Under the radar till persona non grata or what?

[Nomad Plan]

Happy New Year and may you all remain warm and well,

So not wishing for early onset arthritis and a lot of creaking, we've jumped into full timing and found ourselves in Lisbon for Christmas, we are now considering our next move... From what I read and hear there is probably more than 20,000 FT's under the radar in Portugal and maybe 3,000,000 in Europe.
Whilst we have the option and may find ourselves in the Balkans come April fools Day! Other host countries benefit from older travellers living off savings and paying local taxes avoiding Northern European winters.
So who does what... ? Europe offer a solution? or Boris sort something? or do we hide in the hills?

 

[bobandjanie]

Are people really living under the radar ?
I would think your idea of hiding in the hills is the favourite, providing you keep away from phones and internet also vehicles leaving a paper trail, and live off the land.

JJ said he was living on his land in Portugal under the radar, then all of a sudden he is a permanent resident, and probably get yet another passport to add to his collection. Bob.

 

[bobandjanie]

As I said Nomad Plan you can't have technology, big brother knows exactly where we went in 2020. Bob.
,

 

[chaser]

There is very little chance of staying "under the radar" in this day and age with a motorhome I'm afraid , as good as it may sound, every time you fill it up or buy supplies someone somewhere knows, taxing and testing it , anything medical, all going to be on record, even just someone jealous reporting you.
Even in fact asking the question on here, even if you hadn't said you were in Portugal , we would have known by the flag on your avatar.
Nigh on impossible I'm afraid.
And the fact you must have a phone or computer to post on here, just put the top hat on it.

 

[Langtoftlad]

All these 'liberties' lost in the name of anti-terrorism & keeping us safe.

The only thing to keep you 'under the radar' is the sheer volume of data - you'd have to do 'something' to make you a person of interest to spend resources to pick you out of a crowd and find you.

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[suavecarve]

The trouble is we dont know who is under the radar because they wont be answering this thread !

Once in Europe, if you were to not come back for 10 years, the only realistic way that you are going to get caught is inadvertently coming to the attention of the powers that be, or bragging about it and getting dobbed in.

The powers that be are not going to be chasing you through GPS or mobile phone masts or using your debit card. It will be when you come back that the issue arises or, if you get back the moment you try to re enter Schengen.

 

[bobandjanie]

Or your just hanging around in a play area with your mates, and the local policeman asks for your ID and gives you a warning and you have to produce it at the police station, then mum spouts off saying haven't they got anything better to do that's part of their job. Bob.

 

[chaser]

The trouble is we dont know who is under the radar because they wont be answering this thread !

Once in Europe, if you were to not come back for 10 years, the only realistic way that you are going to get caught is inadvertently coming to the attention of the powers that be, or bragging about it and getting dobbed in.

The powers that be are not going to be chasing you through GPS or mobile phone masts or using your debit card. It will be when you come back that the issue arises or, if you get back the moment you try to re enter Schengen.

This maybe true if you are living in a cave in the mountains and growing your own stuff and completely stay out of society.
But the big problem arises with the motorhome, where do you get it tested, every time it hits the road you can gaurantee it's going to be photographed even if it's only the filling station.

 

[chaser]

Another thing that's going to catch you, where's the money going to come from, you are either going to have to work for someone or if you have other funds it's going to have to paid into some sort of account in the country you are in.

 

[LesW]

The best way to 'hide' this day and age is in a crowd.

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[MattR]

View attachment 454044

Happy New Year and may you all remain warm and well,

So not wishing for early onset arthritis and a lot of creaking, we've jumped into full timing and found ourselves in Lisbon for Christmas, we are now considering our next move... From what I read and hear there is probably more than 20,000 FT's under the radar in Portugal and maybe 3,000,000 in Europe.
Whilst we have the option and may find ourselves in the Balkans come April fools Day! Other host countries benefit from older travellers living off savings and paying local taxes avoiding Northern European winters.
So who does what... ? Europe offer a solution? or Boris sort something? or do we hide in the hills?

Much more difficult to hide under the radar now as wildcamping is now illegal in Portugal; I guess that you'll be more likely to be visited by the Police who'll be checking your paper work. I guess that campsites will check your IDs.

 

[suavecarve]

This maybe true if you are living in a cave in the mountains and growing your own stuff and completely stay out of society.
But the big problem arises with the motorhome, where do you get it tested, every time it hits the road you can gaurantee it's going to be photographed even if it's only the filling station.

Absolutely true.

The photographs will exist, the receipts for shopping and the records of your mobile phones movements.

Who is going to check them before you get back ?

 

[Garfields]

View attachment 454044

Happy New Year and may you all remain warm and well,

So not wishing for early onset arthritis and a lot of creaking, we've jumped into full timing and found ourselves in Lisbon for Christmas, we are now considering our next move... From what I read and hear there is probably more than 20,000 FT's under the radar in Portugal and maybe 3,000,000 in Europe.
Whilst we have the option and may find ourselves in the Balkans come April fools Day! Other host countries benefit from older travellers living off savings and paying local taxes avoiding Northern European winters.
So who does what... ? Europe offer a solution? or Boris sort something? or do we hide in the hills?

Like the picture
Depends on the definition of being under the radar
Most are not really under the radar they are just not doing anything to get the interest of the authority's where they are
The 90 day thing may cause issues for some that have not had issues up to now

 

[chaser]

Shame int it really , must be millions of people's idea of heaven, just to be left alone, you used to almost do it here, get a little smallholding in Wales or Scotland or somewhere and keep yourself, but now with surveillance helicopters and drones and Google nowhere is off the radar, and so many rules and regulations and taxes on everything, even green issues, that there is always someone after you for something, and even crime , you are always in danger of getting robbed.
Shame but it's the society we have worked towards all these years.
This covid has brought a lot out to see you can manage without all these modern conveniences but it's too late now I'm afraid.

 

[The Wino]

I suppose if you stay" off the radar" it means that you have the same right to be in the country as any other illegal immigrants and could potentially face similar penalties but be more able to pay any fines as you have assets that could be easily seized.
How it all pans out is anyone's guess.

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[suavecarve]

Shame int it really , must be millions of people's idea of heaven, just to be left alone, you used to almost do it here, get a little smallholding in Wales or Scotland or somewhere and keep yourself, but now with surveillance helicopters and drones and Google nowhere is off the radar, and so many rules and regulations and taxes on everything, even green issues, that there is always someone after you for something, and even crime , you are always in danger of getting robbed.
Shame but it's the society we have worked towards all these years.
This covid has brought a lot out to see you can manage without all these modern conveniences but it's too late now I'm afraid.

There was a robbery in Park Street in November, but thats it for Uttoxeter for the whole month !

 

[chaser]

I suppose if you stay" off the radar" it means that you have the same right to be in the country as any other illegal immigrants and could potentially face similar penalties but be more able to pay any fines as you have assets that could be easily seized.
How it all pans out is anyone's guess.

Being an illegal immigrant is one thing and you may get away with that for a while but I think the op was meaning keeping his motorhome and just paying his way which brings a host of problems.
Just by making one post on here as in fact told the whole world that he is in Portugal.
Simple things like that.

 

[chaser]

There was a robbery in Park Street in November, but thats it for Uttoxeter for the whole month !

Do you live in utch mate?

 

[suavecarve]

Do you live in utch mate?

No i was just interested in the figures so looked them up.

Unfortunately I just rechecked them and they were last years figures so probably a lot more Q than the November that just passed.

All the reported crimes on Uttoxeter streets in just one month

Does your road feature?

www.derbytelegraph.co.uk

 

[Podney]

Please forgive my naive stupidity,I’m only a simple country boy..........but exactly what is the point of trying to stay “under the radar”??

Seems a bit pointless,and I’d spend half my time looking over my shoulder to see who‘s after me.

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[suavecarve]

Being an illegal immigrant is one thing and you may get away with that for a while but I think the op was meaning keeping his motorhome and just paying his way which brings a host of problems.
Just by making one post on here as in fact told the whole world that he is in Portugal.
Simple things like that.

I still think that they wont be checking up on you.

You go into an ACSI site having booked using your phone and pay on your credit card having been in France for 300 days.

The campsite dont know how long you have been there, the phone company (presuming you have a local mobile) arent interested, and the credit card company arent going to tell. If you post on here and your flag comes up there is the potential of another person contacting the authorities to let them know so just use a VPN to say youre in Croatia or America or UK.

The powers that be in this case will be border enforcement agents and they will catch you on the way back and then they will have all the evidence. But if you stay out there and keep yourself to yourself I just dont see how they will catch actually committing the offence til you return.

I could be wrong though

 

[Landy Andy]

All you lot appear to think that we are being tracked 24/7, but are we? Yes they have the ability to track, but are they bothering with the likes of us? I doubt it. So if you just go about having a boring standard life I doubt it would wave any flag to suddenly make people look for your funny forum names, and start to check your google maps history that you’ve chosen to record your history.

 

[bobandjanie]

They might not be checking up on you, but there could be an incident and while checking CCTV, they look at this shifty looking motorhomer and check you out. Bob.

 

[bobandjanie]

All you lot appear to think that we are being tracked 24/7, but are we? Yes they have the ability to track, but are they bothering with the likes of us? I doubt it. So if you just go about having a boring standard life I doubt it would wave any flag to suddenly make people look for your funny forum names, and start to check your google maps history that you’ve chosen to record your history.

Smart phones can be tracked even if the location and GPS are turned off. Bob.

 

[peterc10]

I used to be paranoid about such things, thinking that they may be after me. Not any more. Now I know they are.

After all, look what they have done to that nice Mr Trump in America.

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[Landy Andy]

Smart phones can be tracked even if the location and GPS are turned off. Bob.

Can they? I know they can when on. But who is bothering?

Look at the post about the lady who has gone missing whilst walking across the French Spanish boarder.

Do people think there are massive rooms of people tracking the fact I’ve been to the shell garage, and out for a run today. I don’t think so.

 

[MattR]

What would be the fine imposed on people staying over the 90 days? Who wouldn't put it past some cash-strapped police forces to do random checks on foreign vehicles to check eligibility to stay...? Would you trust the French Police not to start checking UK registered vehicles in retaliation for something? I know that motorhomers provide valuable contributions to some areas but if you're in N Spain or France at the end of your trip I think that there is a fair chance of having your papers checked and your duration of stay will be an issue.

 

[gus-lopez]

Are people really living under the radar ?

There are or were plenty doing it. Where Paul Badknee is staying the mayor made a statement last year to the effect that the brits were to stop coming in with piles of paperwork proving they'd been living there for years & wanting to regsieter as residents as his staff were no longer going to assist them.

Or your just hanging around in a play area with your mates, and the local policeman asks for your ID and gives you a warning and you have to produce it at the police station, then mum spouts off saying haven't they got anything better to do that's part of their job. Bob.

I don't think I'll come up your way it sounds just like Andalucia. Cops on every roundabout . Here we have to go & drag them out the station.

or if you have other funds it's going to have to paid into some sort of account in the country you are in.

Why ? I have just got rid of my spanish accounts, due to the excessive charges. All direct debits & standing orders are now paid from another country.

Just by making one post on here as in fact told the whole world that he is in Portugal.

Unless he is using a vpn?

The powers that be in this case will be border enforcement agents and they will catch you on the way back and then they will have all the evidence.

There are other ways you can get in to the Uk without going directly

 

[suavecarve]

There are other ways you can get in to the Uk without going directly

Agreed, thats why if someone did want to go this way, it will be if as and when they want to return to Schengen that they will have quite an issue

 

[Stoosal]

Think that over the next year or two people will eventually fall foul of the legislation re time allowed to be spent in the various countries unless you plan stays in Schengen / non Schengen etc...as time goes on the application of Schengen will be tightened, particularly where there is mass motorhome/camper ‘invasions’ (as some locals will see it).....if you want to stay in Europe full time may just be easier to apply for residency/citizenship/visa somewhere....?