Preparing for a winter trip...to the snow

[Surfstar]

Hi all.
The family and I (and dogs) and been travelling for the last 3 months around the usual spots in France and Spain and have decided to go against the grain this winter and plan a trip to the snow/mountains of the Alps and then up to the nordics. It’s a brave decision and we have experience in snow driving and motorhoming in the cold. However I thought I would ask the universe what essentials you think should come with us on a prolonged winter trip in minus temps. Snow chains, winter tyres, window foils, thermals etc etc

thanks all and would be happy if you know of any links to others who have covered this topic (that I couldn’t find)

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[Vipar]

All power to your elbow. Hope you send us scaredy-cats some pictures

 

[PJGWiltshire]

It sounds like you have some experience. From our trips, snow chains and thermal windscreen covers a must. It appears you have double floor van. Still sitting around long term in sub zero can still catch you out. I always have the grey tap open and empty straight into bucket and empty before the bucket freezes. Like wise with the fresh water, I use 5 ltr bottles for instant water in case the main tank froze as when we went off skiing low heating was on. I assume you will be on sites but when we wild the heating is always on thus the tanks have heat and thus do not freeze and then have water for showers.

 

[Surfstar]

It sounds like you have some experience. From our trips, snow chains and thermal windscreen covers a must. It appears you have double floor van. Still sitting around long term in sub zero can still catch you out. I always have the grey tap open and empty straight into bucket and empty before the bucket freezes. Like wise with the fresh water, I use 5 ltr bottles for instant water in case the main tank froze as when we went off skiing low heating was on. I assume you will be on sites but when we wild the heating is always on thus the tanks have heat and thus do not freeze and then have water for showers.

I thought we had experience but tonight we’ve just been caught out in Lancaster where it’s minus 2 and our grey tanks and outlet are not lagged or insulated ? I just know the waste water will be frozen! Planning to get the tank insulated before we go.
thanks for the other advice

 

[Brains]

It's all about heating.

I'd be thinking of several backups should the main heating not be enough or fail completely (due to no electricity or no gas)

As a minimum take hot water bottles, 4 season sleeping bags, multi-tog duvets, plus an oil filled electric radiator and a separate gas bottle powered one.



I've spent quite a bit of time on Norway in the winter
It's cold
It's dark most of the day (and at the top end it's dark all of the 'day')
Everything is closed, or shuts early
Even the Norwegian hibernate during the winter
The snow does not melt, so everything is icy underneath
It's eyewateringly expensive, even day to day items.
Alcohol: Dont bother. £10-12 for a pint of Karlsburg (BYO)
Did I mention the cold and the dark ?

On the plus side, you may get to see the Aurora Borialis and go for a ride with huskies either of which could make the trip worth while

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[Southdowners]

If your tanks froze in -2c you’ll need to find out what temperature your vehicle is winterised to withstand. I posted recently about our water pump freezing in -22c.

Our vehicle is winterised to -30c but in the recent models of our vehicle the pump has been moved to the garage, hence the issue. The garage is heated but obviously the heat wasn’t enough to prevent freezing due to the pump’s location in a recess at low level. Our outlet valves are all in a heated locker. The pump worked fine until we went below -20.

If things do freeze life will become very uncomfortable for you!

We have snow chains but didn’t use them as we have winter tyres - they’re brilliant. We didn’t see anyone using chains by the way although some had studded winter tyres.

Items to take... a snow shovel and an adventurous spirit!

 

[peterc10]

I suspect the most important thing you need is a fully winterised motorhome. Tanks need more than just insulation, they need to be heated via the motorhome's heating system. The design of the plumbing runs is also important in order to ensure there are no cold spots.

 

[SteveandSue]

Treat the Alps & Scandinavia as different trips/requirements.
Skiing in the Alps it is pretty easy to retreat to lower altitudes when weather is very severe or you want the van thoroughly defrosting, You can sleep low and ski high. The days can be pretty warm in the sun and get things warmed up. Fair few sites and aires with power close to the slopes all makes things much easier. If your first ski trip in the van mix in sites as helps with drying rooms - storing skis etc.
Scandinavia the cold can be just continuous and you cant escape it - needs bit more preparation and thinking.

 

[Southdowners]

Treat the Alps & Scandinavia as different trips/requirements.

Scandinavia the cold can be just continuous and you cant escape it - needs bit more preparation and thinking.

I can vouch for the above, we had to go back into Norway from Sweden as the temperature there was higher. Where we were in Sweden the temps were due to go down even further. It was no big deal for us as we move on constantly but if you’d planned on staying somewhere for a while it could scupper your plans.

 

[Surfstar]

Fantastic responses on this thread. Thank you all. My main takeaways are the need for a secondary heat source that can be run from our leisure / EHU and also to treat the alps/Scandinavia as two different animals. Our van is not prepared for Scandinavia winters and would take some serious mods that we will struggle to do whilst fulltime in our van.
Thank to all so far on this ?

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[tacr2man]

Insulating tanks just slows the freezing down , when its very cold you only have one answer , put heat into the area you dont want freezing . just to frighten you

 

[Brains]

Remember you will need propane not butane in your gas bottles (Butane freezes at about -5c).

Also get local diesel, which has antifreeze in it.
Diesel from southern England for example will start to coagulate at about -5c

 

[Jenben]

We use our van to go skiing and have been in ski resorts where temperature is down to -25 ish overnight.

Fill up fuel near the ski resorts as they have winter diesel (often marked as such on pumps)

essentials in our personal view
Silver screen
Camping mats (cut to fit) covering all windows and roof lights to keep heat in once the sun goes down
Airing van once a day is important to get rid of condensation
Leave your heat on (even if just low) constantly as this keeps the pipes warm even when you are out.
Good snow shovel
Tow rope
Snow chains
Some means of getting to the snow and ice on your roof to clear this off

A milk crate is useful to get in and out of the van (don’t leave electric step out ) and you can kick snow/ice off as you enter van.

 

[Jenben]

Also check the positioning of your silver screen, particularly if you have a standard fiat/ford cab front. If you’re not careful, when the snow on it melts it can divert the water through the bonnet vents into your engine bay and turn everything into a big block of ice. Looks pretty but takes a LONG time to defrost it

 

[Brains]

Also check the positioning of your silver screen, particularly if you have a standard fiat/ford cab front. If you’re not careful, when the snow on it melts it can divert the water through the bonnet vents into your engine bay and turn everything into a big block of ice. Looks pretty but takes a LONG time to defrost it

The Army solution to this problem used to be to light a charcoal BBQ in front of the engine and once it had died down to push the vehicle over the BBQ so that it was under the oil sump.
(Same solution was used to turn un-winterised diesel in the tank from jelly to liquid)

I suspect some elf'n'safety clipboard jockey has put an end to the practice now.

(However it does work. Perhaps with the addition of a directional air vent made of tin foil, as Army vehicles tend to be high off the ground.
Add a couple of disposable BBQ's to the kit list! They will be good for next summer if you don't use them)

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[peterc10]

Or the more expensive way is to buy a motorhome with Alde heating and the heat exchanger. No coincidence that Alde is based in Sweden!

 

[Surfstar]

I’m thinking I would like to get webasto diesel heating retro fitted to accompany my blown air that runs off lpg. In effect using it as a back up source when not on EHU and if the Truma fails. Are there any technicians or companies that one would recommend for such a job?

 

[busby]

It's all about heating.

I'd be thinking of several backups should the main heating not be enough or fail completely (due to no electricity or no gas)

As a minimum take hot water bottles, 4 season sleeping bags, multi-tog duvets, plus an oil filled electric radiator and a separate gas bottle powered one.



I've spent quite a bit of time on Norway in the winter
It's cold
It's dark most of the day (and at the top end it's dark all of the 'day')
Everything is closed, or shuts early
Even the Norwegian hibernate during the winter
The snow does not melt, so everything is icy underneath
It's eyewateringly expensive, even day to day items.
Alcohol: Dont bother. £10-12 for a pint of Karlsburg (BYO)
Did I mention the cold and the dark ?

On the plus side, you may get to see the Aurora Borialis and go for a ride with huskies either of which could make the trip worth while

Sounds like hell...Not for me I need sunshine and cheap cold beer and good food
BUSBY.

 

[Brains]

I’m thinking I would like to get webmasto diesel heating retro fitted to accompany my blown air that runs off lpg. In effect using it as a back up source when not on EHU and if the Truma fails. Are there any technicians or companies that one would recommend for such a job?

A Land Rover converter, such as Nene Overland, would do that sort of job