Payload

[wotme]

I am trying to find out the payload for a Fiat Ducato Elnagh SEA 640R I realize this is something I should have found out before putting down a deposit on the vehicle, Having since read articles about MHs having ridiculously low payloads I asked the dealer and he says the only way to find out the mass in running order (MIRO) is to empty the vehicle and have it weighed. To do that would mean calculating and deducting the weight of the top box, bike rack, and wind out canopy etc. Apparently the gross weight axle weights and train weight are the only figures found on the plate, NOT THE MIRO WEIGHT.
If this is the case it obviously makes it impossible to work out the payload unless as the dealer says having it weighed empty or is there another way of finding this out?

 

[M-J]

Just weigh it with the extras fitted, I assume the extras are things you want anyway.

 

[Jim]

The dealer should make a point of knowing, but buyer beware. Just tell the dealer you want it weighed before you weigh him out

 

[keithchesterfield2]

Get it weighed as it is then work out what else you intend putting on or in it and then see what, if any, spare payload you have.
I wouldn't trust a Dealer to give accurate information if it meant he may lose a sale.
It's your money - make sure you don't waste it on something that doesn't live up to your expectations.

 

[wotme]

Thanks MJ The problem is if I want to load up the MH with my gear and have it weighed I would need to purchase the vehicle first Then if I find out it wont carry the basics, I'm up the proverbial creek

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[Minxy]

You don't need to know the original MIRO as that's irrelevant, what you need to know is the weight of it as it stands, with each axle weight given individually, and info on what fuel and water was in it but without the driver and passengers ... that way you have a baseline weight to deduct from the MAM so will give you the payload left and what's available on each axle.

The dealer is being a pain by saying you have to remove stuff as he should know this is totally ridiculous.

 

[M-J]

Thanks MJ The problem is if I want to load up the MH with my gear and have it weighed I would need to purchase the vehicle first Then if I find out it wont carry the basics, I'm up the proverbial creek

You need to know weight as it is and the MAM weight (or whatever they call it - Maximum allowed weight once loaded)

What’s left is your useable payload for example, passengers, fluids (fuel, water) gas bottles, bikes, clothes, food, crockery, pans etc, outdoor furniture.

 

[nicholsong]

If it is being weighed you shoud be there to note the contents of the diesel, water and waste tanks, plus any occupants. Otherwise you only have the dealer's word for what they were.

From those base weighbridge figures(plus what extra fluids you intend to carry on a journey some people want full tanks, others e.g. half) and the max permitted weight, you can calculate what is left as being your 'useable payload'

If it is for weekend use you need 300-400kg. For touring for weeks I suggest 5-600 kgs. For full-timing 800-900kg. If you carry a scooter add 100kg to each.

All this changes when you compare campsite camping to independent wildcamping for days.

Geoff

 

[Lenny HB]

Sounds like the dealer is stalling and knows it will be overweight with the extras that are fitted.

Call his bluff tell him you would like it weighed as it is and you would like to go with him to the weighbridge.

If he has nothing to hide he will say fine, if he tries to get out of it, walk away.

 

[TerryL]

Sounds like the dear is stalling and knows it will be overweight with the extras that are fitted.

Call his bluff tell him you would like it weighed as it is and you would like to go with him to the weighbridge.

If he has nothing to hide he will say fine, if he tries to get out of it, walk away.

Can you get your deposit back without fuss? I would make it a condition of purchase that the vehicle has an adequate payload for your intended use.
You don't need to add your stuff, just weigh it beforehand then add it to whatever figure the weighbridge comes up with.

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[Minxy]

I assume its this one:

https://www.practicalmotorhome.com/forsale/121661-elnagh-2007

Mot history check:

Broken Link Removed

 

[Mr Beaumont]

The description on this one might help.

 

[M-J]

Did you get it weighed?

 

[wotme]

Only just brought it home M-J, I've never driven a motorhome before and I can't say it was an enjoyable experience.
The steering felt extremely light and the handling on minor roads was at first a bit of an issue but on the motorway at 60mph with high-ish cross winds it behaved surprisingly stable. The 2.8 power unit is exactly twice the size fitted in my Kodiak but it has a fraction of the 4X4s performance. I'm not sure if it will have the guts to climb a 1 in 20 let alone a 1 in 3. I soon realized that travelling in a home on wheels is far from relaxing even when crawling along at a snails pace. Surely similar 2007 coach builds can't all be the same

 

[Spriddler]

Only just brought it home M-J, I've never driven a motorhome before and I can't say it was an enjoyable experience

I assume then that you didn't have a test drive......
How far was the drive home?
Don't be too hasty to judge it. I enjoy driving my 20 yrs old m/h more than any other of my vehicles. For one thing, when I'm in the m/h I'm 'on holiday', never in a rush and I can see over the cars in front and over the hedgerows and enjoy the scenery....stop for a brew etc. Withhold judgement until you've had a trip or two

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[M-J]

So the dealer didn’t get it weighed to confirm payload with the extras fitted?

How do you know you can legally drive it with anything onboard?

 

[Lenny HB]

So the dealer didn’t get it weighed to confirm payload with the extras fitted?

How do you know you can legally drive it with anything onboard?

That's what I was thinking

 

[Lanerboy]

That's what I was thinking

Me too

 

[Minxy]

Only just brought it home M-J, I've never driven a motorhome before and I can't say it was an enjoyable experience.
The steering felt extremely light and the handling on minor roads was at first a bit of an issue but on the motorway at 60mph with high-ish cross winds it behaved surprisingly stable.

You'll soon get used to it - once you have some weight/bits and bobs in it, it will handle better too.

The 2.8 power unit is exactly twice the size fitted in my Kodiak but it has a fraction of the 4X4s performance. I'm not sure if it will have the guts to climb a 1 in 20 let alone a 1 in 3. I soon realized that travelling in a home on wheels is far from relaxing even when crawling along at a snails pace. Surely similar 2007 coach builds can't all be the same

Give it a chance, if it hasn't been used much it will probably benefit from a few good runs to clear it's 'lungs' which will improve things, you'll also then get to know it and where the sweet spots are in each gear.

 

[Carolyn and Kev]

https://www.gumtree.com/campervans-motorhomes/uk/fiat/ducato/.../other-transmission

2007 Elnagh Sea 640R 4/5 Berth Motorhome 2.8 Diesel. Wickham .... 2007 Autotrail Tracker EKS SE (Fiat Ducato 2300cc, GVW-3500kg, Payload-550kg).

Does this help at all??

Kev

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[Cheshirecat57]

So @wotme
Are you going to weigh it.?

 

[wotme]

I knew I was in for some flack from you guys but that's precisely why I paid my fifteen quid, and it looks like I'm already getting my moneys worth .
The last post from Kev & Carolyn is in agreement with many others I've spoken to, the payload can only be guessed at because there are no official figures supplied by Elnagh
Apparently a few other manufacturers do give these details which is what I used as a guide but we shall see when I get it weighed.
I admit I didn't drive it myself on the test drive I let the dealer have that pleasure while I listened to all the bangs and rattles and no I didn't have it weighed because the local weighbridge was extremely busy, something I find hard to believe seeing as he charges £40 for the mass weight plus £40 for each axel.
How do I know I can legally drive it, that's a very good question and the answer is I don't, which I suspect applies to a high percentage of many other MH owners up and down the country, according to statistics one in four MHs are overweight when pulled over
When I fully kit it out and take it to my nearest weighbridge in Southampton then I'll let you know.
The initial 40 mile drive home was far from taking things at a leisurely pace looking over the hedgerows, I was more interested in keeping the wingmirrors in one piece
I'm sure after a few more trips the blood supply to my knuckles will return to normal, so if you pass my Elnagh on the road please don't wave, I'll think something is about to fall off

 

[Spriddler]

That's the spirit!
When I bought my m/h I didn't test drive it, and until I joined Fun two years later knew nothing about payloads, licence categories, damp, uncoiling leccy hook-up cables, reverse polarity, parking to the peg, how to wash the roof, metal tyre valves, Elsan splashes, etc. etc..........and all the other 'essential' wisdoms but have never had any problems.
Enjoy. You'll be fine

 

[Lenny HB]

I knew I was in for some flack from you guys but that's precisely why I paid my fifteen quid, and it looks like I'm already getting my moneys worth .

You like flack, well you have come to the right place.

Here's some more, after the discussions on here and no figures avalible, I find it unbelievable you didn't get the dealer to weight as part of the sale agreement. I think the heart is ruling the brain.

 

[The Wino]

I think a lot on here are being very negative I suspect the vast majority of motorhomea are purchased unweighed not saying thats good just the way it is. As for the estimates of what weight allowance is needed they seem very high to me the thing to do is weigh it than see what you can take as youv'e now bought it!!. Its a bit like saying what would you like to earn most people have to manage with what theyv'e got even if they would like a bit more it could be the margin is so low it will need up-plating if possible but its all speculation at the moment. Weigh it and see whats left then enjoy it. I suspect there are as many motorhomes driven overweight as there are car drivers who occasionally drift over the speed limit neither is legal or the right thing to do just the way it is.

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[Lanerboy]

Your not alone I bought my 1st mh brand new out the glittering showroom never test drove it never weighed it never had a clue on its payload etc etc but I just got in it in the showroom and thought this is the one for me

I had It over 2 years and had some great trips in it and yes I was over weight to start with you learn a lot of this forum well I have any way

I then sold the MH and bought another new one but this time went without my blinkers on I new the weight the upgrade procedure for uprating the mgw before I picked it up I had it weighed so I new the payload capabilities It has everything I wanted and needed that my 1st one didn't have and most of it was learnt off this forum

Go and enjoy it

 

[Lenny HB]

I think a lot on here are being very negative I suspect the vast majority of motorhomea are purchased unweighed not saying thats good just the way it is.

The OP ask a question about payload as there were no figures for the van he was looking at and the dealer refused to weigh it, he got honest answers.

As for the estimates of what weight allowance is needed they seem very high to me

Figures people have quoted seem reasonable to me. From experience I reckon for two people 700 kg is about right, 200 kg options an extras that are not included in the MIRO and 500 kg for all the personal gear.

 

[grumps147]

Flack, you ain’t seen nothin yet.

Just don't admit to wearing rubber gloves to empty the toilet, or liking C&MC wardens, or any wardens for that matter, and .......

No, I am spoiling the fun, just keep posting.

You might need a set of digital house scales, you need to see the weight clearly and not have some marker jiggling about. Most things you carry into the motorhome, so you can soon find out what items weigh. It will help when you come to decide what to remove. If your lucky and are one of the slimmer couples, it gives you at least 50Kg more than slightly larger people like me.

 

[The Wino]

The OP ask a question about payload as there were no figures for the van he was looking at and the dealer refused to weigh it, he got honest answers.

Figures people have quoted seem reasonable to me. From experience I reckon for two people 700 kg is about right, 200 kg options an extras that are not included in the MIRO and 500 kg for all the personal gear.

Depends on the amount of extras I think all we have is a bike rack and awning no satellite TV arriel extra batteries etc say 31kg plus the bikes if carried a long way off 200kg. As for personal gear half a metric ton for 2 people!!!!!!!!!! . Had ours weighed recently we were 3205 kg fully loaded with 130l of water 3/4 tank diesel and all our stuff 2 of us plus the dog and of course the awning/bike rack no bikes. We were only away for a week so might take a bit more if away for a few weeks but could travel with 30l water if necessary. That being said we are in a 6m low profile so not as much bodywork to cart around. I do think your estimates suggest you like to take all your stuff (and why not if thats what you want to do!) I doubt we could physically fit that much in!. Just hought I forgot the weight of the gas bottle but our payload is shown on the out and about live website as 700kg (presumably with a driver and some fuel in) with 30l water I recon we would have just under 400kg left so we must have a little over 300kg used maybe I ought to try another weighbridge but it was certified.

 

[Lenny HB]

We travel fairly light compared to a lot only real extra is a washing machine at 13 kg, no bike rack but e- bikes about 48kg plus 5 kg in locks and chains.
As for extras, factory fitted we had comfort pack which includes drivers door, larger fridge with TecTower oven, electric front roller blind, upgraded hab door, auto gearbox, loads of other bits but not much that adds weight.
Then I have fitted sat dish, TV, 2 extra batteries, inverter, 3 solar panels., Spare wheel, awning.
Just had full air suspension fitted that's only about 50kg.
Wouldn't think about setting off without a full tank of water (160lt). Today is the first day I've been able to get water this week.

Our MIRO including factory extras is 3340 we are runing around 4200kg, so 300 kg spare.