Certificate of Conformity for 2003 or before.

[nicholsong]

I am getting varied answers as to whether Certificates of Conformity were issued for vehicles built as early as 2003.

Does any member have a Certificate of Conformity for a 2003 (or before) vehicle, please?

DVSA have been useless in answering.

Quite urgent.

Thanks in advance.

Geoff

 

[CazPaul]

We were told that Concorde didn't have one for our March 2005 van and it wasn't required anyway to import and register in the UK.

 

[SpeedyDux]

I did obtain a CoC from VW for my 2002 Westy California. It applied to the base vehicle.

 

[nicholsong]

I did obtain a CoC from VW for my 2002 Westy California. It applied to the base vehicle.

But not the conversion? The California conversions were done by VW weren't they?

 

[jongood]

Ive just asked that very question of N&B for the Clou Geoff. The answer is no it didnt have one but they can create one from their record for about £200 and a couple of weeks. Ive gone with CazPaul 's advice and applied to register without it and keeping my fingers crossed because there was an awful lot of blank boxes on the form.

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[nicholsong]

Ive just asked that very question of N&B for the Clou Geoff. The answer is no it didnt have one but they can create one from their record for about £200 and a couple of weeks. Ive gone with CazPaul 's advice and applied to register without it and keeping my fingers crossed because there was an awful lot of blank boxes on the form.

Thanks Jon.

Did N&B tell you that you would have to apply for their document through a dealer? Who gave tyou that info?

What year is the Clou?

Geoff

 

[CazPaul]

Ive just asked that very question of N&B for the Clou Geoff. The answer is no it didnt have one but they can create one from their record for about £200 and a couple of weeks. Ive gone with CazPaul 's advice and applied to register without it and keeping my fingers crossed because there was an awful lot of blank boxes on the form.

Sure you will be fine Jon, Niesmann were more helpful than Concorde then, it was a straight NO for me although as I say not required in the end, but who knows with the dvla, they tell one person one thing and the next another.

 

[gus-lopez]

EU legislation is quite clear in that if a vehicle has been registered in any other member state then it cannot be asked to provide all sorts of old tat they think up.The requirement is that it was all legally done when registered in the 1st or any subsequent state.


Here;

Article 4 is what has been through case law in ECJ.
https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/HTML/?uri=CELEX:52012PC0164&from=EN

 

[SpeedyDux]

But not the conversion? The California conversions were done by VW weren't they?

The base vehicle for my 2002 California would have been a LHD VW T4 Caravelle originally, converted by Westfalia which in those days was a joint venture with Mercedes. Westfalia had been converting VWs since 1952.

The factory California conversion by VW themselves was on the VW T5 from about 2005 onwards. The conversion quality wasn't as good IMO.

 

[nicholsong]

EU legislation is quite clear in that if a vehicle has been registered in any other member state then it cannot be asked to provide all sorts of old tat they think up.The requirement is that it was all legally done when registered in the 1st or any subsequent state.


Here;

Article 4 is what has been through case law in ECJ.
https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/HTML/?uri=CELEX:52012PC0164&from=EN

Gus

Great. Thanks.

That was the proposal. Where can I find when it was adopted and the case law you refer to, please?

Geoff

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[Captain Yoghurtpot]

Not sure if I understand this correctly, but what is the significance of a certificate of conformity?
My vehicle is a 2000/2001 Italian built to UK r/h drive spec and has a v5 which all seems correct,despite a few boxes not being filled in on it.
Am I missing something.
Genuinely interested and not looking to be argumentative or confrontentual.
Am I worrying unduly?
Thanks

 

[CazPaul]

Not sure if I understand this correctly, but what is the significance of a certificate of conformity?
My vehicle is a 2000/2001 Italian built to UK r/h drive spec and has a v5 which all seems correct,despite a few boxes not being filled in on it.
Am I missing something.
Genuinely interested and not looking to be argumentative or confrontentual.
Am I worrying unduly?
Thanks

No, don't worry, see my posts above.

 

[funflair]

Not sure if I understand this correctly, but what is the significance of a certificate of conformity?
My vehicle is a 2000/2001 Italian built to UK r/h drive spec and has a v5 which all seems correct,despite a few boxes not being filled in on it.
Am I missing something.
Genuinely interested and not looking to be argumentative or confrontentual.
Am I worrying unduly?
Thanks

Its only a potential issue for people registering vehicles from abroad so no "don'y worry"

 

[eurajohn]

Despite what some may think or suggest, if you are trying to register a vehicle in a country that was not its original point of registration, you will need to conform to their requirements.
If you do not they will refuse registration and you'll not get registration documents or number plates.
Fiat will supply CoC for the base vehicle, if you have an Alko chassis extension, Alko will supply a CoC for their part and N&B will supply a CoC for the conversion.
They will all charge, usually an amount that seems exorbitant for an A4 sized document but if you wish to be legal in the country you are resident in you'll just need to pay.
I've followed the procedure a few times in France.
I can confirm that one of the vehicles was originally registered in the UK in 2001, so possible for one of 2003.

 

[CazPaul]

Despite what some may think or suggest, if you are trying to register a vehicle in a country that was not its original point of registration, you will need to conform to their requirements.
If you do not they will refuse registration and you'll not get registration documents or number plates.
Fiat will supply CoC for the base vehicle, if you have an Alko chassis extension, Alko will supply a CoC for their part and N&B will supply a CoC for the conversion.
They will all charge, usually an amount that seems exorbitant for an A4 sized document but if you wish to be legal in the country you are resident in you'll just need to pay.
I've followed the procedure a few times in France.
I can confirm that one of the vehicles was originally registered in the UK in 2001, so possible for one of 2003.

Well despite what you say John I was informed by the DVLA that a CoC was not required and my registration in the UK in March 2018 went through quickly with no issues. All documents V5 and registration number issued quickly.

Ironically as it happened Concorde said they would not provide me with one, van registered in Germany March 2005. Both myself and the dealer in Germany, Lundberg reisemobile approached Concorde and were informed the same. If registration had been refused without a CoC then whether I could have gone back to Concorde I don't know but not required so it became irrelevant.

I am not going on what I think or suggest but the facts of what happened and what DVLA informed me of in April 2018.

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[eurajohn]

Well despite what you say John I was informed by the DVLA that a CoC was not required and my registration in the UK in March 2018 went through quickly with no issues. All documents V5 and registration number issued quickly.

Ironically as it happened Concorde said they would not provide me with one, van registered in Germany March 2005. Both myself and the dealer in Germany, Lundberg reisemobile approached Concorde and were informed the same. If registration had been refused without a CoC then whether I could have gone back to Concorde I don't know but not required so it became irrelevant.

I am not going on what I think or suggest but the facts of what happened and what DVLA informed me of in April 2018.

If you care to look my reply was specifically to do with "foreign" registration with no reference to DVLA registrations.
Like you I am not going on what I think or suggest but the facts of what happened when registering a motorhome in France Europe.
The OP is I believe trying to register in Poland a currently registered in UK N&B motorhome.

 

[nicholsong]

If you care to look my reply was specifically to do with "foreign" registration with no reference to DVLA registrations.
Like you I am not going on what I think or suggest but the facts of what happened when registering a motorhome in France Europe.
The OP is I believe trying to register in Poland a currently registered in UK N&B motorhome.

This is the reason and the registration authority publish a list of required documents which included CofC.

Unfortunately the list refers to all documents required, whether for EU or non-EU registered vehicles, but does not differentiate and clarification has been impossible, because since Covid the telephone has been constantly engaged.

gus-lopez may have the solution in post #8, but I have asked him for further details.

Geoff

 

[jongood]

Thanks Jon.

Did N&B tell you that you would have to apply for their document through a dealer? Who gave tyou that info?

What year is the Clou?

Geoff

Polch found out about it but I would have to purchase through TW

Clou is 2003, have a look at the 'our new baby' thread in n&b section....

 

[eurajohn]

This is the reason and the registration authority publish a list of required documents which included CofC.

Unfortunately the list refers to all documents required, whether for EU or non-EU registered vehicles, but does not differentiate and clarification has been impossible, because since Covid the telephone has been constantly engaged.

gus-lopez may have the solution in post #8, but I have asked him for further details.

Geoff

I wonder if the UK being officially an ex member of the EU will have any bearing on the content of that document?
If Poland is anything like France, unless you comply with their demands you don't get your vehicle registered, no matter what the EU says.

 

[nicholsong]

I wonder if the UK being officially an ex member of the EU will have any bearing on the content of that document?
If Poland is anything like France, unless you comply with their demands you don't get your vehicle registered, no matter what the EU says.

I am no arguing against that.

It is just that there are two unknowns

If Poland wants a COC and N&B, being the only outfit that can issue one, say that there was not one fr a Arto (2003) then what do I do?

Secondly, I do not know if they will accept the UK registration as evidence my vehicle conforms, and cannot reach them for an answer.

Geoff

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[gus-lopez]

Gus

Great. Thanks.

That was the proposal. Where can I find when it was adopted and the case law you refer to, please?

Geoff

No idea Geoff ,You will have to hunt it down via google by country.

If you care to look my reply was specifically to do with "foreign" registration with no reference to DVLA registrations.

& CazPaul was re-registering a foreign vehicle in the UK

If Poland is anything like France, unless you comply with their demands you don't get your vehicle registered, no matter what the EU says.

That's the one beauty of here. The"hojas de reclamacion " combined with an official complaint via the EU using SOLVIT & anything else you can find.

 

[eurajohn]

I am no arguing against that.

It is just that there are two unknowns

If Poland wants a COC and N&B, being the only outfit that can issue one, say that there was not one fr a Arto (2003) then what do I do?

Secondly, I do not know if they will accept the UK registration as evidence my vehicle conforms, and cannot reach them for an answer.

Geoff

Geoff in France if you cannot supply the documentation they require it is possible to apply for a single type approval, this involves a full inspection of the vehicle to confirm that it fully complies with the requirements of the country.
The inspection is carried out by the relevant body and so long as your vehicle conforms they issue the necessary documents for registration.
It is rather costly though and it is a FULL inspection.
Perhaps they have a similar system in Poland?

 

[eurajohn]

& CazPaul was re-registering a foreign vehicle in the UK

Yes but the original question and my reply was relevant to mainland Europe and not what the UK DVLA did or didn't require.

 

[CazPaul]

Yes but the original question and my reply was relevant to mainland Europe and not what the UK DVLA did or didn't require.

Have a read of the original question again, nowhere does it mention mainland Europe in fact almost everyone would think Geoff was importing into the UK from his question.

 

[nicholsong]

Geoff in France if you cannot supply the documentation they require it is possible to apply for a single type approval, this involves a full inspection of the vehicle to confirm that it fully complies with the requirements of the country.
The inspection is carried out by the relevant body and so long as your vehicle conforms they issue the necessary documents for registration.
It is rather costly though and it is a FULL inspection.
Perhaps they have a similar system in Poland?

We do not know yet and cannot yet find out.

Geoff

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[eurajohn]

Have a read of the original question again, nowhere does it mention mainland Europe in fact almost everyone would think Geoff was importing into the UK from his question.

Apologies, I was aware of Geoff's predicament from another forum and knew from that he was trying to register his van in Poland.

 

[nicholsong]

THE FINAL SOLUTION

We have now established that in Poland the CofC is only required for registering a new vehicle. This has been confirmed by member 'Rubyoptics', who successfully re-registered his previously german-registered MH this morning.

Like other items on the official government website containing the registration requirements, it is not made clear in which circumstances which documents are required. Not helpful.

I am sorry for you people re-registering in France, which seems to be more onerous - well, 'administration' is a French word!

Thanks to all for your replies.

Geoff