Will we (our van) be allowed back into Schengen. (1 Viewer)

[Phill D]

Not sure what you mean by 'Polish' vehicle registration? I do carry the V5, unfortunately, it is not the original. The Romanian customs officer said it was fine to enter Ro on a copy certificate but Hungary does not. Ironically, all my other documents such as conformality certificate, insurance docs, proof of vehicle ownership (receipt) are all originals.

Raul was asking / refering to Nickolsong not yourself

 

[royandsharont]

...now there's a thought, thanks for your response. I know what you mean regarding the documents, I think I'm paying the price of being too efficient and getting things in hand (or so I thought!) too long before the trip. I didn't like carrying the original V5 with me for security reasons but I think I will in future. It's also easy to get too complacent because I've never been asked for it before, albeit that is in Schengen. I should have known better though and a bit annoyed with myself.

As far as I am aware it has always been the case that you legally must carry the original V5 outside the U.K. it’s a shame you’re in this position now. I carry the original plus a laminated copy to hand over for inspection in the hope they’d accept that rather than hand over the original. Never been asked for it anywhere

 

[Raul]

You can meet various border officers. Some will throw the book at you, some will be very forgiving. I have been travelling from UK to Ro regularly in the past 22 years, and many countries in between. About an year and half ago, me and my wife was exiting Ro into Hu. The guy went trough all documents inclusive MOT. He stated to drive in Ro the vehicle requires to have a valid MOT, no matter what I tried, ask mid, he pull us over and law and behold I found the mot stapled to a invoice we had done with a service before we left UK. It will not let me cross out. And I speak the language.
It’s better to be prepared then argue with a fool, you will loose. Same for missing stamps, my wife was not stamped out of Hu as She holds a resident permit in Ro. The nasty guy would not stamp us in Hu, as she hasn’t got a stamp out and claimed she overstayed, despite showing the resident permit for Ro. There are lots of border staff in the East loving to push their position of power, and intimidate you and make your life hell. Been there, now I make sure I’m covered and give them no reasons to cling on anything.

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[jennywren]

Raul was asking / refering to Nickolsong not yourself

Yes, I realise that now, many thanks for your advice.

 

[jennywren]

You can meet various border officers. Some will throw the book at you, some will be very forgiving. I have been travelling from UK to Ro regularly in the past 22 years, and many countries in between. About an year and half ago, me and my wife was exiting Ro into Hu. The guy went trough all documents inclusive MOT. He stated to drive in Ro the vehicle requires to have a valid MOT, no matter what I tried, ask mid, he pull us over and law and behold I found the mot stapled to a invoice we had done with a service before we left UK. It will not let me cross out. And I speak the language.
It’s better to be prepared then argue with a fool, you will loose. Same for missing stamps, my wife was not stamped out of Hu as She holds a resident permit in Ro. The nasty guy would not stamp us in Hu, as she hasn’t got a stamp out and claimed she overstayed, despite showing the resident permit for Ro. There are lots of border staff in the East loving to push their position of power, and intimidate you and make your life hell. Been there, now I make sure I’m covered and give them no reasons to cling on anything.

Thanks Raul. Great advice and I whole heartedly agree, infact, I generally put this into practice but on this occasion, its something I have overlooked. Annoyingly, I have originals with me for everything else, sod's law I think! I guess, it adds to the excitement of travel! From your experience/opinion, is it likely I will be asked for the original (rather than the copy I have with me) going into Bulgaria/Moldova/N Macedonia/Serbia. The only reason I ask is that it could affect our itinerary/timing of where to have the original sent to.

 

[Raul]

Thanks Raul. Great advice and I whole heartedly agree, infact, I generally put this into practice but on this occasion, its something I have overlooked. Annoyingly, I have originals with me for everything else, sod's law I think! I guess, it adds to the excitement of travel! From your experience/opinion, is it likely I will be asked for the original (rather than the copy I have with me) going into Bulgaria/Moldova/N Macedonia/Serbia. The only reason I ask is that it could affect our itinerary/timing of where to have the original sent to.

Out of Ro into BG yes definitely, into MD 100%, and advise to stay away from Danube region in current times. Mid Moldova to north it’s ok, crossing at Iasi. I personally I would give it a miss for the time being. N Macedonia don’t know, Serbia, full papers again, and insurance at the border if your insurance don’t cover it. Mine didn’t.

I sent you a PM.

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[jennywren]

As far as I am aware it has always been the case that you legally must carry the original V5 outside the U.K. it’s a shame you’re in this position now. I carry the original plus a laminated copy to hand over for inspection in the hope they’d accept that rather than hand over the original. Never been asked for it anywhere

Out of Ro into BG yes definitely, into MD 100%, and advise to stay away from Danube region in current times. Mid Moldova to north it’s ok, crossing at Iasi. I personally I would give it a miss for the time being. N Macedonia don’t know, Serbia, full papers again, and insurance at the border if your insurance don’t cover it. Mine didn’t.

I sent you a PM.

Thanks Raul, I have replied to your PM, very much appreciated.

 

[nicholsong]

Do you not carry your Polish vehicle registration with you when you travel?

I know for sure Ro and Hu law requires you to have the vehicle registration document with you, or they can seize the vehicle until you can produce one. This applies to all national and foreign vehicles. The fine is on the spot, and nationals can produce it to a local police station later with the ticket. Nobody drives without the vehicle registration, even in EU. Only us Brits.

My post was answering the question posed in the thread title about what document was needed to cross into Schengen, not what the police may ask for.

We no longer carry our registration documents in our vehicles in Poland as that requirement has been dropped, but we do elsewhere.

 

[jennywren]

I have always understood that the Schengen Agreement only pertains to the movement of people. While Bulgaria is not yet a Member of Schengen, but Greece is, you will probably be subject to a passport check, but as long as you are within the 90/180 day rule entry to Greece on UK passports should be no problem.

Since Bulgaria and Greece are EU countries there should be no restriction on the MH crossing, so acceptance of V5c or a copy should not arise.

This may be correct in theory (but I am uncertain whether it is?) but Hungary is also EU/Schengen and I am told by the Customs officer at Hu/Ro crossing that Hungary will accept only the original V5. Whether or not Ro/BG, BG/Greece is the same, I don't know, maybe it's as fickle as the customs officer on duty at the time. From our current dilemma, I would, however, suggest to others to carry original V5 with the van all the time outside UK, definitely outside of EU/Schengen and probably inside as well. This is just my opinion based on experience (current!) and to reduce potential hassles, whether prescriptive legal requirements or not. I have driven abroad for 40+ years in my own car/other peoples cars/motorhome/hire cars etc and never been asked for the V5, let alone, demand it must be the original. And, sheer naievity, probably meant I had no documents, whatsoever, for many of those journeys. But from now on, I will definitely be carrying the original with me and even proof of ownership (which I currently have, anyway!). Just a thought, hope it helps others.

Cheers

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[nicholsong]

This may be correct in theory (but I am uncertain whether it is?) but Hungary is also EU/Schengen and I am told by the Customs officer at Hu/Ro crossing that Hungary will accept only the original V5. Whether or not Ro/BG, BG/Greece is the same, I don't know, maybe it's as fickle as the customs officer on duty at the time. From our current dilemma, I would, however, suggest to others to carry original V5 with the van all the time outside UK, definitely outside of EU/Schengen and probably inside as well. This is just my opinion based on experience (current!) and to reduce potential hassles, whether prescriptive legal requirements or not. I have driven abroad for 40+ years in my own car/other peoples cars/motorhome/hire cars etc and never been asked for the V5, let alone, demand it must be the original. And, sheer naievity, probably meant I had no documents, whatsoever, for many of those journeys. But from now on, I will definitely be carrying the original with me and even proof of ownership (which I currently have, anyway!). Just a thought, hope it helps others.

Cheers

I accept what is your current experience, but I do not understand why there would be a customs officer at the Romanian-Hungary border, between two EU countries allowing free movement of goods.

We drive Poland-Germany-Luxembourg-Belgium-Netherlands-France-Spain-Slowakia-Austria-Italy-Greece and never encounter a border post that is manned.

 

[jennywren]

I accept what is your current experience, but I do not understand why there would be a customs officer at the Romanian-Hungary border, between two EU countries allowing free movement of goods.

We drive Poland-Germany-Luxembourg-Belgium-Netherlands-France-Spain-Slowakia-Austria-Italy-Greece and never encounter a border post that is manned.

This is because the countries you have listed are all schengen to schengen. . Romania/Bulgaria is not Schengen (at present!) but is EU. Serbia for example is neither. Whether or not, they are EU is not necessarily relevantThe crossings to Ro/BG/Serbia etc etc are manned all the time as 'free movement' does not apply. Picture of Customs post at Hu/Ro, all persons/vehicles must stop and be checked. We queued for 2/3hrs to get through, finally doing so near midnight. There is free movement within Schengen, not automatically within EU.

 

[nicholsong]

This is because the countries you have listed are all schengen to schengen. . Romania/Bulgaria is not Schengen (at present!) but is EU. Serbia for example is neither. Whether or not, they are EU is not necessarily relevantThe crossings to Ro/BG/Serbia etc etc are manned all the time as 'free movement' does not apply. Picture of Customs post at Hu/Ro, all persons/vehicles must stop and be checked. We queued for 2/3hrs to get through, finally doing so near midnight. There is free movement within Schengen, not automatically within EU.

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I accept that Non-Schengen to Schengen needs an Immigration Officer to check documents of people, but passage of goods, incl. MH, between EU countries should not require a Customs check, so repeat why is there a customs officer?

But thanks for the warning to keep away from those borders - wastes good drinking time.

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[jennywren]

Well, from experience and that of others, I can assure you, the border post into non schengen is generally, manned. Your earlier post suggests that all EU/EU border posts are not manned. This is not the case if one of them is non schengen.

As I have suggested before, it is your choice, but I would strongly suggest that when travelling to non schengen (whether EU or not), you carry a V5 as you may well be asked to produce it. And even consider carry the V5 when going to any country outside UK, albeit, unlikely to be asked for it.

 

[nicholsong]

Well, from experience and that of others, I can assure you, the border post into non schengen is generally, manned. Your earlier post suggests that all EU/EU border posts are not manned. This is not the case if one of them is non schengen.

As I have suggested before, it is your choice, but I would strongly suggest that when travelling to non schengen (whether EU or not), you carry a V5 as you may well be asked to produce it. And even consider carry the V5 when going to any country outside UK, albeit, unlikely to be asked for it.

Well, from experience and that of others, I can assure you, the border post into non schengen is generally, manned. Your earlier post suggests that all EU/EU border posts are not manned. This is not the case if one of them is non schengen.

As I have suggested before, it is your choice, but I would strongly suggest that when travelling to non schengen (whether EU or not), you carry a V5 as you may well be asked to produce it. And even consider carry the V5 when going to any country outside UK, albeit, unlikely to be asked for it.

You seem to be missing my distinction between the movement of 'people' to which Schengen refers and that of 'goods' to which it does not and where 'free movement' applies under EU rules.

As I said, I have accepted that entry into Schengen countries requires Immigration checks, but I query why if the two countries are EU there should be customs checks. Therefore there should be no need to produce documentation for 'goods', including a MH.

You are also confusing the discussion by discussing entry into non-Schengen countries, whereas the original post was entry into Schengen countries.

I think I have stated my views sufficiently and nobody has contradicted my understanding in my original post.

I will leave it at that.

 

[jennywren]

You seem to be missing my distinction between the movement of 'people' to which Schengen refers and that of 'goods' to which it does not and where 'free movement' applies under EU rules.

As I said, I have accepted that entry into Schengen countries requires Immigration checks, but I query why if the two countries are EU there should be customs checks. Therefore there should be no need to produce documentation for 'goods', including a MH.

You are also confusing the discussion by discussing entry into non-Schengen countries, whereas the original post was entry into Schengen countries.

I think I have stated my views sufficiently and nobody has contradicted my understanding in my original post.

I will leave it at that.

I do not believe I am missing any point, please re-read your threads. I am just high-lighting the actual situation on the ground.

I agree we are going in circles and you need that time for a few more drinks!

On that note, Cheers, and don't forget to carry that V5c (original) with you, I believe you said you do anyway.

Now, I'm onto DHL to sort out getting the document sent out, albeit, that seems quite simple.

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[jongood]

Can anyone offer advice from there experience/knowledge. We have just spent our first night in Romania, having crossed from Hungary last night at the Satu Mare crossing. We had no problems getting through customs (albeit the 'brexit' queue took at least two hours) but we were advised by the Romanian customs control officer (at the booth) that Hungary will not accept our photocopy V5 document on our return. We are not intending to return to Schengen Zone via Hungary, but intend to return to Greece (via a combination of Bulgaria and/or North Macedonia). The helpful Romanian Customs officer admitted he did not know the stance Greece would take but assured me that Hungary will accept nothing short of original V5 (which I do not have on me). From further questioning, he appeared to be unsure whether this was a Schengen thing or a Hungary thing.

So my question is, does anyone have experience/knowledge crossing from Bulgaria to Greece (or N. Macedonia to Greece) and whether or not, they require evidence of the V5 document ond if so does this have to be an original. I know its my mistake, I should have brought the original, but up until now, travelling within Schengen, we have never been asked for the V5. I did not think to swap the copy version for the original before leaving home.

We shall probably spend about 3 weeks in Romania so I do have time to get the original posted out but unfortunately, Romania does not offer a 'Poste Restante' service. Greece does but ideally we need the document prior to entering Greece, unless one of us crosses prematurely without the van. So, if anyone knows of a way to have the V5 sent to somewhere in Romania that we can collect from, that would be appreciated too. One option is a campsite but this may not be easy to arrange in advance given language barrier etc.

Any help with this conundrum would be appreciated, many thanks in advance.

Jenn

What on earth has this to do with Brexit? You ve not taken the correct documents, its no one else fault

 

[jennywren]

What on earth has this to do with Brexit? You ve not taken the correct documents, its no one else fault

I did not say, it had anything to do with brexit. Please read it. I used the word brexit 'tongue in cheek' (yes, I am anti brexit but that is another story). I was merely making the point that if I was in the EU queue, I would have been through in a matter of minutes. The non eu/all-passports queue took close on 3 hours. Nothing to do with whether I had the correct paperwork or not, as it happens, not having the original copy of V5c did not affect going into Romania. It was just highlighted to me that it may have implications going into BG/Greece/Serbia etc and definitely will if coming back through Hungary (which we are not).

I have never suggested I was not at fault for not bringing the original V5c (I only brought a copy), I admitted my mistake/stupidity on numerous occasions. I believe you have either mis-read the post or you are over looking my tongue in cheek comments about Brexit.

Your comments are irrelevant and not helpful in my opinion. Especially, as I would like to think, this thread may be a reminder to those of us that forget to take original documents or choose not to. Sometimes, it can be amusing (to some of us at least!) to see the funny side of life, hence, my reference to brexit. Sorry if that was missed by you.

 

[jongood]

I did not say, it had anything to do with brexit. Please read it. I used the word brexit 'tongue in cheek' (yes, I am anti brexit but that is another story). I was merely making the point that if I was in the EU queue, I would have been through in a matter of minutes. The non eu/all-passports queue took close on 3 hours. Nothing to do with whether I had the correct paperwork or not, as it happens, not having the original copy of V5c did not affect going into Romania. It was just highlighted to me that it may have implications going into BG/Greece/Serbia etc and definitely will if coming back through Hungary (which we are not).

I have never suggested I was not at fault for not bringing the original V5c (I only brought a copy), I admitted my mistake/stupidity on numerous occasions. I believe you have either mis-read the post or you are over looking my tongue in cheek comments about Brexit.

Your comments are irrelevant and not helpful in my opinion. Especially, as I would like to think, this thread may be a reminder to those of us that forget to take original documents or choose not to. Sometimes, it can be amusing (to some of us at least!) to see the funny side of life, hence, my reference to brexit. Sorry if that was missed by you.

Then why mention it? political posts are banned on here. I am quite good at seeing the funny side, whereas this thread seems to be turning into one long rant. I'm not really surprised that your having trouble at borders.

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[jennywren]

Then why mention it? political posts are banned on here. I am quite good at seeing the funny side, whereas this thread seems to be turning into one long rant. I'm not really surprised that your having trouble at borders.

No problems at borders, so far at least. It's not political (refer to many threads on here with the b word). It's just 'motorhome fun' and it's reality. Let's just have a laugh when we can. All the best

 

[jennywren]

Thanks to everyone who offered sound help and advice. Hopefully, now all sorted, at least if DHL perform to their word. The upside is that we are now spending a couple of extra days in this part of Romania (Marameres) awaiting delivery of said document, making friends with the locals and enjoying the idyllic scenery and traditional villages and way of life, loving it!

The odd hiccup certainly adds to a memorable trip.

However, I won't be not packing the original V5c document in a hurry again, I hope!

Cheers to all

 

[Raul]

Maramures, lots to see and do there, (mocanita)steam train with a view, in Borsa you can take a cable car up the mountain (Rodna national park) , then walk up to the horses water fall.
Then from Borsa, take the winding road towards Carlibaba, into Suceava county and you will be spoiled. It’s Bucovina region, the most history and tradition reach part of all Romania. Suceava the old Citadel of Steven the great, 40 monasteries of various significance.
Or if you head south towards Bistrita Nasaud, don’t miss Colibita dam/ lake. Full of places to stay towards the top, treat yourself to fresh trout if you like it.
Bucovina it’s a must, if you are already in Maramures. You will not regret it.

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[Nanniemate]

Thanks to everyone who offered sound help and advice. Hopefully, now all sorted, at least if DHL perform to their word. The upside is that we are now spending a couple of extra days in this part of Romania (Marameres) awaiting delivery of said document, making friends with the locals and enjoying the idyllic scenery and traditional villages and way of life, loving it!

The odd hiccup certainly adds to a memorable trip.

However, I won't be not packing the original V5c document in a hurry again, I hope!

Cheers to all

You have to let us know it's arrived safely looks like being stuck in that area not a bad thing according to Raul

 

[jennywren]

Maramures, lots to see and do there, (mocanita)steam train with a view, in Borsa you can take a cable car up the mountain (Rodna national park) , then walk up to the horses water fall.
Then from Borsa, take the winding road towards Carlibaba, into Suceava county and you will be spoiled. It’s Bucovina region, the most history and tradition reach part of all Romania. Suceava the old Citadel of Steven the great, 40 monasteries of various significance.
Or if you head south towards Bistrita Nasaud, don’t miss Colibita dam/ lake. Full of places to stay towards the top, treat yourself to fresh trout if you like it.
Bucovina it’s a must, if you are already in Maramures. You will not regret it.

Thanks Raul, really kind of you to offer your suggestions. As it happens, we are currently on top Prislop Pass where we shall stay tonight, beautiful, and a little cooler, which is also a welcome relief. Then heading a bit further east tomorrow. Some very good mountain biking and trekking to some of the nearby Carpathian tops. Have also been enjoying the monasteries and churches and probably above all else, the very pretty countryside. Depending on DHL tracking advice, we may return to Oncesti as per your suggestion of Bistrita Nasaud or do a slightly larger loop. Once our document has been delivered, we will then head south easterly to Lasi (possibly Moldova) before going west to Brasov, Sighisoara, Sibiu, Trans....... road etc etc. This latter bit may be a little more busy so glad we are having the extra time in Maramures and Bucovina that has been fairly quiet so far.

Thanks again.

​

 

[gus-lopez]

What on earth has this to do with Brexit? You ve not taken the correct documents, its no one else fault

They wouldn't be in a queue.

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[Raul]

Thanks Raul, really kind of you to offer your suggestions. As it happens, we are currently on top Prislop Pass where we shall stay tonight, beautiful, and a little cooler, which is also a welcome relief. Then heading a bit further east tomorrow. Some very good mountain biking and trekking to some of the nearby Carpathian tops. Have also been enjoying the monasteries and churches and probably above all else, the very pretty countryside. Depending on DHL tracking advice, we may return to Oncesti as per your suggestion of Bistrita Nasaud or do a slightly larger loop. Once our document has been delivered, we will then head south easterly to Lasi (possibly Moldova) before going west to Brasov, Sighisoara, Sibiu, Trans....... road etc etc. This latter bit may be a little more busy so glad we are having the extra time in Maramures and Bucovina that has been fairly quiet so far.

Thanks again.

​

If you are on Prislop pas , follow that road to Carlibaba. At main road follow the European Rd towards Cimpulung Moldovenesc, but not all the way there yet. At Pojorita turn right into Trans Rarau, it’s a road that takes you up on Rarau mountain. Only accessible in summer. Very touristic but nice, lots of restaurants and god food, most menus in that area are in English to. The resort at the top it’s worth the visit, and the Lady’s Stones (Pietrele Doamnei), it’s a walk from the resort. Breath taking views. Couple of years ago I stubbed across a couple from California in there with a hired Motorhome from Bucharest. They needed fuel as they missed the garage.

 

[jennywren]

If you are on Prislop pas , follow that road to Carlibaba. At main road follow the European Rd towards Cimpulung Moldovenesc, but not all the way there yet. At Pojorita turn right into Trans Rarau, it’s a road that takes you up on Rarau mountain. Only accessible in summer. Very touristic but nice, lots of restaurants and god food, most menus in that area are in English to. The resort at the top it’s worth the visit, and the Lady’s Stones (Pietrele Doamnei), it’s a walk from the resort. Breath taking views. Couple of years ago I stubbed across a couple from California in there with a hired Motorhome from Bucharest. They needed fuel as they missed the garage.

Will definitely take a look at that, thanks, it's like having our own personal tour guide, much appreciated.