Shaudt Electroblock EBL99 (Faulty)+ LR1218 + Victron Multiplus 2000 + B2B

EuroTrotters

EuroTrotters

Joined
Jul 18, 2009
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Location
Manchester UK + Javea/Xabia Spain + Abu Dhabi
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HYMER B644
Exp
2004
Hi

So, it seems my EBL99 is no longer charging from the mains (Still charges from Alernator).

I was already looking at some kind of B2B Charger when I found this issue.

I called http://www.apuljackengineering.co.uk/repair_pages/repair_page_ebl_99.html , seems quite expensive to repair or replace with a re-conditioned unit.. I have also emailed http://www.aandncaravanservices.co.uk/schaudt-elektroblock.php for their prices.

Then I got to thinking !

The Victron Inverter I have is

Victron MultiPlus Compact Inverter Charger 12V/2000VA/80A - Sunshine Solar - Sunshine Solar Limited

The Victron MultiPlus Compact Inverter Charger 12V/2000VA/80A is a combined inverter/charger in one elegant package! Click Here to Purchase now!
www.sunshinesolar.co.uk

I could use this to charge the Hab batteries on site?

But My solar would then not charge the chassis battery, unless I made big changes to the system?

Any Suggestions welcome?

(PS: If AandA can repair for a reasonable cost, could I still use the Victron to charge as well, or do I have to disconnect the Electroblock?)

(PPS: If I fit a B2B, do I have to disconnect the electroblock?)

ET
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Hi Trevor,

I have used A and A Caravans (Martin Bushnell) for an exchange EBL220-4 and the returned unit had no problems over 2 years and the turn around time was by return. Martin Bushnell was a treat to deal with and I'd use him again.

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EuroTrotters said:
Yes, it’s the swapping of the solar wires that bother me. Might need a new regulator to charge Hab and starter
Click to expand...
If your solar is going into the EBL it can stay the same, brain wasn't in gear earlier.
LR1218 is a bit old hat, it's only a single stage charger doesn't even drop to a float charge, OK on Gel's I wouldn't risk it on anything else.
 
EuroTrotters said:
(PPS: If I fit a B2B, do I have to disconnect the electroblock?)
Click to expand...
The EBL has the split charge relay built in. If you just connect the B2B between the batteries, and do nothing else, the split charge relay will short out the B2B and stop it doing anything different than before. There are many possible workarounds to solve this problem.
 
autorouter said:
The EBL has the split charge relay built in. If you just connect the B2B between the batteries, and do nothing else, the split charge relay will short out the B2B and stop it doing anything different than before. There are many possible workarounds to solve this problem.
Click to expand...
So I’m thinking !

re-route solar with new controller
Fit B2B
Disconnect fuse and mains to ebl99 as per Lenny HB
Connect mains power to victron to allow mains charging ?
 
EuroTrotters said:
So I’m thinking !

re-route solar with new controller
Fit B2B
Disconnect fuse and mains to ebl99 as per Lenny HB
Connect mains power to victron to allow mains charging ?
Click to expand...
You can still wire a new solar controller via the EBL, if you have an LCD panel the Votronic controllers have the data link so you can bring up the same info as you can now.
 
Lenny HB said:
You can still wire a new solar controller via the EBL, if you have an LCD panel the Votronic controllers have the data link so you can bring up the same info as you can now.
Click to expand...
Display is analogue

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You could change to a Votronic solar regulator and wire it into the battery cables connections on the back of the EBL.
 
EuroTrotters said:
Connect mains power to victron to allow mains charging ?
Click to expand...
The Multiplus charger is 80A, which is too much for routing through the Auxilliary Charger socket on the front of the EBL. So best to go direct to the leisure battery. In that case you'll lose the EBL battery % charge level monitoring, but the voltage readings will still be OK.

Once you have done that, routing the solar through the EBL is not necessary, because the charge monitoring won't be accurate anyway. So you may as well go direct to the battery with the solar too.

The B2B is also less of a problem too. You can just disconnect the starter battery connection to the EBL and use it for the B2B input. If you connect the output straight to the leisure battery, and keep the existing EBL connection to the leisure battery, everything should work as before. Apart from the battery % readings, of course.

If you want accurate % charge level monitoring, you could add a BMV7xx or a SmartShunt, but that's not absolutely essential.

The new mains charger will no longer trickle-charge the starter battery, so some arrangement like a BatteryMaster might be required.
 
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I'm not the best one to ask about B2Bs. I have a 48V LiFePO4 battery, and the only 12V to 48V B2B I could find was a Sterling. It works fine, but I didn't look around comparing different brands like you can if you want 12V to 12V.

You should make sure it's a high enough amps output, but not exceeding what the batteries can accept. Also that it can be set to the correct profile for your battery type. And Lithium if that's on the cards in the future.
 
EuroTrotters said:
Just looking for one I don’t have to connect to the alternator at the moment
Click to expand...
Best to use one that triggers from the D+ on the alternator as if you have solar charging the Starter battery with a basic B2B set up you can end up with the B2B turning on when the battery voltage rises and you end up with it cycling.

You can pick up the D+ connection on the EBL alternatively you can just connect the B2B trigger to a live ignition feed not quite as good as using the D+ but it will only turn on when the ignition is on.
 
Being as the B2B won't be going through the EBL ( as per autorouter ) you could have a higher amp output Votronic one 70 or 90A I think - depending on you batteries max charge rate. The schematic for them (attached) shows the option of putting in a relay ( that they sell) that will the charge the cab battery.
 
I think it's a good idea to make the effort to feed the B2B a D+ (engine running) signal. It's not so hard anyway. The D+ comes in on pin 3 of the 5-way EBL connector, and goes out (to the fridge) on pin 2 of the 4-way connector. You could tap into either of those wires.

Even easier, if you've disconnected the starter battery wire from the EBL (to connect to the B2B input) then the now redundant EBL starter battery connection will act just like a D+ signal. It connects to the Leisure battery when the engine is running, and is disconnected when the engine stops. It might need an inline fuse, maybe 2A.

If the starter battery is only ever charged by the alternator then voltage sensing can work OK, but when you add mains, solar and battery maintainers then unwanted triggering of the B2B can easily happen.
 
autorouter said:
I think it's a good idea to make the effort to feed the B2B a D+ (engine running) signal. It's not so hard anyway. The D+ comes in on pin 3 of the 5-way EBL connector, and goes out (to the fridge) on pin 2 of the 4-way connector. You could tap into either of those wires.

Even easier, if you've disconnected the starter battery wire from the EBL (to connect to the B2B input) then the now redundant EBL starter battery connection will act just like a D+ signal. It connects to the Leisure battery when the engine is running, and is disconnected when the engine stops. It might need an inline fuse, maybe 2A.

If the starter battery is only ever charged by the alternator then voltage sensing can work OK, but when you add mains, solar and battery maintainers then unwanted triggering of the B2B can easily happen.
Click to expand...
Thanks.

don’t mind picking up D+. It was the idea of having to wire to the alternator like the victron one

B08DCEFF-23E4-4855-8FDB-FA4266BB76BA.jpeg

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In the Victron diagram, the red wire to from the B2B to the starter battery/alternator is just the wire that you've disconnected from the EBL starter battery input. There's a permanent connection from the starter battery to the alternator which is left undisturbed.

It's a voltage-sensing B2B. However you could wire the remote on/off terminals to a small relay, with the coil triggered by the D+ signal. That way, it's voltage-sensing while the engine is running, but definitely off when the engine stops - so no unwanted triggering due to voltage rises.
 
autorouter said:
I think it's a good idea to make the effort to feed the B2B a D+ (engine running) signal. It's not so hard anyway. The D+ comes in on pin 3 of the 5-way EBL connector, and goes out (to the fridge) on pin 2 of the 4-way connector. You could tap into either of those wires.

Even easier, if you've disconnected the starter battery wire from the EBL (to connect to the B2B input) then the now redundant EBL starter battery connection will act just like a D+ signal. It connects to the Leisure battery when the engine is running, and is disconnected when the engine stops. It might need an inline fuse, maybe 2A.

If the starter battery is only ever charged by the alternator then voltage sensing can work OK, but when you add mains, solar and battery maintainers then unwanted triggering of the B2B can easily happen.
Click to expand...
If you disconnect the starter battery wire into the EBL, will the fridge still work on 12V when it sees the D+ go high? does that mean the Fridge 12V is coming from the Leisure rather than the Starter battery generally when you have an EBL installation?

You suggest feeding a B2B from the Starter Battery connection you remove from the EBL. Nice and handy, but any issues with the increased current from say a 40A B2B? thinking if it were speced up for an EBL at what? 18A? the cable may be too light for 40A?

Not done anything with EBL99s so any handy tips on disabling the internal split-charge but keeping the various potential functions like 12V Fridge etc still working as previously would be good :)
 
Hoovie said:
You suggest feeding a B2B from the Starter Battery connection you remove from the EBL. Nice and handy, but any issues with the increased current from say a 40A B2B? thinking if it were speced up for an EBL at what? 18A? the cable may be too light for 40A?
Click to expand...
The EBL 101 which I have is fine with up to 50A according to Udo Lang at Schaudt. I expect that the EBL 99 is the same. With the 50A Votronic b2b you can dial down the current if you are concerned.
 
paddymcc said:
The EBL 101 which I have is fine with up to 50A according to Udo Lang at Schaudt. I expect that the EBL 99 is the same. With the 50A Votronic b2b you can dial down the current if you are concerned.
Click to expand...
It is a 30A B2B I am looking at using, but the one I have in mind puts out around 10% extra, so the "40A" I quoted allows for a bit of leeway :)
Thanks for the reply. appreciated.
 
On EBLs, the fridge 12V comes from an independent wire from the starter battery with a 20A fuse on it. That means the main starter battery feed only supplies the split charge relay, so nothing else is lost if it is disconnected. Even the starter battery charging from the mains goes via the fridge wire so that's not lost either.

The main starter battery feed normally has a 50A fuse on it. It is specced for the alternator current when the split charge relay is closed, so it's good for 30 or 40A, or up to 50A according to Schaudt.

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I remembered a while back I was looking at the wiring diagram for the Schaudt WA Booster and that has a nice diagram of how a B2B is added to the EBL ...


EBL-Booster Wiring.png
 

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