept the longest of the three. Our first, bought in around 2003, was a 1987 Holdsworth panel van conversion, and since then we've gradually upgraded to slightly newer and larger vans as the years went by, but always sticking to minor variations of the same twin dinette / twin sofa convertible layout that our initial homework told us would work for us, right from the start. (Obviously, the homework paid off, as contrary to all the warnings and advice we read before we bought the first one, we DID get it right first time.)
As we've upgraded, we've moved away from using (and needing) driveaway awnings, etc. (in fact, that was specifically our reason for switching from our second panel van to a coachbuilt, inspired by a couple we met on a campsite one year), and towards being able to arrive, set up camp, and be ready to go out again with minimal fuss. We do use a "toilet tent" as an onsite shed if we take the folding bike and/or large reclining chairs away with us, and we have a wind-out awning with lightweight side panels, which we use if we're staying put for the day and the weather is right. But that's it.
We like many aspects of the inside space in the Talisman - we like the versatility of table positioning and clever tabletop and leg storage; both of us like lounging with our feet up on the twin bench "sofas", and we prefer single beds, rather than climbing over each other at night. It has drawers/cabinets/worktop space at the bedheads for our night time bits and bobs. There's also a decent wardrobe.
However, the mechanics of the base van are starting to show their age, and as we're not particularly mechanically minded (and not enthusiastic about tinkering), we'd like to upgrade again.
One of the downsides of the Talisman is that having the driver and passenger seats as part of the single beds means that making / unmaking of the beds is a slightly long-winded process (even though I've got it down to a fine art), whereby 'im indoors takes the dog for a short walk to give me some space while I swivel chairs and throw seat and backrest cushions around to reconfigure the interior, and optionally fold and store / retrieve and unfold a dog crate (used for travelling), depending on what we're planning to do/have been doing for the day. It's particularly inconvenient if we want to drive anywhere in the evening (or stop off on our way back from a day out), e.g. to go out to eat, and come home feeling ready to just drop into bed, rather than wanting to embark on a minor engineering exercise.
So I'm ready for a slightly easier Motorhoming life. We're finding that we use the dinette layout less and less often, and having done the rounds of some of the Motorhome Shows over the summer, have come to the conclusion that the layout that would suit us better now is a rear U-shaped lounge. That gives us the ability to have two single beds that we can leave made up when we want to, even if we're driving, or to use as sofas for feet-up lounging (we'd probably improvise some sort of bedside table / coffee table / small storage unit / folding dog crate fixings for the bottom bar of the "U"). For us, it would be the next step on the "minimal fuss" path. And having externally accessible storage for the outdoor stuff (whether in a garage or on a bike rack) would add to that.
Unlike even a twin bench + rear kitchen layout that doesn't include the front seats as part of the beds, a rear lounge gives us somewhere to put a dog crate (in the lounge) and still be able to access the rest of the 'van, including the front seats without having to climb over it / squeeze past it. Also, rear lounge models typically have a (small) "garage" under the rear lounge seat, for outside chairs, ramps, hoses, cables, a folding bike, etc. (all things that currently have to travel inside the washroom or other cubbyholes in the Talisman, and mostly need an onsite "shed" when we arrive at our destination); and, of course, the views from the lounge windows are a big attraction, as is being able to see out of the rear window when driving.
Unfortunately, things are complicated by the fact that we have a hard limit of 6.4m in length - the distance from the front wall of the house to the footpath - and even that includes the downpipe from the guttering! And sadly, we don't have unlimited funds
. From the mechanical reliability / newness point of view, we'd be looking at something from 2000 or later (2002 would be even better, as we're close enough to London to potentially sometimes want to camp inside the M25 Low Emission Zone limit). But we won't be able to afford anything much newer than that. The ones I've seen so far would already be above what we'd ideally like to pay, so it seems we'll just have to stretch the budget to get what we want.
There's just the two of us (plus dog), so we only need 2 seatbelts and sleeping space for 2.
We like the Autosleeper monocoques and the tank-like build reputation of the Hymers as being designs that don't tend to have many weak points in seams for damp to get in. And with apologies to members who have them, I'm absolutely not a fan of the bulbous over-cab bump designs. We don't need the overcab height, or the increased wind resistance, and I'm afraid I find them horribly ugly.
Possibilities so far
I like the look of the Hymer B534, approx 6m (I've seen a RHD one advertised, but it had been sold before we could view it, so haven't confirmed the dimensions of the interior, and particularly the lounge seats). The garage access looks impressive. The drop down bed over the cab - and the fact that it drops down much lower than most overcab beds - is appealing. We probably wouldn't use it much, except to store bedding, but options are always good.
The pre-2006(ish) low profile Autocruise StarSpirit (6.15m) looks like another option. A local dealer currently has one in stock, so I'm planning to have a look today. (Newer models are longer.) On the downside, external storage access looks frankly pathetic - not much chance of getting a folding bike in that way!
Somebody elsewhere suggested the Bessacar E465 (6.1m), but I haven't been able to find any low-profile variants, and the corner seams on the roof always feel like a weak point for water ingress to me, which would make me wary of these, even if there were any low profile ones around.
Models that won't work for us (but might for others)
The Autosleepers Rienza that we saw at the Romsey show looked promising ... until I discovered that it's 6.8m long, so won't fit on the drive.
The Autosleepers Ascot at 6.4m is pushing the length right to the limit, and the lounge appears to be J-shaped, rather than U-shaped, so I doubt the shorter leg would be long enough to use as a bed, even for me. (It has a slightly larger kitchen, which takes up the space.)
The Autocruise StarDream (6.65m) is too long to fit on the drive.
The Swift Lifestyle 622 or Escape 622 (6.3m) would be possibilities, but they seem to be too recent for our budget to reach.
Any other ideas?
So, taking all that into account, can anybody suggest any other makes and models that meet our spec that we can search for? Unless anybody has any suggestions that meet all the requirements, I don't really want to get into a discussion about the pros and cons of rear lounges, as I'm pretty clear that that's what will work for us, although I do understand that different people like different things (or there wouldn't be other layouts to choose from).
In summary, our requirements are:
- Coachbuilt/A-class (for the extra bit of width)
- Absolute max 6.4m long (including any folded ladder, bike rack, back box mounting, etc.)
- U-shaped rear lounge suitable to use as two single beds (or two sofas, or for seating at tables)
- Approx 2000-2002 registration year (price vs likely mechanical reliability trade-off)
- No overcab bulge
- Right Hand Drive (we do all our camping in the UK)
Thanks
Julie
