New regs-confused? (1 Viewer)

[Gorse Hill]

quote from my mate flecc

You have a mate Is he a German

 

[Judge Mental]

You have a mate Is he a German

Nooooo.... He is a south Londoner..and is known well for his depth of knowledge on all things e bikes...

A shame these inconvenient truths stop the unscrupulous in their tracks

 

[Don Quixote]

Well I live in Spain and it's simple the OP asked "I'd like to buy an e-bike for wifey which CAN be used legally in Spain" and the answer is FULL THROTTLE twist grips are illegal in Spain PERIOD.
Start assistance however you will get away with as long as there is NO throttle twist grip. My Spanish made eBike allows this (6km max) via the LCD panel ONLY. and 100% fully legal in Spain.

Having said all the above, we were out yesterday and counted at least 30 eBikes with riders NOT peddling, but using twist grips throttles........... Read from that what you want.

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[Lenny HB]

Well I live in Spain and it's simple the OP asked "I'd like to buy an e-bike for wifey which CAN be used legally in Spain" and the answer is FULL THROTTLE twist grips are illegal in Spain PERIOD.

Exactly, don't see why people keep wanting to try and justify the use of illegal bikes (reminds me of A frames). You have 2 choices buy a legal bike and know you can ride it in any country without encountering any problems or buy and illegal one and take your chance, if you do the latter don't come on here whinging about the fine if you get caught.

 

[ebikejohn]

That's a new one to me. I remember driving Mk8, Mk9, all the Mk2s, E-Type and the XK140S. It helped having an uncle who was a used car dealer. One thing that sticks in my mind is the beautiful woodwork and the purple dash lamps in the old ones. I remember delivering a 3.8 for him, got it down to 15 mpg. Who in their right mind would give a 3.8 to a teenager to deliver how I survived I don't know.

At the tender age of ten on holiday in Woolacombe. I plucked up the courage to approach a chap (complete with handlebar moustache) sat at the bar because I had seen him at the wheel of his sand gold Mk2 and compliment him on his choice of car, he smiled, thanked me, offered me a Vimto and gave me Half a Crown, many years later I joked to my late father that he'd get locked up for doing that now, I don't think so he said, he was with a cracking young blonde probably 30 years his junior, all he wanted you to do was clear off and leave him to get on with it.

 

[hilldweller]

You have 2 choices buy a legal bike and know you can ride it in any country without encountering any problems or buy and illegal one and take your chance.

3. Have a old bikes, bought before these regs raised their ugly head, but still doing good service.

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[tonyidle]

No squabbling here..its you having the personal digs at every opportunity. All I do is try and protect fellow funster's for falling for this patent if not laughable nonsense...

This has nothing to do with what sort of bikes you prefer or choose to buy but the legality of use and if they fully comply with EN15194

So I guess with you silence on the matter you are not willing to indemnify buyers of your bikes for use in Europe.. Such is your confidence in the legality..I think funster's can now make their own minds up

If, as ebikejohn has stated, they comply withEN15194, why would any further indemnity be needed?

 

[Judge Mental]

If, as ebikejohn has stated, they comply withEN15194, why would any further indemnity be needed?

They simply don't comply..I have said enough, just read through the post at evidence. Or get him to show in regs where it say anything about start assist or low start throttles..you will have a long wait.

Its simply marketing bullshine so that they can keep marketing bikes that without a throttle are pretty awful to ride.

E bikes are unique as IF a bike meets the EAPC requirements it's classed as a normal pedal bike...

no mention of throttles here
http://www.bike-eu.com/laws-regulat...gulations-for-e-bikes-pedelecs-part-1-1018836

 

[tonyidle]

They simply don't comply..I have said enough, just read through the post at evidence. Or get him to show in regs where it say anything about start assist or low start throttles..you will have a long wait.

Its simply marketing bullshine so that they can keep marketing bikes that without a throttle are pretty awful to ride.

E bikes are unique as IF a bike meets the EAPC requirements it's classed as a normal pedal bike...

no mention of throttles here
http://www.bike-eu.com/laws-regulat...gulations-for-e-bikes-pedelecs-part-1-1018836

This might help muddy the water further . I don't know whether it has as yet been implemented but I assume it either has, or at least bikes to which it refers are being produced / sold in anticipation of its implementation:

https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&r...TWBon4Uc85LagrwTg&sig2=-QQiAmHLcR_JapZj1_v1Sg

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[ebikejohn]

I thought that I was out of here but this piece of information from the DfT regarding the use of 6kmh 'start assist' throttles has finally found its way to me, the important paragraph is 1.2

1.2 Cycles where power can be obtained even when the rider is not pedalling (twist and go)

Under European law these cycles are required to obtain EU or domestic type approval. There is however an exemption for cycles where power is available only up to 6 km/h without pedalling, to help start-up, and these are exempt from type approval.

The document is dated December 2015 and comes from the DfT, I have attached a file, You can draw your own conclusions.

 

[martin2603]

Well, that's a lot to digest, I was looking to try a crank drive from that excellent German manufacturer, but before I did so I thought I would have a ride on her in doors little e bike, it s a hub motor . Now I have hills all around me as we live on the side of a valley. So raise the saddle of off I went yesterday afternoon. Yes very handy on the uphill out of the valley but what I did not bargain for was how low geared it was. At 16 mph in top gear my legs a off like a spin drier! In fact although it has the seven speed shimano gearset you only seem to use the top three gears, or in my case two!
A chat with 50cycles confirmed that they are geared that way unless I went for the sport versions.

So brushed the dust off my Eddie Merckx full carbon road bike, and off I went today , did about 20miles without breaking too much sweat.

I had not ridden it for a year and was pleasantly surprised how good it was to ride again.

Not ready for the e bike yet!!

 

[Puddleduck]

I love my ebike. Without the assist I would no longer be able to cycle.

No matter what the type of bike the most important thing for me is having a VERY low step through frame. I tried to try a lot of ebikes before buying mine and there were only two (from the same manufacturer) that I could actually step through. I bought the one that was the more comfortable in my opinion.

For serious cyclists who have no mobility problems there is a choice of bike and drive mechanism, for other people not so much choice.

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[Dogeared]

Totally confused about the different arguments. Please can someone advise me if the e-bikes from Pro Rider are legal, (a) in the UK, (b) in Europe.

According to the retailer they are still legal

Barry

 

[mpdcymru]

Its an unfortunate fact of life that some just look for confirmation of there needs and ignore any forthcoming information that they dont like..No matter what the vested interests tell you that appears more palatable to your ears

Once again for the hard of hearing....

"Hi Eddie, good to hear from you again.

The Walk Alongside law isn't in any way an e-bike law, it's just e-bikes taking advantage of the Pedestrian Controlled vehicle regulations. Those regulations were passed to permit the walk along small vans etc used by the Post Office and some dairies etc for deliveries, like this one:

http://www.stilltimecollection.co.uk/gallery/Trucks/Misc 5133.jpg

In the UK there isn't a single separate law, the regulations are included in the Road Traffic Act 1960 and the Road Vehicle Lighting Regulations 1957, and general legal approval for use passed through the House of Lords in 1963.

The regulations permit lighter ones to be unregistered, heavier ones have to be registered and there's a group K driving licence for them. The control is by the pedestrian walking and their slight pull on the handle applying power. When they stop and there's no more pull, the power cuts and brakes come on. Maximum speed allowed is 4mph Note the pedestrian cannot be on board, they have to be walking at all times. The EU has similar regulations allowing 6 kph (3.6 mph), and so has Switzerland.

E-biking has taken advantage of these laws by using self-cancelling thumb lever throttles, but again note the person has to be walking in law. As soon as they get on board they are breaking the law, hence that Spanish case. A test case in Britain ruled that even putting one foot on a pedal and scooting means a cyclist is no longer a pedestrian, so it follows from all this that the walk alongside throttle must not be used as a get off the mark throttle, so those dealers recommending this use are wrong in law.

Being on board breaches pedelec law, type approval law and pedestrian controlled vehicle law."

more on this thread:
http://www.pedelecs.co.uk/forum/threads/lets-keep-the-throttle.21805/page-5#post-283710

there are no grey area or fuddle its simply black and white, the law clear. Its not these dealers that will have to deal with the grumpy Spanish traffic cop however slim the possibility of getting pulled, being involved in an accident that situation changes exponentially! Your money your choice. But when you can buy a centre drive bike form Germany that are totally legal and easy to ride from £1000-1.200 whats the point of taking any sort of risk...

Not sure but do we not currently have the Road Vehicle Lighting regulations 1989?

 

[funflair]

Totally confused about the different arguments. Please can someone advise me if the e-bikes from Pro Rider are legal, (a) in the UK, (b) in Europe.

According to the retailer they are still legal

Barry

From my very brief reading NO they are not legal in the UK or Europe.

Have a read here, https://www.juicybike.co.uk/uk-europe-ebike-law

Edit

I should have said the change in the rules is not applied retrospectively so it depends whether you have bought before the change in the rules or you are "just looking".

Martin

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[Dogeared]

I emailed Pro Rider and have also spoken to their service dept on the phone. Both very quick to respond.
This is the email reply

Hello,

Thank you for your message.

Yes the throttle mode has now changed to a push button throttle that will go to 4mph on throttle alone, or faster if you are also pedalling.

The advert is currently being changed from the 15mph speed.

Please let me know if you have any further questions!

Kind Regards,
Pro Rider



Kind regards

Pro Rider Team

Plan to go and try them out next week.

 

[Chris51]

I have just bought a Pro-rider Wayfarer ex demo with full throttle I was concerned about it being legal so rang Pro-rider to ask .They said if the bike was imported before regs came out (Jan 16?) it was legal to use.I would think if it bothers anyone if the throttle was disabled that would solve the problem?Wonder if you could fit a "launch" button instead of throttle limited to 6kph?On the subject of Wayfarer it was supplied with "new battery" and I charged 24hrs but the three lights on top of battery top two are green and bottom one (empty) is red.When put on bike all 5 reds on h/bars are on?Very pleased with bike for price and think build quality is good.Safe riding---Chris.

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