Sulfur.. Explosive risk?? (1 Viewer)

[maxi77]

You could try the marina in Trowbridge, they should stock a variety of batteries.


Dave

Strangely boat owners usually suggest caravan shops as they are considered to sell very similar or the same products at lower prices

 

[Minxy]

Peter/Stealaway ... you have your 'views' but regardless I am correct that there IS a difference between a leisure and starter battery ... you may not think this is important but in use it can determine how well the battery will perform/last. The late (great) John Wickersham did a review a few years ago of various leisure batteries and found that some were just rebadged starter batteries, but that some were indeed leisure batteries and would obviously perform better.

Whilst the 'treatment/care' given by the user is important, if you start off with the 'wrong' sort of battery in the first place it certainly won't help!

As we do virtually all our 'camping' off grid (ie aires/wild etc) battery capacity and longevity is very important to us, whilst those who use hook-up a lot don't need to worry if they buy 'cheap' leisure batteries so much, for us we prefer to have a quality 'real' leisure battery, yes you may pay a bit more but then if you look after it, it will 'repay' you many times over.

 

[Stealaway]

Strangely boat owners usually suggest caravan shops as they are considered to sell very similar or the same products at lower prices

You are quite right - any thing with 'marine' written on it is always a premium price. Including 'Marine battery's - what ever they are??

all seems too easy... but then spending money usually is

Hankook are beginning to get a good name, you'll be OK with them, especially at that price.

Although reading their blurb the plates are only hardened, there is no mention of them being any thicker.
This treatment is probably why Varta claim theirs are now dual purpose - they don't deform under heavy starting loads.

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[Stealaway]

As we do virtually all our 'camping' off grid (ie aires/wild etc) battery capacity and longevity is very important to us, whilst those who use hook-up a lot don't need to worry if they buy 'cheap' leisure batteries so much, for us we prefer to have a quality 'real' leisure battery, yes you may pay a bit more but then if you look after it, it will 'repay' you many times over.

We are much the same, always off grid. Which battery's would you recommend?
I bought two of these earlier this year
https://advancedbatterysupplies.co.uk/product/numax-cxv35-mf/

 

[Minxy]

We are much the same, always off grid. Which battery's would you recommend?
I bought two of these earlier this year
https://advancedbatterysupplies.co.uk/product/numax-cxv35-mf/

I would need to dig out my paperwork to check which came out as 'proper' leisure batteries - if Dave Newell is 'skulking' about on the forum I'm sure he'll know without having to look it up!

 

[Just smiffy]

Battery Megastore in Tewksbury offers next day delivery by 6pm. They are a good supplier. If the delivery is still a bit tight, try ringing them and see if you could collect - not that far from Trowbridge.
http://www.batterymegastore.co.uk/

I'm sure there's one in Swindon too..? That could be on the way..?

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[Sandancers]

While agreeing that the battery giving off smells and bubbling needs to be binned, has anyone ever heard of a battery actually producing enough Hydrogen for the gas to ignite and cause an explosion ? I'd put it under the same heading as "using a mobile phone while filling fuel tank will cause an explosion", well yes it might, but lets see it happen in a repeatable scientific experiment.

Back in the day we used to build rigs to see what would cause a roomful of natural gas to explode, a spark from a light switch certainly would, but a house phone ringing wouldn't !! I have heard from others that no matter how much they over charge batteries they can't get enough gas to cause an explosion. Which is odd as hydrogen is way more prone to explode at lower ignition points than natural gas.

 

[Jaws]

Sooo @mjltigger , you have now found out what cooked your original charging system
A totally shot battery !!

 

[maxi77]

While agreeing that the battery giving off smells and bubbling needs to be binned, has anyone ever heard of a battery actually producing enough Hydrogen for the gas to ignite and cause an explosion ? I'd put it under the same heading as "using a mobile phone while filling fuel tank will cause an explosion", well yes it might, but lets see it happen in a repeatable scientific experiment.

Back in the day we used to build rigs to see what would cause a roomful of natural gas to explode, a spark from a light switch certainly would, but a house phone ringing wouldn't !! I have heard from others that no matter how much they over charge batteries they can't get enough gas to cause an explosion. Which is odd as hydrogen is way more prone to explode at lower ignition points than natural gas.

Batteries do explode from hydrogen evolution. I remember HMS Auriga coming into Gibraltar after an explosion in her forward battery compartment, that was even with proper ventilation and catalytic burners to get rid or hydrogen. In geeneral most installations in normal use will not generate explosive hydrogen concentrations but it is a real risk.

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[Sandancers]

Batteries do explode from hydrogen evolution. I remember HMS Auriga coming into Gibraltar after an explosion in her forward battery compartment, that was even with proper ventilation and catalytic burners to get rid or hydrogen. In geeneral most installations in normal use will not generate explosive hydrogen concentrations but it is a real risk.

Yeah, in industrial type set-ups with masses of batteries. But I'm talking about in a car or Motorhome.

 

[thehutchies]

While agreeing that the battery giving off smells and bubbling needs to be binned, has anyone ever heard of a battery actually producing enough Hydrogen for the gas to ignite and cause an explosion ? ...

I used to do health screening for employees in high-risk jobs and I have done hearing tests for many motor mechanics who have been close to an exploding battery.
It's more common than you might expect

 

[tonyidle]

While agreeing that the battery giving off smells and bubbling needs to be binned, has anyone ever heard of a battery actually producing enough Hydrogen for the gas to ignite and cause an explosion ? I'd put it under the same heading as "using a mobile phone while filling fuel tank will cause an explosion", well yes it might, but lets see it happen in a repeatable scientific experiment.

Back in the day we used to build rigs to see what would cause a roomful of natural gas to explode, a spark from a light switch certainly would, but a house phone ringing wouldn't !! I have heard from others that no matter how much they over charge batteries they can't get enough gas to cause an explosion. Which is odd as hydrogen is way more prone to explode at lower ignition points than natural gas.

The company I worked for used standby generators powered by V12 Diesel engines. The starter battery comprised a number of glass-encased cells in series linked by lead straps. I remember at least two incidents caused by loose/corroded straps sparking when the engine started and igniting the hydrogen / oxygen mix given off by the cells . Photographs of the engine rooms showed all four walls and the nearby control cabinets with glass 'shrapnel' embedded. No-one was hurt in either incident because no-one was in the room at the time the engine started. Lead acid batteries don't give off hydrogen - they produce the precise mix of hydrogen and oxygen needed for a perfect burn. It most definitely is NOT an urban myth.

Broken Link Removed

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[Peter A Forbes]

Explosions are far more common than people think, and as Tony correctly mentions, water in the batteries breaks down to 2 parts of Hydrogen and one part of Oxygen, nicely explosive.

On many of the standby sets we have installed we use a gas recombination filler, which recombines the gaseous mixture back into water which runs back into the battery cell.

A recent substation visit showed a battery set that had these fitted was exactly on the electrolyte cell levels, after more than 5 years unattended use on float charge.

Older cells on the right, new batteries on the left:

We prefer the wet flat plate batteries to the sealed stuff.

Peter

 

[Don Quixote]

Peter, great pictures brings back memories of my military days when we used to service the batteries. I remember the day a battery went bang in the battery shop and blow all the windows behind it out. The lad that sent it off walked into the battery room with lit fag, but that was in 1980 when things were somewhat relaxed.

 

[maxi77]

Yeah, in industrial type set-ups with masses of batteries. But I'm talking about in a car or Motorhome.

Whilst I would agree the probability is very low it can and does happen. Most installations have good enough ventilation to disperse any hydrogen before it can cause problems but in a few cases it can be trapped for example by battery box lids and thus you can get an explosive mix just waiting for a spark. I would expect that plate damage causing gross overheating is much more likely.

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[maxi77]

Yeah, in industrial type set-ups with masses of batteries. But I'm talking about in a car or Motorhome.

So am I, it is rare but does happen

 

[glastry]

Yeah, in industrial type set-ups with masses of batteries. But I'm talking about in a car or Motorhome.

I do not think that i can add anything meaningful to
the battery type debate other than to say that in practice
over 30 years or so i have found that a good big starter battery seems to last just as well when used as a "leisure"
battery.
I have however caused a battery to explode by carelessly
using a grinder just below a battery box!!
small explosion and then a mad scramble to get out from under the van,when the acid started to run out the bottom vent holes.The top was blown off the battery .
Probably only happened because i was working inside
so no real draught/air movement .
Hope that is helpful.-certainly cured me.

 

[pappajohn]

The vast majority of cheap leisure batteries are just relabelled starter batteries.

The only real way of knowing if it really is a leisure battery is buy deep cycle traction batteries as used in golf buggies and fork lift trucks.

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[pappajohn]

While agreeing that the battery giving off smells and bubbling needs to be binned, has anyone ever heard of a battery actually producing enough Hydrogen for the gas to ignite and cause an explosion

Back in the late 90s/early 2000s i worked in breakdown recovery.
I had to attend a non starter in a multistory carpark.

I instantly knew why it wouldnt start by the smell before i even opened the bonnet but i didnt expect what i found.....the battery top case was laid on the engine tethered by the starter cable.
The battery had exploded blowing off the top and splitting the case open.
This happened when the driver cranked the engine and i suspect the starter brushs had caused a spark....enough to ignite the gas.

 

[tonyidle]

Back in the late 90s/early 2000s i worked in breakdown recovery.
I had to attend a non starter in a multistory carpark.

I instantly knew why it wouldnt start by the smell before i even opened the bonnet but i didnt expect what i found.....the battery top case was laid on the engine tethered by the starter cable.
The battery had exploded blowing off the top and splitting the case open.
This happened when the driver cranked the engine and i suspect the starter brushs had caused a spark....enough to ignite the gas.

There have been cases of that happening because a failed joint between the plates & one of the battery terminals sparked when the starter was engaged.

 

[mjltigger]

So all.. I had some issues and was delayed leaving Thursday until after midnight however the mains was off from 6pm. I had the heating running using just the one 80ah battery. At Folkstone while waiting for the train I fitted the new battery. We got to Cologne at about 1pm Friday and left about the same time Sunday. No hookup, watched a few DVDs in the evenings, had heating on when we wanted etc etc and no sign of fade on the battery at all.. who needs solar lol

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