Hymer B544 Corrosion to front subframe mounting

Discussion in 'Tech/Mech General' started by Dave and Ginny, Jan 23, 2015.

  1. Dave and Ginny

    Dave and Ginny Funster

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    Well I thought the old girl had gone through the MOT once again with no issues, but it seems that my initial delight was premature!

    Not had a chance to look myself yet as getting a bit to dark, but apparently there is some corrosion on or about the front subframe mounting. It's on the MOT certificate as:

    'Front subframe mounting prescribed area is corroded but not considered excessive'.

    I usually find an advisory becomes a repair needed the following year! Forewarned is forearmed as they say, any Hymer owners out there had anything simialr or any idea what this might entail?

    Cheers Dave
     
  2. Ed Earl

    Ed Earl Funster Life Member

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    Is it the sub frame under the radiator with the towing eye on it.

    If it is you can replace it yourself. It is just bolted on and not part of the chasis, it I'd held on with 3 bolts either side. I got one from Breaker Yard.com £75 delivered to the door in very good condition, and did it my self.
     
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  3. Dave and Ginny

    Dave and Ginny Funster

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    I don't think so Ed, I should have enquired a bit more before coming away :rolleyes: I'll have a look tomorrow in the cold light of day!
     
  4. Jim

    Jim Ringleader

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    And a good Job you made of it Ed (y)
     
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  5. Dave and Ginny

    Dave and Ginny Funster

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    I'm thinking it has to be the cross member, it's a Fiat chassis, they don't have sub-frames do they?
     
  6. Ed Earl

    Ed Earl Funster Life Member

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    Yes David it is the cross member our van is a 2000 Fiat.
     
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  7. pappajohn

    pappajohn Funster Life Member

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  8. kaasbroodje

    kaasbroodje Funster

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    I was under the impression that the front cross member was not part of the MOT test ? So might be elsewhere ??

    Agree that cross member is an easy fix, I bought a new replacement from ebay for around £75. I gave it a good coat of Hammerite to protect it before fitting.
     
  9. Dave and Ginny

    Dave and Ginny Funster

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    You know whats it like being in the reception of the dealer, (it was SMC Motorhomes Newark) people around, phones ringing etc, apparently if,(whatever it is), needs doing, it's about a days work? I dunno, I'll have a look under tomorrow and see if anything shows up.
     
  10. dave newell lvs

    dave newell lvs Trader-Vehicle Services

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    The front cross member is NOT the subframe! The subframe carries the suspension and engine/gearbox assemblies and is bolted to the body from underneath. I'd hazard a guess that there is some surface corrosion around the subframe mounting areas which is not uncommon. Whether it needs repair or not will depend on how bad it is, like as not a wire brush off and coat with new paint and waxoyl will suffice.

    My experience of MOTs these days is the majority pass but to cover themselves a lot of tester pick advisories just to demonstrate they're looking closely. A current tester recently told me they are now taught to "pass and advise".

    D.
     
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  11. mikekaren2

    mikekaren2 Funster

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    Here you go, I copied this a while ago for my file as I also have a Hymer.

    CROSS MEMBER

    Firstly one needs to gather all the gear necessary to carry out the operation.
    1. Blocks to catch each end of the member
    2. 18mm and 17mm sockets with a large socket bar to undo 6 bolts holding the member in place plus the one single bolt holding the plastic cover on the off side, no need to take off the cover, just move it to one side slightly to get at the member bolt.
    3. Remove cables from clips on top of the member
    4. Fit a support, in my case a 2" wooden pole, across the the 2 wings, with cushion under to allow support for the radiator.
    5. I used a 1" strap with ratchet, to cradle the radiator for support, once the member had been removed.
    6. Remove the 17mm bolt from the plastic cover on the off side.
    7. Remove 2 bolts each side holding the cross member, the remaining 2 loosen down to almost a couple of threads, make sure above the member there are no cables attached, take out final single bolt and lay member on blocks at that end, remove final bolt and remove member out of chassis.
    8. You may find that the rubber bushes at the bottom of the radiator may come out with the old member, don't worry they can be installed with new unit. Having removed the old member look how the clips fasten and do a little practicing to ease re cabling when new member has been fitted.
    9. Check radiator rubber bushes are in place, smear a little 'shower gel' around holes that takes the bushes to ease fitting and generally check all pipes in that area for wear, in my case I found a rad hose with some wear on the outside, I taped that area to reduce any problems in the future.
    10. Slide new member in place and sit one end on blocks, the other end insert one bolt, make sure you have oiled the threads to aid tightening. Insert another bolt at the other end and remove blocks. Insert all bolts and gently tighten making sure rad rubber bushers are in place and no wiring above the member is trapped. Finally tighten up all bolts very tightly and then fit all cables etc into clips above the member. Remove radiator supporting strap. Spin the fan blades by hand to ensure nothing is trapping the movement.

    For normal operation to complete its approx 3 hours, in a garage with pit obviously a lot less, say 2 hours.

    This is not a difficult job even for the faint hearted as long as you are between 18 and 80 years old.
     
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  12. pappajohn

    pappajohn Funster Life Member

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    Agreed Dave.

    My RV has a standing advisory...."this vehicle is fitted with type approved seatbelts"

    Been noted for the last two tests......Bloody pointless and annoying.
     
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  13. MikeD

    MikeD Funster

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    I think such comments might have come from the something that has occurred in the world of old motorcycles and MOT's.

    Whilst they have no brakes or often no lights they always passed the MOT without comment or advisories.

    The government decided (and thank you very much from someone who owned a couple) that as they never fail the MOT or receive any advisories that they no longer need to be MOT'ed.

    I suspect the industry is now insuring that they don't lose any more work. :rolleyes::)
     
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  14. mjltigger

    mjltigger Funster

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    This isn't always the case.. the Mondeo has had advisories on lipped rear discs for the past 2 years and I've checked myself, decided they aren't a problem and ignored it. I'm betting they will be advisories again this year too.. they also gave me an advisory last time in being unable to test a seatbelt due to a child car seat.. sounds sensible until you notice the seat in question is actually just a booster cushion..
     
  15. Dave and Ginny

    Dave and Ginny Funster

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    Thanks for all the replies, in particular Dave, and Mike for the detailed cross member replacement should it be needed. I'll get myself out there tomorrow morning and have a good look. If it's not sufficiently bad to result in a failure then maybe it is something that I can tidy up with wire brush, some paint and a waxoil. Cheers all.
     
    Last edited: Jan 23, 2015
  16. westy77

    westy77 Funster

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    If it's a Fiat front crossmember I think they start rusting before they are made!
     
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  17. Carol

    Carol Funster Life Member

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    If you don't do it your radiator could slip or get damaged when Ed did ours it looked a lot stronger.
     
  18. mitzimad

    mitzimad Funster

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    mot stations are up against the stats a station that was passing an abnormal number of vehicles would be a target for the mot police so they will be adding advisories and failures to keep there figure right ive been failed and then passed a few times for small things that are put right there and then
     
  19. dave newell lvs

    dave newell lvs Trader-Vehicle Services

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    Funnily enough my MX5 sprint and hillclimb car usually gets that one despite it being fitted with four point harnesses.

    To all those talking about cross member replacement, I suspect the MOT tester knows the difference between a cross member and a subframe. If you do need to replace the cross member you might as well buy a new one for about £100 as pay £70 odd for a pre loved one.

    D.
     
  20. Carol

    Carol Funster Life Member

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    Dave / Daveandginney sorry it was me typing for Ed and I put sub frame instead of cross member which Ed corrected, as the towing eye is usually in these when they start going we thought it best to replace it, though it was not put as a MOT advisory. we have met a few since with the Hymers like ours which have gone.
     
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