Self levelling systems

[Kev and Ju]

Hi all,
So we've only had our Bailey Autograph for 6 weeks and I'm already done with sliding off home made wooden ramps and trying to manoeuvre heavy concrete slabs under the wheels in the rain so we're seriously considering a self levelling system.
We intend to keep the van for a good few years so we may as well get a system installed sooner rather than later to start enjoying its benefits. However as it's a considerable investment (c£5k) we've got to get it right first time. The NEC show should give us a chance to gather info and speak to people 'in the know' but from some initial basic research there appear to be 4 main suppliers these systems being, E&P Hydraulics, HPC Hydraulics, Al-Ko and Towtal who supply the Ma–Ve system.
So any advice good or bad on any of the systems or any that I haven't mentioned would be gratefully received. Cheers all

 

[HandyAndy]

How much payload does your van have and how much of it do you utilise?

 

[Mikeco]

After many years of having and using motorhomes I have never had to move concrete slabs or used wooden ramps.
I have however used the proper ramps made for the job occasionally with not much effort, however, there is no doubt that pushing a button would be easier but it’s an expensive one.

 

[Kev and Ju]

Our MIRO is 3392kg with a 458kg payload totalling 3850kg but we're nowhere near that as we tend to be very weight conscious and travel light. However there's a weighbridge local to me (Worcester) so I'll be running it over that soon just to see exactly where we are.

 

[Hettie's Crew]

HPC is lighter, 40-45kg and comes standard with phone app operation. We went through the same research 18 months ago and settled on the HPC, very glad we did. Fitted by AS at Warrington, very good people to deal with.

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[HandyAndy]

Our MIRO is 3392kg with a 458kg payload totalling 3850kg but we're nowhere near that as we tend to be very weight conscious and travel light. However there's a weighbridge local to me (Worcester) so I'll be running it over that soon just to see exactly where we are.

You can see where I was going with this line of questioning
Good to see you are on the ball with your weight allowances (some people don't have a clue and want to throw everything but the kitchen sink in a van) it's definitely one thing to keep in mind as those jacks, hoses pumps and hydraulics are not light.

 

[Madcaravanner]

You can see where I was going with this line of questioning
Good to see you are on the ball with your weight allowances (some people don't have a clue and want to throw everything but the kitchen sink in a van) it's definitely one thing to keep in mind as those jacks, hoses pumps and hydraulics are not light.

Definitely
Our MPLW is 4250Kg
We loaded and with a full tank of diesel we weighed in at 3950kg
So we KNOW we have space for more if we need but not much and certainly not enough to fit anything else ancillary equipment wise

 

[TinaLes]

Most people that are now on the level use this company as E&P seem to be the favourite system.

Specialist Automotive Products

Cost effective improvements to ride quality, comfort and stability across a wide range of light commercial, leisure, Emergency Service, WAV and PSV vehicles

www.specialistautomotiveproducts.co.uk

Most also travel to see Mick from all over the country, and give glowing reviews of their service & workmanship.
Be Careful however as it normally starts with the E&P levelers then escalates somehow into the full VB air suspension set up also.leaving them at least 10K lighter in the wallet dept.?
I think the E&P leveling system will reduce your payload by at least 65Kilos so you will have deduct that from what you have.
I wouldn't even consider it on a van with less than a mtplm of 3850KG's but I think some Autographs can be upgraded from factory to 4250KG's.
So it depends on what actual payload you have on your Autograph.
Hope that helps.

Les

 

[Mark and Mindy]

We have had the E&P Level System on our 5.4m PVC for a few months and we loved it.

Due to only being a 5.4m van it was a challenge to position the hydraulic pump which is located under the van behind the rear axle and that is now using the prime space where we would upgrade to an underslung LPG gas tank. There is also a control box which is located dead centre under the van. Our van does not have the spare wheel and now a spare wheel is no longer an option.

The additional payload is quoted at 55 kg which is not a problem to us as we have lots of payload to spare. We have weighed our van when fully loaded.

There are remote control options with the E&P Level System. We have the Wi-Fi interface which works with an app on our mobile phones but it is a bit of a faff to use and so the basic remote control which is also available may have been a better choice. However it is much quicker and easier not to use the remote control at all and just use the control panel which is located low down inside the driver's door pillar.

My main piece of advice for anyone considering a leveling system is to give some consideration to the location of the hydraulic jacks. On our van the front jacks are located behind the front wheels and the rear jacks are located behind the rear wheels. If we drive forwards against a kerb then the front wheels touch the curb first and and the jacks are protected. It would be possible to reverse against a high kerb and the jacks could strike the kerb. If the jacks can be located inside the wheel base then it could be preferable. Regardless of where the jacks are located there may be a risk of grounding them out if you had to drive over a kerb.

A bonus for having a leveling system is that when dumping your grey water you can tilt the van to the side and all the water gushes out quickly.

Mark

 

[Lenny HB]

As you have only had the van 6 weeks I think you need to use it for a few months to see how your weight goes. IMO 485kg is a low payload and I wouldn't think you have enough spare to fit jack's.

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[Jezzerr]

We fitted E&P to Burstner 720. weight of kit was circa 45kg I believe. Really enjoy the benefits.
Makes life very easy and stress free!

 

[Just smiffy]

In 4yrs and 40k miles we have probably used our milenco triple’s around 20 times.... that’s about £250 a pop.... a lot of plastic ramps...

but I can see the attraction of levellers....?

 

[Ninjabob]

Go for E&P with SAP Doncaster. I have the system on my Autograph 75-2. I originally had a MAVE system fitted but had to have it removed because it simply did not work properly. The backup from Towtal the importers to the company who installed it was lacking. Gimmicks like using your mobile phone to operate any system are a recipe for disaster. The E&P comes with a dedicated remote and the system works as it should. Weight wise don't forget you will remove the jack.

 

[Lanerboy]

E&P for me but I am 4500kg so no issues but I would not be without it now
I think it may have even saved my marriage at times ???

 

[SpeedyDux]

In 4yrs and 40k miles we have probably used our milenco triple’s around 20 times.... that’s about £250 a pop.... a lot of plastic ramps...

but I can see the attraction of levellers....?

I've used our Fiamma ones only 3 times in 2 seasons. I tend to be quite choosy about reasonably level pitches. You also get a feel for the small dips and bumps under the wheels so a little bit of manoevering gets us level enough not to bother with the lumps of plastic. Obviously hydraulic levellers would get the job done with ease but £5k seems a lot.

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[Vipar]

Can levellers be fitted to the back only as I can’t get my van level on my front garden. I find it frustrating not being able to run the fridge.

 

[Theonlysue]

Speak to mick at SAP. He fits the e&p which I have, but has lighter ones for panel Vans and caravans. They can be moved to another you if you sell.

 

[big map]

We had our self levelling kit fitted by Essanjay in Poole. Very happy with the quality of the product and the service

 

[Lenny HB]

I had full air suspension fitted I wouldn't bother to add levelers as most of the time we can level on the suspension only used ramps once since having it fitted.
Don't think we would want levelers we would miss the van rocking in the wind which we love.

 

[BillandHelen]

Kev, we have E&P levellers fitted by Mick at SAP. Would highly recommend Mick, he does the air suspension for ambulance fleets and is the leading uk expert for E&P. More importantly he and Gill are lovely people to deal with, give amazing aftercare service and really care about what they do. Oh and I’ve also got full air on the van, great combination!!
If money not the issue, go for it, you’ll love them!!
Bill

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[GROMIT69]

We have a ih van conversion, we had E&P fitted by Mick and his team at SAP Doncaster, nothing was to much trouble and you can stay there over night or in a local pub / BB down the road , they also had a car you could borrow when we went , took a day and a half to fit ,one of the best things we have bought for a long time , I think there is a discount code if you are a MF member

 

[Greenway]

We have E&P. I did struggle with the £5k cost but my wife really thought the benefits outweighed the cost (nearly).
However it's one of those things that, once you have had it, it would be hard to be without.
Having removed the jack and levelling ramps from the motorhome I also removed the rear steadies to save weigh (every little helps).
Another benefit is being able to use the waste water drain setting, which in my case removed a extra 15 litres of waste water and which in tern has reduced the smell.
The van is also much better in strong wind with a lot less rocking, which could also be a benefit at other times.
BTW it's also great for levelling the van

 

[Riverbankannie]

In 4yrs and 40k miles we have probably used our milenco triple’s around 20 times.... that’s about £250 a pop.... a lot of plastic ramps...

but I can see the attraction of levellers....?

Only used ramps about 5 times on our 4 years with current van.
I can see though, once you’ve had them you wouldn’t be without. Rather like electric windows, central locking and heated cab seats!

 

[Mikey RV]

I have GlideRite on mine. Was on there when I bought it but must admit I do like having it on there.

 

[Hettie's Crew]

Gimmicks like using your mobile phone to operate any system are a recipe for disaster.

Having owned and operated the HPC system for over 18months with phone app I can say from experience that it is faultless. We both have the app on our phones so either one of us can operate it from inside or out of the van. This is just one aspect of the HPC system that reduces the weigh to 40-45kg rather than the 50-70kg of the E&P system.
Four alloy bodied jacks and a pump, no ‘brain box’ or remote to add to the bulk.
We nearly went with the E&P at SAP because Mick is very very good and Doncaster is only 3/4 of an hour from us but in the end chose to make the crap 2 1/2 hour motorway journey across to Warrington for the HPC at AS Suspension.
Phil and Cath at AS are brilliant and just as knowledgeable and inventive as Mick at SAP.

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[Kev and Ju]

Hi all,
A fantastic response and some superb advice from informed users of various SL systems. Although I'd like to, I cant reply to you all individually but your comments are all well noted and make perfect sense.
Well, E&P does seem the way to go with HPC a close 2nd. The Ma-Ve system seems to be out of the running as none of you have gone for it and the ones that have dont like it.
Strange that no one has mentioned the Al-Ko self leveling system as the Autograph is based on their chassis. Its also compatible with Fiat / Ducato / Peugeot Boxer chassis which therefore cover a huge range of MHs. I've been in touch with an Al-Ko retailer who will be getting back to me on Monday with a price / availability.
These systems really are swings and roundabouts and its not all about the advantages. Theres an awful lot to consider and at this moment we're just considering our options as to whether to pursue it. On the balance of probabilities I think we may well do so when we find the right system. I dont want to sound like an advert but apart from the one obvious benefit for me the others include.......

1. Reduced chance of theft from our pitch with none of the wheels on the ground.
2. No rocking when walking around.
3. Better sink / shower drainage.
4. No chassis twist so doors / roller blinds / cupboards fit / close correctly.
5. Fridge works correctly.
6. Ease of wheel changing in the event of a puncture.
7. No flat spots on tyres over the winter.

Its a no brainer isn't it?

Thanks again and I'll update when I have any news!

update - Just had a natter with Phil and Cath (AS Air Suspension - HPC System) who are at the NEC so will be meeting up tomorrow.

 

[Two on Tour]

We had our E&P system fitted a SAP and have been more than pleased with it.
We leave our van up on the jacks with the wheel off the ground when at home to take the load off the tyre and to give potential thieves something to scratch their heads over.
The overall weight added by fitting the E&P system in our case was reduced by not now having to carrying the two sets of levelling ramps at 11.5Kg and the jack at 6.5Kg, so 17Kg knocked of the E&P weight.

 

[Kim H]

We have Goldschmitt levellers on ours and it really is a case of once you’ve had them, you’d find it hard to do without them. We had a slow puncture a couple of weeks ago and it was so easy to lift the van, remove the wheel and get it sorted. One other thing that is a plus for us on our system is that we can PIN lock the jacks once deployed.....one more thing to slow down a potential thief.

 

[63720]

I only use ramps if the freezer won't work but this is one mod I would like if I had the payload. I might look again when I've swapped my 2 leisure batteries for a lithium when they've had it.

 

[Alex and Lesley]

Kev and Ju We had the first set of the AL-KO Hy4 system fitted in the UK in August at the factory as a bit of a test bed, this system will be rolled out through the E&P fitting network so you have the choice of either system from these “preferred” fitters.

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