Motorhome owners lash out at Devon 'ban' proposal (1 Viewer)

[Tonks]

Parking tickets soon sort that out for the majority who think paying doesn’t apply to them.

Yep, there needs to be more of that I'm afraid.

On the south coast where Dad lived and I was a frequent visitor, early one morning I saw a large MH with toys chairs and crap left heaped up outside it, which had clearly been parked overnight right in the middle of a seafront car park with clear signage saying that overnight stops were not allowed. Less than 1/2 a mile away there's a nice wide quiet lay-by. It has no sea view but there are no restrictions and there was often a van/mh or two tucked up there peacefully overnight. Now, thanks to people like the MH illegally parked and others parking illegally and inconsiderately, with an increasing local hostility to MHs in general as a result, that car park and a number of others has height barriers. I may think 'yay, my VW will fit under the barriers' but NO! The restrictions now state that NO campers or motorhomes are allowed to park on the affected car parks AT ANY TIME, and the peaceful lay-by round the corner also has 'no overnight stops' signage up. Just one example of how selfish and entitled use of parking/overnight sleeping/camping increasingly restricts even regular day to day visiting of nice spots.

 

[ManTheVan]

It’s so very small-minded of the council. Torridge DC have a brilliant approach that generates funds for the local purse from what would, otherwise, be empty car park spaces. I wish others would watch and learn.

 

[Wabs]

I think the whole issue is contentious,some MHs don’t want or need facilities, but others do, if the local councils wanted the local trade they should arrange disposal points for MHs,and campervans,,, if the council want to charge, then fine , personally, I would not like to park up in a row like the footage showed,,not my idea of escaping, and the better half would pee her pants regarding security,,so that’s a no from me..but I understand we will all have different views on this, but this is mine,,,

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[pandas]

I think the whole issue is contentious,some MHs don’t want or need facilities, but others do, if the local councils wanted the local trade they should arrange disposal points for MHs,and campervans,,, if the council want to charge, then fine , personally, I would not like to park up in a row like the footage showed,,not my idea of escaping, and the better half would pee her pants regarding security,,so that’s a no from me..but I understand we will all have different views on this, but this is mine,,,

If you 'need facilities' does this mean you are not a motorhome?

 

[TheTwoOfUs]

If you 'need facilities' does this mean you are not a motorhome?

If you eat and drink at other establishments does this mean that you are not a motorhome? And if you don't eat and drink elsewhere what benefits are you giving to the local traders in return for your free parking?

 

[Ex-caravanner]

First off - sorry this is a bit long and may sound like a rant but since buying the motorhome it's been made apparent that it's a bit of a nightmare for the decent, law abiding motorhomer to park anywhere! At Paignton seafront campers and motorhomers etc have always been able to park during the day and pay for overnight parking. It's a great place to stay as you have the beach, public toilets, beachside showers, cafes and the shops are all within walking distance. As a newbie motorhomer and living just 10 minutes away from paignton we decided, just as our first time, to park along the front take the dog for a walk, get some fish and chips and after an hour or so head back home. A motorhomer saw me getting my wife's mobility scooter out and came over to warn me that a few of them had been ticketed. I couldn't understand this as I have the park4night app which clearly shows a 6 wheeler motorhome parked there with good reviews. Anyway, we got our supper and came back to find the parking warden beside our motorhome. I questioned why she was giving out tickets and the reason was that you had to park wholly within the parking bay and ours being 7.9 meters was overhanging the rear of the bay. Anyway she told me to move or get a ticket and gave me a bit of time to dismantle the scooter, stow it in the garage and move on. The thing is, like many carparks, spaces for vehicles nowadays are too small anyway. In fact without the front bumper of my car overhanging the low sea wall, my rear bumper is overhanging the end of the bay and I have never had a ticket with this reason. Yes my car is long, it's a lexus ls430 so about 16ft but I've seen wardens pointing to the rear of people's vans and making them move on (not just campers - workmen who've pulled up for their lunchbreak).
( incidentally i've never seen the ambulance crews who've pulled up for the same reason been moved on) When we are eventually allowed to move more freely I am considering parking across 3 bays lengthwise and getting a paid parking ticket for each bay to see what happens. Considering that EVERY year we have travellers pulling onto the green field which is used for many advertised functions such as the fair, motorcycle events, classic car shows and club rallies etc. They are approached, assessed as to their needs, and left alone to stay for up to 2 weeks until the day comes when the court moves them on. They steal from local shops and beachside vendors, (I know this for a fact as we've friends who have takeaways along the beach who have suffered from this), the kids run wild with no care for anyone else, dog walkers threatened that they'll kill their dogs and you can see the mess building up everywhere and of course there's no tickets for them. Some locals have even protested by parking their cars on the other end of the green. There is usually a police presence and people are encouraged to keep away. Perhaps if we all parked on the green instead we'd all be given this grace and be left alone. Rant over

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[steve69]

First off - sorry this is a bit long and may sound like a rant but since buying the motorhome it's been made apparent that it's a bit of a nightmare for the decent, law abiding motorhomer to park anywhere! At Paignton seafront campers and motorhomers etc have always been able to park during the day and pay for overnight parking. It's a great place to stay as you have the beach, public toilets, beachside showers, cafes and the shops are all within walking distance. As a newbie motorhomer and living just 10 minutes away from paignton we decided, just as our first time, to park along the front take the dog for a walk, get some fish and chips and after an hour or so head back home. A motorhomer saw me getting my wife's mobility scooter out and came over to warn me that a few of them had been ticketed. I couldn't understand this as I have the park4night app which clearly shows a 6 wheeler motorhome parked there with good reviews. Anyway, we got our supper and came back to find the parking warden beside our motorhome. I questioned why she was giving out tickets and the reason was that you had to park wholly within the parking bay and ours being 7.9 meters was overhanging the rear of the bay. Anyway she told me to move or get a ticket and gave me a bit of time to dismantle the scooter, stow it in the garage and move on. The thing is, like many carparks, spaces for vehicles nowadays are too small anyway. In fact without the front bumper of my car overhanging the low sea wall, my rear bumper is overhanging the end of the bay and I have never had a ticket with this reason. Yes my car is long, it's a lexus ls430 so about 16ft but I've seen wardens pointing to the rear of people's vans and making them move on (not just campers - workmen who've pulled up for their lunchbreak).
( incidentally i've never seen the ambulance crews who've pulled up for the same reason been moved on) When we are eventually allowed to move more freely I am considering parking across 3 bays lengthwise and getting a paid parking ticket for each bay to see what happens. Considering that EVERY year we have travellers pulling onto the green field which is used for many advertised functions such as the fair, motorcycle events, classic car shows and club rallies etc. They are approached, assessed as to their needs, and left alone to stay for up to 2 weeks until the day comes when the court moves them on. They steal from local shops and beachside vendors, (I know this for a fact as we've friends who have takeaways along the beach who have suffered from this), the kids run wild with no care for anyone else, dog walkers threatened that they'll kill their dogs and you can see the mess building up everywhere and of course there's no tickets for them. Some locals have even protested by parking their cars on the other end of the green. There is usually a police presence and people are encouraged to keep away. Perhaps if we all parked on the green instead we'd all be given this grace and be left alone. Rant over

Don't understand this. If you have a mobility scooter, then don't you have a "Blue Badge" for disabled parking? Surely you would qualify and thus appease the parking attendant.

 

[Ex-caravanner]

Yes we have the blue badge and we pay £40 per year to torbay council to park in any carpark without having to buy a ticket. Parking here states that even blue badge holders have to pay the fee. Usually there is a period if 30 mins extra grace. If we did park "sideways" we'd have to pay for 2 parking spaces not 3.

 

[jongood]

If you 'need facilities' does this mean you are not a motorhome?

Yes it does. I'm going to quote NZ again self-contained mh certification scheme

Self-Contained New Zealand

Welcome to Self-Contained New Zealand (SCNZ) home of everything self contained. From self-containment testing to water storage tanks we have everything including the kitchen sink!

selfcontained.co.nz

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[Gellyneck]

If you 'need facilities' does this mean you are not a motorhome?

Yes it does. I'm going to quote NZ again self-contained mh certification scheme

Self-Contained New Zealand

Welcome to Self-Contained New Zealand (SCNZ) home of everything self contained. From self-containment testing to water storage tanks we have everything including the kitchen sink!

selfcontained.co.nz

But if you "want facilities" you can be a motorhome.

 

[nicholsong]

The whole business of restrictions on MH/Camper parking seems to be going in different directions under different councils.

Powys and Hereford have for a long time published where one can park overnight and recently other councils have been either announcing plans for provisions, or there has been a recent questionaire seeking owners views on provision of facilities.

There is a statutory requirement on councils to provide facilities for the ethnically recognised 'Travelling Community' (Not always adhered to).

It is a pity the government do not impose such a requirement on councils to provide Aires. MHomers mostly pay taxes and would pay for Aires, unlike ..........

Geoff

 

[Phileas Fogg]

Cornwall County Council are undertaking a review at this present time, I believe there will be action of some sort, whether it is the right action of course...!

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[Mclouis700]

jongood has hit on the solution ,but how do we get it across to Councils as its no good expecting our Major Camping Clubs contributing

 

[BasherBaz]

If they don't want to business, no wonder so many of us usually go abroad and use aires. Happy to pay £5 a night to park and fill up with water and empty the loo responsibly.

 

[TheTwoOfUs]

£5 will go a really long way to providing the car park, water point and emptying point won't it? And how much do you think will be left over to put into the coffers for the benefit of the local tax payers?

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[jongood]

£5 will go a really long way to providing the car park, water point and emptying point won't it? And how much do you think will be left over to put into the coffers for the benefit of the local tax payers?

I think £5 would be reasonable just for overnight parkingdepending on the spot. Don't forget that in a lot of places suitable parking already exists its only the dumping that needs extra resource, and why not charge separately for this as most of dont need to empty every day. The public dump stations really do work well in NZ, they tend to be either municipal at the roadside or sometime at a garage as a chargeable extra service. Some super U in France also do it, I think the idea is while your there emptying you might go shopping or buy fuel

 

[steve69]

"There is a statutory requirement on councils to provide facilities for the ethnically recognized 'Travelling Community' (Not always adhered to)."

I will now say what many are thinking but worry it might be too "un-PC" to say so.

The "travelling community" are the reason we can't have Aires in this country. They would be all over them like bees in a hive. On the Continent, armed police swiftly move them on if they try that. Over here, the councils take several months fighting legal battles to get a similar result.

 

[Sticky Biscuit]

In non covid years from the end of May to the end of September Devon and Cornwall become massively overcrowded and just do not have the space or infrastructure to support the influx of 'off site' MHs and Campervans.

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[Ivory55]

Yes the traffic in the West Country was mad, seemed to sit in stationary traffic a lot of the time trying to get anywhere. I guess the only time to really visit is in the winter.

 

[Phileas Fogg]

In non covid years from the end of May to the end of September Devon and Cornwall become massively overcrowded and just do not have the space or infrastructure to support the influx of 'off site' MHs and Campervans.

With respect, I am assuming you are a resident of the area Sticky Biscuit.

A couple of examples, Truro has two massive park and ride car parks which are empty at night, it would be very easy to create aires in either of these. Newquay Airport owned by Cornwall Council has vast areas unused on its boundaries, again perfectly useable as overnight parking.
My own village has a parking area which could easily take say two or three vans in a discreet fashion without upsetting anyone that would benefit the local pub and shop as well as provide revenue to the village centre. Now multiply this by the number of places throughout Devon and Cornwall that must be in the same position....

 

[Phileas Fogg]

Yes the traffic in the West Country was mad, seemed to sit in stationary traffic a lot of the time trying to get anywhere. I guess the only time to really visit is in the winter.

What you highlight here is a perfect example of everyone flocking to the same places Padstein, Newquay and so on which yes causes massive problems in those areas. Simple fact is there are many other places in Cornwall struggling because although equally lovely they are not trendy destinations and do not have overnight facilities.

Again an example, park by Mawnan Smith church and take the walk to Helford Passage then the ferry across to Frenchman's Creek. Beautiful, never busy but absolutely nowhere to park a motorhome.

I truly believe spread the areas used and the congestion will lessen not increase!

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[Ivory55]

What you highlight here is a perfect example of everyone flocking to the same places Padstein, Newquay and so on which yes causes massive problems in those areas. Simple fact is there are many other places in Cornwall struggling because although equally lovely they are not trendy destinations and do not have overnight facilities.

Again an example, park by Mawnan Smith church and take the walk to Helford Passage then the ferry across to Frenchman's Creek. Beautiful, never busy but absolutely nowhere to park a motorhome.

I truly believe spread the areas used and the congestion will lessen not increase!

So what are going to do ban certain people from going to places you think that they should not go to ? To allow free movement for the people you think should be allowed there ?

 

[Sticky Biscuit]

With respect, I am assuming you are a resident of the area Sticky Biscuit.

A couple of examples, Truro has two massive park and ride car parks which are empty at night, it would be very easy to create aires in either of these. Newquay Airport owned by Cornwall Council has vast areas unused on its boundaries, again perfectly useable as overnight parking.
My own village has a parking area which could easily take say two or three vans in a discreet fashion without upsetting anyone that would benefit the local pub and shop as well as provide revenue to the village centre. Now multiply this by the number of places throughout Devon and Cornwall that must be in the same position....

What you say about Truro Park n Ride and potential in local villages may well be possible in the future but the fact remains that at the moment Cornwall and Devon in the Summer is overcrowded and just does not have the space, facilities and infrastructure to cope with off site MHs.

 

[Ivory55]

If the choice was Cornwall or France, France would win . More space, less crowded, better odds on good weather, the same money or less than Cornwall. Yes Cornwall is very crowded.

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[AndyVW]

The "travelling community" are the reason we can't have Aires in this country. They would be all over them like bees in a hive. On the Continent, armed police swiftly move them on if they try that. Over here, the councils take several months fighting legal battles to get a similar result.

Thats exactly the problem until police/ council powers are completely changed the UK is a non starter.

 

[WildBunch]

I have read the signage, and I am not sure what exactly & when it is allowed. The fault is with the local authority who seem unable to unambiguously indicate what is or not allowed & when. No wonder, as suggested by some contributors, that they are not collecting the fines. How can they if a magistrate / court will not be able to convict based on such ambiguous signage.
The whole problem with motor home parking in holiday areas is the lack of facilities for motor homes. Local authorities in the UK need to understand the growing demand for motor home facilities. There is an obvious financial benefit for their local rate payers if they provide such facilities.

 

[Ivory55]

I have read the signage, and I am not sure what exactly & when it is allowed. The fault is with the local authority who seem unable to unambiguously indicate what is or not allowed & when. No wonder, as suggested by some contributors, that they are not collecting the fines. How can they if a magistrate / court will not be able to convict based on such ambiguous signage.
The whole problem with motor home parking in holiday areas is the lack of facilities for motor homes. Local authorities in the UK need to understand the growing demand for motor home facilities. There is an obvious financial benefit for their local rate payers if they provide such facilities.

I think that’s been flogged to death already, how motorhome owners are doing them a big favour just turning up and it’s their right to expect parking and facilities etc for free or under a fiver a night. It’s like everything people know exactly how to spend other people’s money and they know it’s the right thing to do but would not spend their own money.

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[63720]

We live an hour or so from Exmouth and could take either the van, stop over and pay for a couple of nights parking, or the car and stay for a couple of hours and have an ice-cream. Now we won't go at all and I wonder what the council revenues are from the current arrangement - covid excepted.

 

[Phileas Fogg]

So what are going to do ban certain people from going to places you think that they should not go to ? To allow free movement for the people you think should be allowed there ?

You totally lost me there I am afraid, I never suggested people couldn't go where they like.
Anyway back to Devon on thread...