Restrictions that result in lack of facilities for motorhomes

monzer

monzer

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I have been advised to write to my local MSP to highlight the lack of facilities for us in this country and before I do I just want to see what the consensus is on the forum as to the reasons that facilities are so hard to come by.

First of all am I right in saying that it is the Caravan Sites and Control of Development Act 1960 that is the main set of regulations that we feel needs modernised?

Secondly, do you agree with me that it is more aire type stop-overs that we need instead of better/more campsites?

Any other thoughts and ideas welcome.
 
I think we have a lot of campsites, but also a lot are closed for winter, which is the owners decision because of costs. Aires would be great but I think would get abused. A real shame as the uk is such a nice place to tour. (y)
 
I think the primary reason facilities are hard to come by is the NIMBY attitude of not only local counsellors but also their voters.

To them:
Motor-homes/Caravans = 'Outsiders' = Undesirables (Gypsies/Travellers) Mess and Thefts.

Therefore outside of primary tourist areas I do not see any progress being made.
Inside tourist areas the same attitude also prevails, but at least local business may be able to make a case that a facility helps the local businesses.

Remember in France (and other countries followed suit) central and regional governments made funds available to encourage local villages and towns to set up camp sites, Aires and other things that encourage inter-country tourism, and therefore help the local economy.
In the UK, people do not want to encourage 'outsiders' into their area, even rich ones.
 
the big problem is our archaic car park laws which class sleeping as camping followed by the real fear of abuse by travelers all of which could be covered by having a simple 24 or 48 hour time limit good luck I have been campaigning for a few years now to get this parking law changed. I have given up lately a health is not great so got better things to spend my time on. good luck
 
Because Camp Sites require staff they are expensive to run, hence Winter closure.

Aire type facilities, even if a small charge is made like some French ones, would be a great way forward.

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The difference is that on the continent the inside of your vehicle is counted as a private space. So what you do in that space can't be proscribed. As long as it is legal to park, its legal to sleep, cook, use the loo etc.
 
The UK needs aires and some progressive councils to provide them. I’m pretty sure the 1960 Caravan act doesn’t prevent councils providing aires as there are already some in the UK, (Canterbury and Bury St Edmunds to name 2)
And the Traveller/ Gypsy excuse could be negated quite easily by providing barriered aires.
Anyway, good luck, you’ll need it, there are just too many people who will naturally oppose everything that they themselves don’t want to do or are interested in.
 
I am not sure that camp sites are expensive to run in winter as to the reason (although they are). But more as to what their local council has put into their annual contract. i.e. 8 month only opening.
 
The British attitude is our own worst enemy. Aires would have limited capacity because authorities see any two MHs or caravans parked closer together than 6 metres as a fire risk/health & safety issue.

The second problem is the attitude of the great British public. "I can do anything I like" no longer seems to be confined to minority sections of our society.

Last year in France, we spent 3 nights in a MH dedicated area on the edge of a Super-U car park, with several other vans. On the Sunday, morning when the supermarket was closed, a large number of modified cars started to arrive in a dignified manner and parked up in neat rows, whereupon the occupants got out and proceeded to have a quiet and civilised picnic. After a couple of hours, they got back in their cars and drove out in an orderly fashion.

Contrast that with our enthusiasts who would likely either be racing around performing donuts and slides or playing their sound systems at maximum volume trying to outdo each other.

The hospital car parks where my wife works used to have entry and exit barriers, and visitors paid for the time used on exit. But they were continually (and I mean continually) being vandalised and broken off,so visitors now have to guess how long they will be staying and pay on arrival.

Translate that to unsupervised aires and they will very quickly become open to all with dumped and burnt-out cars, fly-tipping and all sorts of other anti-social behaviours taking place.
 
Deneb said:
Last year in France, we spent 3 nights in a MH dedicated area on the edge of a Super-U car park, with several other vans. On the Sunday, morning when the supermarket was closed, a large number of modified cars started to arrive in a dignified manner and parked up in neat rows, whereupon the occupants got out and proceeded to have a quiet and civilised picnic. After a couple of hours, they got back in their cars and drove out in an orderly fashion.
Click to expand...
:ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO: Thanks for this quote, made me smile

Seriously though, you're sadly right, I think that if a network of Aires were to be set up in this country then they would be abused by the few and headlines would be made of the fact by our attention-grabbing media
 
If there was sufficient demand in winter to make it economically viable more sites would stay open (provided that they have enough hard standing pitches rather than grass, plus a frost-proof water network).
In my experience very many commercial sites in France (even well down South) have a shorter opening season than do those in the U.K.

In the U.K. we just don't have the (unused) land available for Aires as they do, say, in France. Any scrap of land with permitted development is too valuable as housing, warehousing etc. to make it available for m/home parking.
It also seems to me that far more public car parks in the U.K. have height barriers than do those 'abroad'.
 
I am a bit concerned that CMC and CCC may sometimes be seen by Government and Local Authorities as representing the views of motor-homers, caravaners and campers. With so many sites including the CLs/CSs under their control could they possibly have a vested interest in keeping casual stops such as aires and wild spots to a minimum? I hope not.

It might be worth pointing out to your MSP that whilst the big clubs have many members this might be because it is difficult to camp in the UK without using their sites but that they do not necessarily represent the views of all their members.
 
Allanm said:
And the Traveller/ Gypsy excuse could be negated quite easily by providing barriered aires.
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Sadly that does not work
A site set up specifically for travellers ended up being blocked off because:
They complained when there was no water.. The reason there was no water is cos they took the tap off and hammered a bit of wood down the hole. Several times
The barriers were lockable and they were given keys upon request.
Barriers were in place less than a week before they got busy with a gas axe and sold the metal for scrap. Twice.. Turned up in a scrap yard less than a mile away

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It would seem that one of our local councils is one of the few with the foresight to make motorhome specific parking places. These are for overnights. There are places in Skipton, Settle and Ingleton that are marked as only for motorhomes. If this forward thinking council can do it why can’t others? I have not seen these places abused by anyone yet.
 
Much is made of the French Aires system, I've used it extensively and yes it would be nice to have something similar. But we're not the poor relations here. I don't see a lack of facilities.

IMO this country's CL/CS system takes some beating. 3500 of them all over the country and most under £12 a night. The French I've spoken to love our CL's. Add to that 1200 pubs and Britsops that officially welcome motorhomes and a lot more that do it if you ask.

If you want to fight the government there are more worthy battles, the system we have is superb (y)
 
Jim said:
Much is made of the French Aires system, I've used it extensively and yes it would be nice to have something similar. But we're not the poor relations here. I don't see a lack of facilities.

IMO this country's CL/CS system takes some beating. 3500 of them all over the country and most under £12 a night. The French I've spoken to love our CL's. Add to that 1200 pubs and Britsops that officially welcome motorhomes and a lot more that do it if you ask.

If you want to fight the government there are more worthy battles, the system we have is superb (y)
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I think you are right, but, if you don't like paying !!
 
If Councils just thought things through a little. Open car parks with no facilities or barriers allowing a one or two night stay would probably not be abused too much. Better for it to be HARDER to get water or dump in a way.
We just spent a night at the sea life centre Scarborough car park. Free to park, no restrictions or facilities. By the time it was dark there were probably 10 Motorhomes there. No harm no foul
 
monzer said:
I have been advised to write to my local MSP to highlight the lack of facilities for us in this country and before I do I just want to see what the consensus is on the forum as to the reasons that facilities are so hard to come by.

First of all am I right in saying that it is the Caravan Sites and Control of Development Act 1960 that is the main set of regulations that we feel needs modernised?

Secondly, do you agree with me that it is more aire type stop-overs that we need instead of better/more campsites?

Any other thoughts and ideas welcome.
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The only problem is that if they were free how would you keep the Tinkers out, thinking about it they would still use chargeable sites but refuse to pay.
How do the keep them out in other countries?
Have posted above without reading thread which has this covered.

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Last edited:
Jaws said:
Sadly that does not work
A site set up specifically for travellers ended up being blocked off because:
They complained when there was no water.. The reason there was no water is cos they took the tap off and hammered a bit of wood down the hole. Several times
The barriers were lockable and they were given keys upon request.
Barriers were in place less than a week before they got busy with a gas axe and sold the metal for scrap. Twice.. Turned up in a scrap yard less than a mile away
Click to expand...
Keep um North of the M4 I say
 
Something in the OP caught my eye.
"First of all am I right in saying that it is the Caravan Sites and Control of Development Act 1960 that is the main set of regulations that we feel needs modernised?"

Exactly !!!

As we sit here in our fully winterised, self contained, motor CARAVAN (on purpose) could I challenge anyone in charge of our legislative assemblies North, South, or East of whatever border, to show any of us, 100 examples of ANYTHING resembling what we have today.

No, I didn't think it possible either.

What we have today in the shape of Camper, Motorhome, Gin Palace wasn't a twinkle in any designers eye in 1960 and as a result, the above Legislation is a dinosaur as respects the modern vehicle or the restrictions imposed upon it's use.

Rant over, back to the vino!!!
 
As for the, shall we say, 'Tinkers' referred to earlier.

Whilst I have no first hand knowledge of any incident occurring 'Over the Water' (France) I can only imagine the scene.
'Tinker(s)' arrive on an official Aire.
Short time later Gendarme arrives and, should there be ANY argument, 'Tinker(s)' arrested.

Not so in the UK. However, our PM has made it known that there will be a change in legislation.
Watch this space. ( )<<<<Space
 
Please excuse my ignorance, but what is a "tinker"…?
 
I think Weymouth is a prime example of some where that would benefit from an aire, i have a static caravan in Weymouth and know the area well. The problem for MH owners is there are no sites near to the town centre so once on site you need to cycle or get a bus into town plus sites are very very limited down there mainly Haven sites really, the cl sites are miles away from the beach.

Well they have just knocked down the old condor ferry terminal and the sealife tower and this area would make an ideal aire. You could get a good 20 + MH on this part of the car park then its a 5 minute walk into town at a slow pace.
There a about 5 places for MH's to park in this car park but you are not allowed to sleep there but can park over night.

An ideal opportunity for Weymouth to lead the way but i doubt they will, loads of people would park there then spend money in the town shops and food outlets but councils cant see this
 
I don't think anyone really takes notice of the caravan act 1960 here in Scotland . Look at "The Slanj " for starters.

I've been pushing in trying to get 2 Scottish towns to develop a chemical waste point to be beneficial to tourism.

Just yesterday in response to my comments made on their article , I had an email from "The Courier" asking for my views on the "Pitlochry car park " being full at NY. I've given them numerous examples of how we need more facilities in Scotland and links to the towns that already cater to a degree for motorhomes up here.
 
urban_biker said:
The difference is that on the continent the inside of your vehicle is counted as a private space. So what you do in that space can't be proscribed. As long as it is legal to park, its legal to sleep, cook, use the loo etc.
Click to expand...

I thought the inside of your vehicle was private space here as well.

Do the police not have to ask to look through your vehicle, generally?
 

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