Proposed change to the Highway Code (1 Viewer)

[funflair]

Interesting discussion around proposed changed to the Highway Code to make drivers give priority to cyclists and pedestrians when turning.

I can certainly see it making cycle lanes safer when they cross a road close to the junction as the cyclist would have the right of way.

https://www.britishcycling.org.uk/c...ian-groups-in-call-for-junction-rule-change-0

Martin

 

[daveandsan]

I will just go and get me popcorn.

 

[Emmit]

I thought that it already stated in the HC that motorists should give way to pedestrians at junctions.

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[GJH]

I thought that it already stated in the HC that motorists should give way to pedestrians at junctions.

Yes, the Extra Care section seems to cover it.
Before making changes, making people abide by what exists would be a start.
I was stopped at these traffic lights this morning, pouring with rain. A cyclist holding a golf umbrella in his left hand and the handlebar in his right left the refuge on the right, crossed the road passing the central traffic light on my side (rather than cross the central refuge) and the crossed onto the pavement at the side of the bridge.
If anything had gone wrong he would, no doubt, have been the first to complain.

 

[johnp10]

Cyclists are users of vehicles on the road, nothing more.
They are not a special case, even though the arrogance of some of them makes them think they are.
Education of cyclists would be of greater value to road users in general rather than forcing people who have been tested for competence in road use to pander to these people and take on responsibility for cyclists incompetent stupidity.
I know many cyclists are also car drivers, please don't come out with the usual "I have been tested, I pay road tax on my forty vehicles, etc" rubbish, all of which goes out of the window when most folk get on a bike.
They seem to think the Highway Code and common courtesy to other road users don't apply to them.
For a good example of lack of manners and consideration for others watch the lycra idiots on canal towpaths.
Many think footpaths are cycle paths, they having priority over pedestrians.

All of this doesn't apply to all cyclists by any means, but it doesn't have to be all of them for one clown to get himself killed for the cycling world to cry foul.

Change the Highway Code by all means, but change it to make the cyclist actually cycle more safely by imposing the same level of penalties for misdeeds as "enjoyed" by the motorist.
Moving the onus for their safety away from them to the ordinary, tax paying motorist is not the way forward, it would simply reinforce the current levels of bad road behaviour.

I pay road tax, not the cyclist.
That should give ME priority, not the cyclist.

Sit back and wait for:
I never do it.....
I pay road tax on my car....(irrelevant)..
It's always the car driver's fault.....
Lorry drivers are cyclist hating scum....
It only happens in the cities...
etc.

 

[funflair]

Of course "road tax" doesn't exist anymore.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-23694438

Martin

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[frogijock]

A better change would be making all cyclists licensed by taking a test having insurance and a registration number on their bike, as at present they can cause an accident, cycle off and there is no way of identifying them.

 

[gus-lopez]

Interesting discussion around proposed changed to the Highway Code to make drivers give priority to cyclists and pedestrians when turning.

I can certainly see it making cycle lanes safer when they cross a road close to the junction as the cyclist would have the right of way.



Martin

I see a multitude of rear end collisions.

I was stopped at these traffic lights this morning, pouring with rain. A cyclist holding a golf umbrella in his left hand and the handlebar in his right left the refuge on the right, crossed the road passing the central traffic light on my side (rather than cross the central refuge) and the crossed onto the pavement at the side of the bridge.
If anything had gone wrong he would, no doubt, have been the first to complain.

Which is still illegal under road traffic rules in that a cyclist must dismount & cross as a pedestrian.

 

[funflair]

Possibly if cycle paths were safer in this country more cyclists would use them and leave the roads to the car and wagons to fight between themselves.

By safer I mean a system like they have in the Netherlands where cars give way to cycles at points where they cross roads, this would make our town cycle routes so much safer for cyclists to use and does not impede the vehicle in its overall journey time, indeed it would make journeys quicker for vehicles as cycles would be on the cycle routes not the road so the vehicles would have no need to slow down and Passau cyclist at a safe distance when safe to do so.

I think this "proposed" change/addition to the Highway Code would just put into law the common courtesy that many vehicle drivers already show to cyclists and pedestrians.

Martin

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[GJH]

Which is still illegal under road traffic rules in that a cyclist must dismount & cross as a pedestrian.

Exactly - that's why I used it to illustrate my point about making people abide by what exists first

 

[Gizmouk]

I spend a lot of time driving in London - despite all the warnings, it's still very common for cyclists to ride up the inside of large vehicles at junction. Personally, I honestly don't give a hoot about anyone who dumb enough to take such a stupid risk (the gene pool is better off without them). However, I do feel sorry for whoever it is who gets the job of jet washing their remains off the lorry.
Harsh ? not really ...
Maybe if cyclists used a bit of common sense and employed slight modicum of self preservation whilst surrounded by traffic we wouldn't have to spoon feed the lower end of the intelligence scale.

 

[funflair]

I see a multitude of rear end collisions.

It works very well in many countries on the Continent, so why not here with a bit of education and concideration all round.

Martin

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[GJH]

Possibly if cycle paths were safer in this country more cyclists would use them and leave the roads to the car and wagons to fight between themselves.

By safer I mean a system like they have in the Netherlands where cars give way to cycles at points where they cross roads, this would make our town cycle routes so much safer for cyclists to use and does not impede the vehicle in its overall journey time, indeed it would make journeys quicker for vehicles as cycles would be on the cycle routes not the road so the vehicles would have no need to slow down and Passau cyclist at a safe distance when safe to do so.

I think this "proposed" change/addition to the Highway Code would just put into law the common courtesy that many vehicle drivers already show to cyclists and pedestrians.

Martin

I agree that such a system would be safer but, as with so many other matters, practices in the UK have developed differently and would cost a huge amount to reform. Having said that, I suggested to our council cycling officer several years ago that a number of wide paths which people habitually cycled on could be made dual use at a reasonably low cost. Nothing has been done but goodness knows how much has been spent on a cycle circuit and velodrome which are of little use to anyone but cycling clubs.

Even where safe cycle paths do exist some cyclists (normally the Lycra clad rather than the general population) refuse to use them. I recall one incident a couple of years ago when we were driving along the A1046 towards Haverton Hill. There is a perfectly adequate, and safe, cycle path along the side of the road but we came across a bunch of cyclists on a charity ride who preferred to straggle across the road instead.

It is incumbent on all of us as motor vehicle drivers to show common courtesy to cyclists and pedestrians (and horse riders) but it is also incumbent on them to show the same courtesy to other road users

 

[GWAYGWAY]

What about the stupid Ba***s who ride flat out down the outside of the lane swerve left up onto the pavement along the pavement down the gutter to the kerb again through the lights at red and across the traffic crossing, only to get caught by a vehicle going through on the green and then claims they were hit by a dangerous driver. I ride a bike sometimes but I follow the rules and do not like being insulted by others on bike for getting in their way whilst waiting at lights. Some of them are super aggressive and dangerous, others are pathetically inept and dangerous as they seem to not understand anything. As for the idiots that do not NEED any lights at night.

 

[Minxy]

It works very well in many countries on the Continent, so why not here with a bit of education and concideration all round.

Martin

If you mean that vehicles have to stop for cyclists/pedestrians crossing when you are turning a corner I beg to differ. This makes cyclists/pedestrians just walk across without even looking as they 'know' they can and are not at fault ... no regard is given by them as to whether it is safe to do so! They then use this attitude most of the time and its a nightmare trying to then progress as you can get a steady stream of them across the road so you go no-where and end up with massive traffic built ups behind you.

What I also find stupid is the traffic lights that let you turn but then as you do there's a ruddy pedestrian crossing on green!!! Absolute madness! The best traffic lights are those that change to flashing amber to let you know you can turn but only if safe to do so, at least that way you know you have to be careful.

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[normanandsue]

Those of you who know will you answer this for me please? Overtaking in the UK is always to be carried out by passing the vehicle on the right, undertaking is illegal, (at least in my understanding) so why at a junction when a cyclist rides up the left hand side of a queue of vehicles and then gets trapped as the lead vehicle turns left is it the vehicle drivers fault? If that vehicle is a lorry there is no way he can leave enough room to allow the cyclist to turn left along side him. (assuming the cyclist is turning left and not going straight on)

 

[Gromett]

A better change would be making all cyclists licensed by taking a test having insurance and a registration number on their bike, as at present they can cause an accident, cycle off and there is no way of identifying them.

In Guatemala (Semuc Champey at least) all bikes have to have a license number on their back and on the back of their helmet. Still not sure why this can't be done here for cyclists.

Cheap enough....

 

[GJH]

Cheap enough....

Per cycle maybe but with Link Removed not in total

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[rangi]

Yes!! I have finally got the answer to something that has been a bit of a puzzle lately. Thank you Funsters what brain boxes you lot are.

This bit about Cyclists that have riden up the inside of a truck waiting for the lights to change before turning left

Once the truck has squashed'em flat !

That's what everyone in the media is calling JAMs

Cheers funsters I can now rest easy once my silver (Highlights!!!) curls hit the pillow

 

[eddie]

Would we need new rules if the rules we had about undertaking were observed?

 

[busby]

It doesn't matter what laws they pass we don't have any Police on the roads and streets here in Derbyshire,,its anarchy ,,BUSBY..

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[Abacist]

Those of you who know will you answer this for me please? Overtaking in the UK is always to be carried out by passing the vehicle on the right, undertaking is illegal, (at least in my understanding) so why at a junction when a cyclist rides up the left hand side of a queue of vehicles and then gets trapped as the lead vehicle turns left is it the vehicle drivers fault? If that vehicle is a lorry there is no way he can leave enough room to allow the cyclist to turn left along side him. (assuming the cyclist is turning left and not going straight on)

Having difficulty believing that this is right but that's just my gut reaction. They are likely to be in a blind spot if they do so and frankly deserve what they get for their stupidity!

I also have great difficulty in understanding why a special area for pedal cyclists is now at the front of the queue at traffic lights who then immediately block the progress of the cars behind and its not designed to be used by motorcyclists or scooters etc! Aaaargh!

In Canada they have an excellent system so that, if at traffic lights there is nothing coming from your left you can turn right on a red light. We could reverse that rule to allow turning left on a red light if there is nothing coming from the right. They also allow undertaking which is eminently sensible to get past middle and outside lane hoggers!

 

[MC 55 FUN]

Those of you who know will you answer this for me please? Overtaking in the UK is always to be carried out by passing the vehicle on the right, undertaking is illegal, (at least in my understanding)

Undertaking, or passing on the left, is both permissible & legal on U.K. roads under certain circumstances as detailed in the H.C.

 

[eddie]

Undertaking, or passing on the left, is both permissible & legal on U.K. roads under certain circumstances as detailed in the H.C.

I think it quite clearly states against it when the undertaken vehicle is indicating and turning left

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[MC 55 FUN]

I think it quite clearly states against it when the undertaken vehicle is indicating and turning left

Agreed, that circumstance is indeed a fact that only the suicidal would ignore . . .

 

[eddie]

I have said this so many times over the years!

When I am driving my camper, I can't see why the car drivers are in such a hurry
When I am driving my Car, I can't see why cyclists are soooo stupid
When I am riding my bike, I can't see why car drivers are such dick heads and pedestrians have a suicide gene
When I am walking I can't understand why van drivers, car drivers and cyclists are such idiots and want to drive like dickheads!

Mind you the other day my wife commented that I get road rage, walking!

 

[johnp10]

Of course "road tax" doesn't exist anymore.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-23694438

Martin

Try telling DVLA that.
They still use the term "tax" both verbally and in writing.
The only change in terms if road tax is terminology.
We now refer to either "road fund licence" or more often "vehicle excise duty".
Either way, the duty, fund payments or whatever is a tax.
Not a tax on road use, but a tax on vehicle ownership.
Tax none the less?

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[PeteH]

We`ve been here before!. IF the moronic generation exhibited common sense we might get somewhere, BUT as usual the Parliamentary morons, supported by the bureaucratic morons will inevitably make some stupid and unnecessary "law" (always BAD law that) which is designed to inflict financial pain upon those who already pay the most supporting the morons who believe it is their "given" right to act stupidly. As for cyclists. What part of "if you cannot see my mirrors I cannot see you" and " the left side of my vehicle is my BLIND side," do they FAIL to understand? is it the noticeable lack of English comprehension current in society?. Or has the British Gene Pool already been so diluted as to (in)breed morons?.

 

[Ricardoe]

I have said this so many times over the years!

When I am driving my camper, I can't see why the car drivers are in such a hurry
When I am driving my Car, I can't see why cyclists are soooo stupid
When I am riding my bike, I can't see why car drivers are such dick heads and pedestrians have a suicide gene
When I am walking I can't understand why van drivers, car drivers and cyclists are such idiots and want to drive like dickheads!

thats brilliant..I had the misfortune to use a bus the other day and found myself cursing under my breath everytime it stopped!

 

[DavidG58]

If a cyclist is already waiting at a red light close to the kerb, a vehicle pulls alongside the cyclist to their right, does the mortised vehicle then have a right to make a left turn over the top of the cyclist?

Even if they are both turning left it would be very tight if they both went together

I say the cyclist has right of way to go left or straight on before the car turns left, or they can both go straight on together

Most days when out driving I cringe at how close vehicles think they can pass by bikes and this is just on a straight road, some new laws are being enforced around here and other parts of the UK, actually possibly old laws not new, where you must pass by with at least a 1m gap to any cyclist, it might even be a much bigger gap than that

I fully support that law but maybe it should also be reversed, in that a cyclist should never be allowed to attempt to go through a gap of say less than 2m, between vehicles and the kerb or two vehicles, that might stop all these sort of accidents overnight, particularly if vehicles had to apply to apply the same passing gap even when one was stopped, they wouldn't be able to pull alongside at lights and have to queue behind like they would any other road user

and I am with Eddie on the pedestrian rage, cars have so little respect for pedestrians, space, splashing etc etc

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