Apple have just pushed me beyond my limit..

Discussion in 'Computers' started by Gromett, Apr 6, 2013.

  1. Gromett

    Gromett Funster

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    Bit of a Rant here. Apple have just successfully won a claim with the ITC against Samsung for a method of highlighting part of a screen.
    This is not only obvious but has been done time and time again for at least 30 years. They got the patent through I think because they used the term mobile device in the text. I was doing this on a commodore Amiga back in 89 using a genlocked source which is a hell of a lot more complex than this description.

    They have gone patent mad over the last 5-10 years and are pulling increasingly more and more obvious and silly patent lawsuits. (square with rounded corners anyone?). Each time they have done this I have got more and more frustrated with them. They have become worse than SCO for stupid patent claims now.

    They are trying to sue their competitors into oblivion rather than beating them with better design and better tech.

    I moved away from Microsoft partly because of their anti competitive behaviour. Looks like I need to de-drm all my media files now and get rid of iTunes and my two iPods. It's a shame really as they are nice little devices which are perfect for what they are needed. However I refuse to support a company who behave in such a patently anti competitive nature.

    I had to dump Nokia because they have moved 100% into the Microsoft camp and have dumped Symbian and Maemo.

    I am not a fan of Google because of their snooping, tracking and advertising. However it looks like Android is the only OS left now that is doing winning on tech not on patents. I will have to look at Android block tech to get around their tracking.

    My last 2 laptops have finally lost their windows install and are now on Linux Mint (XFCE).

    Blackberry devices although great just don't do some of the stuff I need.

    So hello Samsung, my cash is on its way now.

    Anyone want to buy an iPod touch and an iPod nano once I have converted all my media :Doh:

    Sorry for the Rant :Angry:
     
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  2. Gooney

    Gooney Funster

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    Dog eat dog Grommet, fair means or foul, it's a competitive world, Samsung have recruited JJ and Buttons:Eeek:
     
  3. Pikey Pete

    Pikey Pete Read Only Funster

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    Well what do you expect.?

    How would you feel if you had stuck your neck out and spent millions designing and developing ground breaking products only to see everyone else jumping on the bandwagon and cloning everything you had risked your company for.

    Do not forget that before the ground breaking iPod Apple were teetering on the brink and very much in a niche market.

    Time after time their risk taking had cost them dearly but now they had found a product that hit the spot and started to actually make some money.

    They followed this with the first true user-friendly Smart Phone.

    Then the iPad which all the critics said would never catch on but did and lately the iPad Mini.

    Everyone else has cloned everything that Apple has done since, Samsung being the worst offender, but then they did have a head start as they made most of the components, under licence for Apple products.

    Would there be the smart phones etc that we take for granted today if Apple hadn't taken all the risks? I doubt it! The market leader Nokia never looked like they would get there nor did anyone else.

    Apple are defending the market that they alone created, from the cloners and good luck to them.

    Without the true innovators like Apple technology would stagnate.

    If Samsung are so bloody clever when are they planning to launch a ground breaking innovative product onto the market? No I didn't think so, they are to busy making money copying what others do.

    Rant over.

    Pete:Cool:
     
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  4. Pikey Pete

    Pikey Pete Read Only Funster

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    Well not quite.

    Apparently Samsung do have a Research and Development arm after all.:Eek!:


    It's called Apple.:Rofl1:



    Pete:Cool:
     
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  5. Gromett

    Gromett Funster

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    Pete name one specific thing in the iPod touch that was original and they didn't copy from someone else? Extra points if it is ground breaking.....

    Capacitive touch screen? Nope done before
    Multitouch? Nope done before.
    Full size display? Nope done before.

    Not one part of their devices have been original that I have been able to discover. They are just as much a copier as any other company.

    They are a good design company producing slick hardware designs but no part of their tech either components or software are particularly innovative.

    in the late 90's early 00's loads of companies released tablet like devices called webpads. Display and battery technology made them of limited use though. Nokia had one ready to go 7 years before the iPhone. They decided against releasing it because they saw limited demand. Apple's iPod touch worked because of the iPod which had mass market appeal due to iTunes market share in music. They had the market already in place. It was nothing to do with anything innovative on the hardware or software front.

    Anyway, this debate rattles on and on in the tech community.

    My view is that software patents should be banned as all but a handful are trivial. Apple have just lost their rubber banding patent on appeal, yet they are going to appeal this finding ad infinitum even though there is plenty of prior art (at least 2 cases). At each turn Apples software patents are falling, all they are doing is causing disruption to their competitors until their patents are overturned.
     
  6. Gromett

    Gromett Funster

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    Also are you trying to tell me the Samsung Galaxy Note is not innovative? They were they first to release a Phablet onto the market. It has the stylus, hover feature plus loads of other stuff.
    I don't believe any of this should be patentable because each item has prior art. However to say Samsung don't innovate and Apple do is not supportable by the evidence.

    Apple have always said 10" screens for tablets are optimal. Steve Jobs said 7" tablets are a too small for your fat fingers and they are DOA. Ooops. They sell more than the 10" ones. Even Apple have had to concede they were wrong and now do the mini.

    Steve Jobs and Apple said the optimum width for a phone is around 2.5". How come the larger displays of the Galaxy S series and now the notes. Along with HTC and others making larger screen phones are close to if not have overtaken iPhone sales?

    How long will it be until Apple release an iPhone X+ with a larger screen?

    Apple didn't invent the touch screen technology used in the original iPhone it was created by FingerWorks.

    As to the looks of the iPhone, they were accused of copying the LG Prada phone from a year earlier. They do look quite similar. Apple also have prototypes designed to look like Sony devices as well which were revealed during the Samsung Court case.

    They are not as innovative as you think and their hands are not clean on the copying issues. This goes way back to their copying of the Palo Alto GUI then suing MS for copying them. They have a history of this.

    They get away with it using a combination of great marketing, evangelical fanbois and lots of money.

    I could go on....:Wink:
     
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  7. Pikey Pete

    Pikey Pete Read Only Funster

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    Karl you are deliberately missing the point.

    I didn't say that Apple invented the things you refer to and neither did they invent Plastic or any of the other things the products are made of.

    What they did do is put all those things together and make a product which was unique.

    The same can be said of any invention.

    If Apple doesn't have patent rights on any of the technology or components that they claim they have, then the courts will throw out the case.


    Pete:Cool:
     
  8. Pikey Pete

    Pikey Pete Read Only Funster

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    We are never going to agree on this one Karl.:Rofl1:

    If you cut me in slices, you will see APPLE all the way through.:Blush:


    Only ever had Microsucks stuff if the company I worked for used it.:RollEyes:

    Did have a HP Tablet using MS, a few years ago when I worked for LV, it needed a stylus but you could make it work using a fingernail. It was pretty hopeless and unreliable but it impressed my customers.:thumb:


    Pete:Cool:
     
  9. Gromett

    Gromett Funster

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    Putting everything else to one side this is the bit that gets me.

    Apple are patenting every trivial thing they can and suing. They are winning court cases because the patent is currently valid. However the patent appeals process takes forever. But eventually most of these trivial patents are being overthrown. However in the meantime the targets of the court cases are having their businesses disrupted and their name sullied for being copyists.

    Apples tactic is to disrupt other businesses using legal tactics not by being better than other companies.

    The reason for my original post is that Apple took Samsung to the ITC over a patent relating to highlighting a part of the screen using transparencies and operating on either the underlying screen or the transparency. Now this is an ancient technique in computer terms.

    So Samsung now face having their devices banned from sale in America or they have to rewrite the software to not use this technique. The patent will eventually be overthrown because there is plenty of example of prior art but it will take many years but in the meantime Samsung can't use this basic technique.

    It is death by a thousands cuts, Samsung are continuously having to modify their software to avoid these frivolous patents.

    The only way Samsung could possible win in the long run is to dispute every single one of Apples patents as they file them.

    In my view it is a dirty, underhanded and disreputable technique for competing.

    Apples $1Bn win over Samsung has already been halved since the court case was won. It is only a matter of time in my view before more of the silly patents are overthrown (due to prior art etc) and the damages reduced much further.

    Hopefully the ITC will see sense and not ban Samsung products.

    If you don't believe me on the tactics used see Groklaw or google for apples patent rejected etc. You will see a long list of patents that apple has lost on appeal.

    PS: I don't have any Samsung products at the moment so can't be called a Samsung Fanboy. My tech mix is pretty wide. From no name monitors, self build PC, Dell Laptop, sony ebook, 2 apple ipods, and asus netbook, blackberry phone, nokia phone, blackberry tablet etc etc etc. I judge tech on it's utility only with no fandom or loyalty whatsoever. I also judge companies on their behaviour hence I refuse to deal with DSG in any way shape or form.
     
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  10. Pikey Pete

    Pikey Pete Read Only Funster

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    Apple is not an overnight success and a lot of people have worked long and hard to get it to where it is today.

    Steve Jobs was a visionary and he was the driving force behind Apple's eventual success.

    Samsung and the other Cloners, are just faceless corporations.


    Corporate Business is cut throat and Apple is just trying to protect itself, I see nothing wrong with that at all.


    Pete:Cool:
     
  11. Pikey Pete

    Pikey Pete Read Only Funster

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    Oh by the way iTunes was launched in January 2001 because the iPod was ready to go but needed a platform to purchase music over the net and it needed to be in place before the launch of the iPod.
    The iPod was then launched in October 2001.

    The DRM you so hate was largely put in place at the behest of Sony Music who was then the largest music publisher in the world.

    Without Sony on board iTunes would have sunk without trace.

    I wonder if Sony would have gone ahead with their iTunes agreement if they had known about the iPod?


    Pete:Cool:
     
  12. bungy

    bungy Funster

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    Good news...root the device, put superSU on it and then block it all with targeted apps :thumb: and just be careful of the apps that you download...check the permissions...some are sneaky little buggers
     
  13. Gromett

    Gromett Funster

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    I will be getting a Galaxy Note 2, I would be tempted by cyanogenmod if it didn't break anything. On the App front. There are very very few apps I want to be honest. They have all been around since gingerbread and have a good reputation.

    I am really familiar with Linux so standard SU would do for me :Wink::Rofl1:

    Once I have root, a custom hosts file, android version of adblockplus. I am not sure about noscript availability but I really hope so.

    I have no doubt I will figure android out in no time once I get my hands on it :thumb:

    I had to drop back to a windows laptop during this week and got seriously frustrated. I ended up ordering a fresh hard drive and will be installing linux on it as soon as it arrives. As Android is based on a linux kernel I can't see me having any issues.:thumb:

    I have spent the last couple of hours reading up on Android to find out more about it. It looks ok so far...
     
  14. bungy

    bungy Funster

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    Ive got the note 1 and did dabble with CM, but just didnt get on with it - lots of the Samusng wizardry that make the Note didn't work very well, although you can get alternative apps to sort of get there it just didn't have the same 'experience'

    Ive basically left mine now as a standard ROM, with a standard kernel, but with lots of system apps frozen/deleted by using an App called Titanium backup - this is a great app for getting rid of the bloatware and things that sap the battery and allow tracking etc

    adbloker ...this one is pretty good

    get yourself over to this website as well (if you dont already know of it that is!!)...should keep you busy for a while!!
     
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  15. Gromett

    Gromett Funster

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  16. Gromett

    Gromett Funster

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    :Rofl1::Rofl1::Rofl1::Rofl1::Rofl1:

    Samsung is not a cloner. They don't do slavish copies of apple products. Anyway, Steve Jobs admitted and was even proud of his copying so you can't praise one then slam the other for doing exactly the same thing....

    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SMvAltLHYzI"]Steve Jobs "We have always been shameless about steeling" - YouTube[/ame]
     
  17. bungy

    bungy Funster

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    the attached XLS may be of some use...shows what apps can be deleted and so on
     

    Attached Files:

  18. laser101uk

    laser101uk Funster

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  19. Pikey Pete

    Pikey Pete Read Only Funster

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    Not quite true as The First Apple Computer and the operating system was the sole work of Steve Wozniak, not Steve Jobs.


    Pete:Cool:
     
  20. Wildman

    Wildman Read Only Funster

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    The last 30 years has seen a massive growth in the market development and innovation, computer technology is the new drug and we are all addicts, bigger, faster maybe but long term storage still does not exist massive HDrives for back up and bigger ones still to back them up, your whole life on a hard drive that can, will and do crash without a moments notice, built in obsolescence no matter how much you pay, failing support for older products you paid good money for. Is this really the sort of life we want to lead dependant on a bloody computer does that not make us all androids. Friendships forged on Internet forums etc, it is all so unreal you would not believe how many times in the past year I have threatened to scrap the computers and never have one in the house again. Technology has gone mad and is driving us all mad along with it.
    Now where is my slate and chalk.
     
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