Aires in the UK

[donnkim]

Hi
We are in tbe Basque area in France enjoying wonderful weather.
Got Chatting to a Brit caravaner - as you do - and he told me that the EU wanted to introduce the French Aire system into the UK. However, the CC and CCC lobbied to stop this in its tracks as it would damage their Business.
What do other members think about this? :Cool:

 

[GJH]

First time I've heard any claim that the EU wanted to introduce the French Aire system into the UK. Unless the caravanner (or anyone else) can produce evidence to back the claim I would take it with a very large pinch of salt.

 

[simply]

Aires in UK

This is not the only issue in which the CC and C&CC need their heads banged together :Blush::Blush:

 

[freelanderuk]

If it did ever happen , how long would it be before the freeloading tossers spoilt it like they do at many other parking spots

 

[scotjimland]

Hi
We are in tbe Basque area in France enjoying wonderful weather.
Got Chatting to a Brit caravaner - as you do - and he told me that the EU wanted to introduce the French Aire system into the UK. However, the CC and CCC lobbied to stop this in its tracks as it would damage their Business.
What do other members think about this? :Cool:

I think the Brit caravanner has been out in the sun too long .. been at the cheap vino .. or more likely both ...

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[steve and jo]

if this was to happen it would ready made sites for the gypsy travelers.

 

[normanandsue]

if this was to happen it would ready made sites for the gypsy travelers.

Travellers are not restricted to the UK France and Germany have problems with them too. But they have stronger eviction laws in both countries and the police can and do deal with them very robustly.

As regards the original post I too think the comment should be taken with a handful of salt; although I do think there are forces combined against the introduction of the system into the UK and I do think local camp site owners have a strong lobby against an Aire system

Norman



Norman

 

[Hollyberry]

Saw in local paper last winter that Weymouth council wants to open an Aire. Not sure if it's happening or not.

 

[TheBig1]

Saw in local paper last winter that Weymouth council wants to open an Aire. Not sure if it's happening or not.

no, as there have been objections from local businessesoh:

unfortunately the local campsites dont want competition from a no frills type aire for some reason

 

[jonandshell]

Had the caravanner been gassed as well?!

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[magicsurfbus]

1. It would seem that overnight MH parking in council car parks is already possible in the UK within existing laws, for example Canterbury, Chester, Machynlleth, so I'm not sure why the EU would need to intervene.

2. What did he mean by 'the EU' anyway? None of the aires in Europe are EU operated.

There might be a case for standardising the parking regulations across the EU, so long as the powers of eviction for illegal parking could also be strengthened here. I've seen dedicated traveller parking areas in France, and have rarely seen travellers on an aire. The only exception is the forest aire at Biscarrosse-Plage where the 'new age' travellers (in very old age vehicles) often set up in one corner for the summer, but they tend to keep themselves to themselves.

 

[GJH]

It is perfectly true that overnight MH habitation (let's be honest and not just call it parking) in council car parks is already possible in the UK within existing laws. It is also true that some car parks are unsuitable for various reasons.

Where car parks are suitable then councils need to be shown that:
1) making the necessary investment is potentially viable.
2) the potential users are not people who will adversely affect the business of large caravan sites because they seek places with few facilities so would, instead, use CLs &c.

 

[chaser]

To be honest, we don't like paying to stay anywhere, but don't see what is init for ordinary towns in uk, we have everything we need on board, so letting us park for free would get them nothing, apart from possibly supermarkets where we could park for free anyway while useing them, and who just wants to look at a car park while parked up, uk is totally different to France where the aires are in the middle of countryside, vines, canels rivers, loads of room for them, and a totally different way of life, and dare I add a completly different attitude to travelers, here aires would be took over in a day and would be closed for months while trying to move them.

 

[GJH]

To be honest, we don't like paying to stay anywhere, but don't see what is init for ordinary towns in uk, we have everything we need on board, so letting us park for free would get them nothing, apart from possibly supermarkets where we could park for free anyway while useing them, and who just wants to look at a car park while parked up, uk is totally different to France where the aires are in the middle of countryside, vines, canels rivers, loads of room for them, and a totally different way of life, and dare I add a completly different attitude to travelers, here [HI]aires would be took over in a day and would be closed for months while trying to move them[/HI].

In some cases that would be so but there are relatively few council owned car parks or park & ride sites which attract the attentions of "travellers". That should not be any different if overnight MH habitation were to be allowed.

 

[chaser]

In some cases that would be so but there are relatively few council owned car parks or park & ride sites which attract the attentions of "travellers". That should not be any different if overnight MH habitation were to be allowed.

No I don't agree, car parks and park and rides are manned while in use and you can't stop at night or cook or anything, once travelers, or anyone else for that matter, had stopped for the night and got their stuff out on a piece of ground as they do in other places now, how do you move them, the police wouldn't dare, so what are you left with

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[chaser]

Please don't think I am against uk aires , totally for them , but looking at the practicalities , no way they would work, plus that cc and ccc are not going to have them in there back garden either.

 

[GJH]

No I don't agree, car parks and park and rides are manned while in use and you can't stop at night or cook or anything, once travelers, or anyone else for that matter, had stopped for the night and got their stuff out on a piece of ground as they do in other places now, how do you move them, the police wouldn't dare, so what are you left with

The question of "traveller" incursion arose when we were discussing the allowing of overnight habitation at Guisborough with Redcar & Cleveland Borough Council. It was pointed out that there had never been such a problem there in the several decades that the coach park had been open (despite problems on other sites (not car parks) in the borough). Whilst it was open there were no "traveller" problems; trouble was too few motorhomers used it

I haven't heard of any such problems at Canterbury, Chester, Machynlleth &c. There have been "traveller" incursions at Cambridge P&R sites though and that is why only Trumpington can be used by motorhomes. Problems vary across the country which is why only some would suffer.

 

[chaser]

The question of "traveller" incursion arose when we were discussing the allowing of overnight habitation at Guisborough with Redcar & Cleveland Borough Council. It was pointed out that there had never been such a problem there in the several decades that the coach park had been open (despite problems on other sites (not car parks) in the borough). Whilst it was open there were no "traveller" problems; trouble was too few motorhomers used it

I haven't heard of any such problems at Canterbury, Chester, Machynlleth &c. There have been "traveller" incursions at Cambridge P&R sites though and that is why only Trumpington can be used by motorhomes. Problems vary across the country which is why only some would suffer.

That's maybe because they didn't want to park on a coach park but give them something that is halfway decent to park on , then see what happens

 

[GJH]

That's maybe because they didn't want to park on a [HI]coach park[/HI] but give them something that is halfway decent to park on , then see what happens

But that's all Canterbury, Chester, Machynlleth &c are really.

 

[scotjimland]

Two Nations .. France and the UK.. different travelling traditions..

There are only 112,000 motorhomes compared to 498,000 touring caravans registered in the UK .. that figure is probably now 500,000

Traditionally the UK has been a camping and caravanning nation.. hence the number of camping sites. Clubs for caravanners have been going for decades. but now some touring sites are changing to bungalows and statics..

so, sites change to suite the demand.. so maybe the demand for aries will cause change.. but you cannot force change on councils.. or private site owners.. there has to be a genuine demand, (not just a few freeloaders protesting.) . it has to be shown that they would be a benefit to the town .. and not just as a convenience for the users.


On the other hand France is a motorhoming nation .. hence their facilities are geared up to the needs of the camping car .. ie .. aires camping car, with fewer facilities for caravans and tents.

Why that is so I have no idea... blame Napoleon .. he can't argue ..

but Mr Stangeways is not doing any good.. he, AFAIK, doesn't even own a motorhome.. he enjoys the battle.. enjoys beating the local council, enjoys the limelight.. (he's in Wiki )

not interested in 'the cause' or who it damages... just self..

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[ShiftZZ]

I cant see it myself, they are cutting back on everything including meals on wheels and the chances of them spending any money on aires is Zero, you would get better odds on Old Mo being the Chancellor of the Exchequer of Poland wearing an Andy Pandy suit and green socks sucking a Terry's Chocolate Orange through a straw.

As Jim said, too much sun or vino or Nigerian Woodbines.

 

[Billy23]

I cant see it myself, they are cutting back on everything including meals on wheels and the chances of them spending any money on aires is Zero, you would get better odds on Old Mo being the Chancellor of the Exchequer of Poland wearing an Andy Pandy suit and green socks sucking a Terry's Chocolate Orange through a straw.

As Jim said, too much sun or vino or Nigerian Woodbines.

Hope you have taken into account that some on here wouldn't know what an " Andy Pandy" suit is. I do cos I'm old :thumb:

 

[Gorse Hill]

Why is it that so many funsters are dead against mr stangeways having looked at his website he seems to be fighting our corner and this month the MMM magazine was praising his efforts in his fight against local councils. Sometimes u need someone with a bit of attitude and get up and go to deal with these councils as to date being overly nice doesn't seem to have got us very far
Am not so sure having no motorhome, if that is the case, makes him any less worthy of fighting the motorhome cause than someone who owns one
Please enlighten me, Thks

 

[GJH]

Why is it that so many funsters are dead against mr stangeways having looked at his website he seems to be fighting our corner and this month the MMM magazine was praising his efforts in his fight against local councils. Sometimes u need someone with a bit of attitude and get up and go to deal with these councils as to date being overly nice doesn't seem to have got us very far
Am not so sure having no motorhome, if that is the case, makes him any less worthy of fighting the motorhome cause than someone who owns one
Please enlighten me, Thks

He definitely doesn't have a motorhome - unless a Skoda Fabia morphs into one when nobody is looking

The problem with much of what is on his web site is inaccuracy. For instance, there are a couple of examples of where councils have undertaken to change signage to clarify the meaning. As a result he not only claims (wrongly) that the signage is illegal but that removal of "No overnighting" signs means that overnighting is OK, completely ignoring the fact that it is the (unchanged) legal order which is important not the signage.

He also mounts stunts which are destructive and aggressively challenging, rather than trying to find a way of working with councils in a positive, constructive manner. That achieves nothing but setting councils against the cause of motorhomers.

He has already been banned from at least one forum because of the harm he has caused.

 

[sedge]

Don't for God's sake suggest they bring EU 'rules' in for anything else Magicsurfbus.

Some years ago it was suggested that the UK should change the rules for diabetic driving, because it seemed so unfair that we could only drive whatever, and the rest of the EU could drive this, that and the other.

So they got together a cross European consortium of eminent people to analyse each countries rules and regs, and find out all the why's and wherefores and pronounce.

They did this much to my surprise, it's a great big long document one can find on the Interwebnet thingy. But DVAL's Medical Branch did not want to budge, not a millimetre - in fact they wanted to make it even more difficult. Good old Diabetes UK got involved and managed to persuade DVLA not to make em worse but to slightly relax certain things. This they did, give em their due.

The result of this is - we still have less favourable rules and regs than most of civilised Europe had in the first place - and you don't seem to be able to find out what all the other countries have done!

No doubt they've said 'Yes' but ignored it all anyway. All good fun.

Tum te tum te tum.

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[oldun]

no, as there have been objections from local businessesoh:

unfortunately the local campsites dont want competition from a no frills type aire for some reason

That's a strange comment. The reason is obvious, they don't want there trading position weakened by then introduction of cheaper/free camping.

The situation is exactly the same with taxi drivers who, all over Europe, are fighting against a mobile phone car-share app which would obviously seriously affect there business.

 

[TheBig1]

That's a strange comment. The reason is obvious, they don't want there trading position weakened by then introduction of cheaper/free camping.

The situation is exactly the same with taxi drivers who, all over Europe, are fighting against a mobile phone car-share app which would obviously seriously affect there business.

I will point out again, my wife's family own one of the biggest caravan sites in Weymouth. Not sure why you found a sarcastic comment strange, but hey, good job we dont all think exactly the same

the area in question has suffered a drop in tourism recently and to increase visitor numbers, the thought was to provide a facility for those that dont need the expense or frills of a big site. there is no competition for caravan sites, as the people who would use the aire are the same ones now banned from parking up on the seafront. the money oriented businesses that have complained are not happy that some people may not wish to or possibly afford to pay their prices. market forces dictate the value of a service and its demand. sometimes it takes a fresh idea to bring new tourists in for ALL the businesses to benefit not the few