New Legislation on Conversions

[Daveyboy6666]

Hi, First newbie question of many.. With the new regulations out about turning a Van into a Camper, it states that you must have 2 windows ? now I couldn't see anything about size? ( Unless I skimmed it too quick for my own brain, Which is possible! )
So is there an actual size that the 2 Windows must b or is it as long as there are 2 Windows ? Please help my head from hurting,reading so much information and I haven't even got a Van yet ???? Ty ?

 

[AMK]

I think I read something on the DVLA pages a while ago,

 

[Raul]

There is no specific size implied, what they want is sufficient daylight to the living area. It’s up to them I guess where is the borderline of sufficient. I sent my log book 3 weeks ago and waiting. On one side I got a big window and the other side same, plus a small one over the sink and cooker. I think is a seitz s5 500x300.
I will find out soon.

 

[JohnJan]

As above, there is no guidance to size but as you have to submit an internal picture showing the windows providing daylight to the living accommodation area, if you risk small it could be rejected.

 

[34127]

I don't think there is any specific minimum size quoted in guidelines but there must be at least 2, not including the driver or passanger window, on at least one side of the van and the conversion must look like a campervan so if you only put in tiny windows them it will probable by rejected.

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[Terry]

Hi, the DVLA are stamping down on conversions and it's down to whoever deals with your request to change from van to Motor Caravan
I always take pics showing front / down both sides and from rear showing side ( making sure number plate is visible ) as a van and once it's converted same pics along with internal pics making sure the table is set up with plates cups etc in at least one pic ?
I usually do around 8 pics on total Inc seats as seats and as bed ?
Terry

 

[Daveyboy6666]

There is no specific size implied, what they want is sufficient daylight to the living area. It’s up to them I guess where is the borderline of sufficient. I sent my log book 3 weeks ago and waiting. On one side I got a big window and the other side same, plus a small one over the sink and cooker. I think is a seitz s5 500x300.
I will find out soon.

 

[Daveyboy6666]

Thanks Raul much Appreciated for that, I’m gathering as much info before I delve into something ?

 

[Daveyboy6666]

I don't think there is any specific minimum size quoted in guidelines but there must be at least 2, not including the driver or passanger window, on at least one side of the van and the conversion must look like a campervan so if you only put in tiny windows them it will probable by rejected.

 

[Raul]

Just a update on this, in case anyone is interested in future conversions. My log book came back today::;;;

van with side windows.
Inside I have made sufficient changes to qualify as a Motorhome. But outside appearance, ( permanent features) was not sufficient to class it as Motorhome. But sufficient changes to become van with side windows, stil LGV.
Photos of the van can be seen on the self build thread for references.
I will leave it as it is for now, but in the near future, I will make further changes so I can apply again for the Motorhome classification.
I think I will add further 2 small and one large window, plus a dometic awning. If that won’t cut it, I will just give up. Funny thing is, numerous vans I’ve seen today at the show, will qualify less than mine by a long shot. How do they do it?

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[34127]

Just a update on this, in case anyone is interested in future conversions. My log book came back today::;;;

van with side windows.
Inside I have made sufficient changes to qualify as a Motorhome. But outside appearance, ( permanent features) was not sufficient to class it as Motorhome. But sufficient changes to become van with side windows, stil LGV.
Photos of the van can be seen on the self build thread for references.
I will leave it as it is for now, but in the near future, I will make further changes so I can apply again for the Motorhome classification.
I think I will add further 2 small and one large window, plus a dometic awning. If that won’t cut it, I will just give up. Funny thing is, numerous vans I’ve seen today at the show, will qualify less than mine by a long shot. How do they do it?

Have they actually been reclassifed as Motor Caravans. I have read elsewhere that Devon Conversions are having problems getting their vans reclassified so it must be happening to other professional conversion companies.

 

[Raul]

So they must sell them as a van then? If they are not reclassified?
I got no issue to use it as it is. The insurance ( Adrian Flux) have confirmed that will make no difference to them if the log book says van or Motorhome. Even the premium will not change.
As long as I am satisfied that it’s been converted and used as Motorhome, and the conversion has not compromised the safety of the vehicle.

 

[34127]

So they must sell them as a van then? If they are not reclassified?
I got no issue to use it as it is. The insurance ( Adrian Flux) have confirmed that will make no difference to them if the log book says van or Motorhome. Even the premium will not change.
As long as I am satisfied that it’s been converted and used as Motorhome, and the conversion has not compromised the safety of the vehicle.

I think more insurance companies will react to the fact that the DVLA are rejecting so many applications and that as long as the vehicles complies in other respects with the DVLA guidelines then they will insure them the same as a vehicle that has been reclassified. As you say, if the vehicle has been converted to be used as a motorhome then that is fine and the Vehicle body type on the V5 is irrelevant.

 

[Wildbill]

My frend has just done up a vw van with popup roof and the full works sent in lod's of photos and it come back as van with side windows
he is not happy
billx

 

[Mark and Mindy]

Have they actually been reclassifed as Motor Caravans. I have read elsewhere that Devon Conversions are having problems getting their vans reclassified so it must be happening to other professional conversion companies.

We had problems getting our Devon Colorado reclassified as a Motor Caravan last year, it was bought as a pre-reg, Devon gave us a covering letter and some photos but the DVLA weren't happy. We were lucky that we were able to email the letter writer from the DVLA direct with more supporting paperwork and a lot of photos taken by Mark and the re-classification was then accepted.

We did go back to Devon Conversions but they just said that they gave the same paperwork to everybody and there had been no problems before.

We were insured with Caravan & Motorhome Club and they were very patient with us, and gave us time to get the V5 from DVLA with change of ownership and then more time to get the reclassification done - 4 weeks in all.

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[Daveyboy6666]

Thanks, Thats what I read, 2 windows and not including the drivers / pass but I couldn't find anything stating the

My frend has just done up a vw van with popup roof and the full works sent in lod's of photos and it come back as van with side windows
he is not happy
billx

As u know I was the one trying to find out what I had to do to convert a Van into a Campervan, I’ve been looking to buy something ? ( Still haven't got a clue! , due to all this B**LSh*T from the DVLA! )
Anyway......I started trolling Youtube videos and came across ” The Campervan Builder "
( Updated DVLA Campervan Conversions Requirements -New ) this was done 3 months ago.
So listening to what he had to say, He said about the Windows, Tables must b fixed, and 2 Stove, etc, etc....and other things u have to do ??
He also said that the DVLA are knocking back a lot the Vans for having ” Pop ups ” and I'm sure he said even the Factory fitted Popups too! ?
So...im really confused as what to buy and convert ? Now...ive just read above that you can convert and still get insurance for a Van that has been Converted into a Campervan and the insurance people are ok with that ??
ALSO...( Sorry ??? )
I've been asking people on different buying sites if I buy their Van, Does it have a proper V5c stating it's been converted from a Van to a Campervan? To which 60% of them said that they haven't got one, BUT YET HAVE BEEN TRAVELLING AROUND EUROPE IN IT?? and they had insurance ? I'm so so Confused ??? Do I just get a Van and do it up, and Not tell the DVLA? ? Buy one that's already done up? Then just phone up for insurance? I'm not sure what to do ????
Then...( just when u thought I had finished! ? ) What Happens if I drive it around and I'm involved in a accident? Will it matter that I'm JUST driving a Van with windows? ? or Not ????? ( Finished..Oh I don't know either if I was meant to or Not..mentioned Youtube but there's lots of help for building, Wiring, installations, I'm nothing to do with them, just helping u out, Sorry if not allowed please Delete post! Not Me! ? ) Ty xx

 

[Daveyboy6666]

Hi.....? ( he says hiding his eyes and bowing his head )
So...Who would you say is the Cheapest for Fully Comp Insurance for whatever Class of Campervan, Motorhome you own? ( I'm not yet up to correct speed, Do I put your Campervans / Motorhomes in a class for Insurance or is it called something else? )
But what does the insurance go on, Size, Room, Beds, Engine size, ? I don't have a clue, Can someone please enlightened me ???

 

[Wildbill]

Hi.....? ( he says hiding his eyes and bowing his head )
So...Who would you say is the Cheapest for Fully Comp Insurance for whatever Class of Campervan, Motorhome you own? ( I'm not yet up to correct speed, Do I put your Campervans / Motorhomes in a class for Insurance or is it called something else? )
But what does the insurance go on, Size, Room, Beds, Engine size, ? I don't have a clue, Can someone please enlightened me ???

Adrian flux always give me a good price and will insure as a camper van under conversion COOP used to be good as well cis insurance services
bill

 

[Daveyboy6666]

Adrian flux always give me a good price and will insure as a camper van under conversion COOP used to be good as well cis insurance services
bill

Thanks Bill, at the moment I don't have anything to insure, But I like to find out as much as I can before hand just to make sure I've covered all my angles and I feel I've done my best ??

 

[Wildbill]

And what did they do before forums like his came along and you had camper-van and you just insured it as a van and got on with it after all its just a van with stuff in it manly transporting household items that are screwed down.
forums and Facebook just sent feare through every one every time they posted on them have you told you're insurers you had a sxxxit in your toilet.
didyou tell them you changed your radio so much bxxxxs spred around on the internet and so much of it unnecessary crap and scaremongering
but sum usfull stuff you have to sort out the whet from the chaff and ther a lot of chaff
bill

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[Daveyboy6666]

And what did they do before forums like his came along and you had camper-van and you just insured it as a van and got on with it after all its just a van with stuff in it manly transporting household items that are screwed down.
forums and Facebook just sent feare through every one every time they posted on them have you told you're insurers you had a sxxxit in your toilet.
didyou tell them you changed your radio so much bxxxxs spred around on the internet and so much of it unnecessary crap and scaremongering
but sum usfull stuff you have to sort out the whet from the chaff and ther a lot of chaff
bill

Yes exactly, it's just a big van, with big stuff in it, carting inside stuff from one place to another, it doesn't care if it has windows to view out of , a toilet to sh*t in..Just wants to get from a 2 b in Comfort ??

 

[Wildbill]

Yes exactly, it's just a big van, with big stuff in it, carting inside stuff from one place to another, it doesn't care if it has windows to view out of , a toilet to sh*t in..Just wants to get from a 2 b in Comfort ??

And i don't think the insurers care that much as long as your not carting living passenger unsecured in the back .
bill

 

[tacr2man]

It looks like anything that is van based , ie with rear doors , factory body isnt going to get thru other than as van with windows . Particularly if you are a one off private builder ! If its a pop top they are specifically mentioned as not complying . I would be asking for the DVLA to supply a letter if they class as a van with windows that they certify that you have complied with the law notifying them that the vehicle has been modified to meet EU IVA requirements for special purpose M1 category motor caravan.

 

[Lot lover]

I confess that I have a real MH but have been following this topic with interest. My question, why does it matter what you call it? A spade is still a spade even though some insist that it is a shovel.

 

[The Lord Squid]

I confess that I have a real MH but have been following this topic with interest. My question, why does it matter what you call it? A spade is still a spade even though some insist that it is a shovel.

The speed limit may be lower - not too much of a concern. What I think is unknown is whether ferry and tunnel tariffs would be based on commercial prices and what the basis would be for a total loss insurance claim.

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[peterc10]

I confess that I have a real MH but have been following this topic with interest. My question, why does it matter what you call it? A spade is still a spade even though some insist that it is a shovel.

A spade if for digging. A shovel is for shovelling. Different activities

 

[Raul]

You insure on a agreed value? Price of vehicle market value, plus interior cost. Of course it has to be reasonable and the insurer will agree with you.
The speed is not a issue, Far from it.

 

[34127]

I confess that I have a real MH but have been following this topic with interest. My question, why does it matter what you call it? A spade is still a spade even though some insist that it is a shovel.

The only real issue, as far as i am aware, is that a lot of insurance companies will onlly quote on vehicles that have Motor Caravan on the V5 document.

 

[Daveyboy6666]

It looks like anything that is van based , ie with rear doors , factory body isnt going to get thru other than as van with windows . Particularly if you are a one off private builder ! If its a pop top they are specifically mentioned as not complying . I would be asking for the DVLA to supply a letter if they class as a van with windows that they certify that you have complied with the law notifying them that the vehicle has been modified to meet EU IVA requirements for special purpose M1 category motor caravan.

Maybe it's time someone took down the DVLA!! ( I mean by taking them to court, if possible? ? ) If DVLA are setting out rules, guidelines to adhere to, and then when people send in evidence showing that they have done what is asked, But they still Refuse to give out the prize ( V5c ) and especially not saying what u have done wrong, we'll surely they are in breach of something? Or they should by rights explain why they are refusing to give out the V5c stating every point that is still wrong? Not just refusing because there's too many people carrying out conversions in their eyes ? ?

 

[pappajohn]

My frend has just done up a vw van with popup roof and the full works sent in lod's of photos and it come back as van with side windows
he is not happy
billx

A Pop top will NOT pass muster Bill.
It even confirms it on the DVLA requirements page.