Motorhome App (1 Viewer)

[pappajohn]

Not forcing you to use it I am literally writing this for my own pleasure and use. Just offering it out if anyone else wants it.

no offence meant :Blush:

just saying it's overcomplicating something already available

 

[Gromett]

no offence meant :Blush:

just saying it's overcomplicating something already available

None Taken:thumb:.

Can simplify it further with a notepad and pencil though.

Maybe not for you but I am fed up of simple things like having to get out of the van to look at the tax disk or tyre size. Or opening my safe to get the MOT docs out to find the date. Having a shared database of wifi access points will be handy. Checklists even for an old hand like me would be useful. Having all my MH related info in one place would be a godsend.

If its not for you its not for you however. I want it, I have the ability to write it so I am going to write it

 

[Gromett]

I am raring to crack on with this however I need an android device to work with and it looks like it will be a couple of months before I can get my Galaxy Note 2.

I am looking for a very cheap android tablet with Jellybean. It must have GPS but other than that I don't care about the quality as it is not for use just for testing/development work.

Can anyone recommend a really cheap one please. The £50 ones on ebay don't appear to have GPS unfortunately?

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[Gromett]

ok, this will be bad news for some people but for some good news.

I just can't get on with LiveCode as it is way too verbose and I am used to very terse programming languages. Also I don't like having to draw everything on the screen then try to figure out why it doesn't do what I want it to do.

I am therefore starting again using a traditional programming language.

I have been looking at using the Qt toolkit and writing it in either C++ or Python (PyQt). However each of these methods is sub optimal on each platform. It would run on all of them but wouldn't look quite right from what I can make out.

I have therefore decided to drop the desktop versions and concentrate on phones/tablets which means Android only. With the possibility of converting to Blackberry Playbook later.

I am sorry for the IOS people but I would need to write two versions one in Objective C and the other in Java which is just too much work for a hobby project.

As per my previous post I am looking for a dirt cheap tablet with GPS built in. So far it looks like £90 is the lowest priced one that will do the job.

I will therefore be targetting two versions of the software, one for phones and one for 7" tablets. For anyone familiar with Android Dev I will be using fragments to create the UI based on which device. So you either get a full screen side by side app or an app with a sliding bar along the top.

I have had a brief play with the android SDK using the emulator and It all looks straight forward enough. Java is enough like C/C++ and the UI stuff all appears to be almost pure XML.. Obviously still a learning curve starting from scratch but a lot more doable than trying to figure out which English words to use in which situation.

I much prefer braced languages with semi colon delimiters.oh:

PS: Sorry I mentioned Fragments without explaining what I meant.
http://developer.android.com/training/basics/fragments/fragment-ui.html

You can see a tablet side by side with a phone to give you some idea what it means.

 

[chrisboyo]

oh:I wish I knew what the hell Grommett is talking about oh:

 

[Gromett]

oh:I wish I knew what the hell Grommett is talking about oh:

Ignore the bits you don't understand. There are a few on here who are programmers also who know what I mean I am sure :thumb:

The bits you do understand are the bits that matter to you

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[SIFTA SAM]

ok, this will be bad news for some people but for some good news.

I just can't get on with LiveCode as it is way too verbose and I am used to very terse programming languages. Also I don't like having to draw everything on the screen then try to figure out why it doesn't do what I want it to do.

I am therefore starting again using a traditional programming language.

I have been looking at using the Qt toolkit and writing it in either C++ or Python (PyQt). However each of these methods is sub optimal on each platform. It would run on all of them but wouldn't look quite right from what I can make out.

I have therefore decided to drop the desktop versions and concentrate on phones/tablets which means Android only. With the possibility of converting to Blackberry Playbook later.

I am sorry for the IOS people but I would need to write two versions one in Objective C and the other in Java which is just too much work for a hobby project.

As per my previous post I am looking for a dirt cheap tablet with GPS built in. So far it looks like £90 is the lowest priced one that will do the job.

I will therefore be targetting two versions of the software, one for phones and one for 7" tablets. For anyone familiar with Android Dev I will be using fragments to create the UI based on which device. So you either get a full screen side by side app or an app with a sliding bar along the top.

I have had a brief play with the android SDK using the emulator and It all looks straight forward enough. Java is enough like C/C++ and the UI stuff all appears to be almost pure XML.. Obviously still a learning curve starting from scratch but a lot more doable than trying to figure out which English words to use in which situation.

I much prefer braced languages with semi colon delimiters.oh:

We could have told you that ages ago! It was so obvious to most of us I think?
Give us a call if you get 'stuck', we will 'sort it' in no time! Easy! (joke)

 

[Gromett]

The problem with livecode (taken from their tutorials)

To put text into a text box.

put “Hello” is in theText

In a traditional language in this case Java

document.write(theText.match("World")!=null);

Java makes more sense to me. So rather than fight to figure out how the high level language works I will move across to Java which is closer to PHP and C which I am already accustomed to.

 

[cbrookson]

I hate to suggest this, but it also works in Java as well as Basic!
http://www.nsbasic.com/app/

Might be worth a look, and would make it more portable for iOS and Android? Yes, I know it might make the code a bit bigger! They have a demo version you could have a look at.

Cheers

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[Gromett]

I hate to suggest this, but it also works in Java as well as Basic!
http://www.nsbasic.com/app/

Might be worth a look, and would make it more portable for iOS and Android? Yes, I know it might make the code a bit bigger! They have a demo version you could have a look at.

Cheers

I did look at this previously and ruled it out for a couple of reasons. The main one is I can't get on with Visual Basic. Probably pretty much the same reasons as Livecode.

I originally learnt to program in 6510 and 68000 asm code. I moved over to C and PHP when I moved to linux some 17 odd years ago.
I really do struggle with the high level languages and find it easier to speak to the computer in a language it understands rather than one normal humans wouldoh:. I completely skipped Basic as a programming language...

Over the last 4 years I have tried a couple of languages and spent over $700 on dev environments thinking they were the next big thing for me.. However I keep slipping back to PHP and C with a smattering of C++. I think I am getting too old now to learn a completely new way of doing things. Java however is close enough to C and PHP that I can convert across easily enough (I hope it will be easy enough)

App studio also has some limitations, it doesn't create native apps by the looks of things. It creates what look like html5 apps that run in a web browser using javascript (not java) some functionality requires you to install phonegap as well.

For some apps this would be fine. However I don't want to get into dev work only to find this is missing a feature I need and having to start yet again. I have already put 30+ hours into this project under Livecode, I don't want to get 30+ hours in and have to start again.

I think going platform native is the best way to get the best app possible. This unfortunately means writing to the platform in its native language which for Android is Java.

Anyway, I guess I am starting to waffle again oh:

Thanks for the suggestion though .

 

[Spacerunner]

Have you seen the Fiat Ducato Camper app which does a similar function to what you are developing?

Link Removed

 

[Gromett]

Have you seen the Fiat Ducato Camper app which does a similar function to what you are developing?

Link Removed

Yes, I looked at this before I decided to write one myself.
Mine does some stuff theirs doesn't and doesn't get involved in some of the things they do...

There is some overlap but not much to be honest.

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[1_man_and_his_dob(lo)]

I just can't get on with LiveCode as it is way too verbose and I am used to very terse programming languages.

Sounds a bit like the problem I had with SuperCard. It's OK having a supposedly easy-to-learn-like-English syntax, except it's long-winded and English being as flexible as it is, my idea of how a sentence should be constructed ends up being subtly different to the language designer's.

Good luck with the Java...despite my best efforts I've never been able to get into it properly and remain a C/Perl dinosaur

 

[Gromett]

Sounds a bit like the problem I had with SuperCard. It's OK having a supposedly easy-to-learn-like-English syntax, except it's long-winded and English being as flexible as it is, my idea of how a sentence should be constructed ends up being subtly different to the language designer's.

Good luck with the Java...despite my best efforts I've never been able to get into it properly and remain a C/Perl dinosaur

C I never had a problem with. Perl however is a nightmare for me. When I have to fix advanced perl scripts I always end up with a headache

I have had an idea for another feature for the software. Foreign travel check lists. This will list requirements for each country.
For example, spare glasses, triangles, breathalysers etc.

 

[Jaws]

Wifi Hotspot log
When you find a McDonalds with a free hotspot enter it here.

Just a thought ( and yes, I appreciate it is easy to think of these things and far from easy to execute !! )


Would it be possible to autolog wifi hot spots ?

Samsung had something like this on some of their upmarket laptops a while ago.

If you were in range of a wifi point with x amount of signal, it would auto log on, send a test packet to a web site .. if it got a response the place was logged and recorded

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[Gromett]

Just a thought ( and yes, I appreciate it is easy to think of these things and far from easy to execute !! )


Would it be possible to autolog wifi hot spots ?

Samsung had something like this on some of their upmarket laptops a while ago.

If you were in range of a wifi point with x amount of signal, it would auto log on, send a test packet to a web site .. if it got a response the place was logged and recorded

Might be possible down the line. The feature I am on about is for sharing the information. Automatically sharing all hotspots may not be a wise idea.. When I come to develop the feature I will look into the possibilities/gotchas more carefully.

The idea is that I will run a server that will allow users of the app to share information. This means that when you want a wifi hotspot the app can get a gps fix and tell you which one is geographically closest. Obviously to start with it will have limited data and usefulness but as people submit them it will become useful over time.

 

[Gromett]

I have just spent the last hour or so looking into gps coordinate system for calculating the nearest xxx to current location where xxx is wifi hotspot/campsite etc.

I needed some test data so did a search on the net and had a oh:oh:oh: moment.

There is no point me adding things like McDonalds wifi spots as these are available as a POI. Same with other providers of free wifi.

I was going to add a list of all CL's so you could just click a button and the app would tell you where the nearest one was along with a phone number. Again there is no point as these are available as a POI file.

Same with ACSI, Aires and French Passion sites.

So it looks like anything to do with mapping is best left to mapping programs. I am dropping these features as the amount of work involved is excessive for the minimal benefit of having it integrated.

I will put up the full feature list later and would appreciate any suggestions.

 

[Gromett]

I thought an update was in order so you didn't think I had forgotten.

I am currently parked outside mothers so have no access to a hookup. I am therefore limited to my windows laptop which is not what I consider a suitable development environment unfortunately.

She is back in for an assessment on the 21st May. Then if all is well she will wait for a date for her next op. This could be anywhere from 2-6 weeks. She will then be in hospital for hopefully only 2 weeks. After that I will need to be around for at least 4 more weeks. We are therefore looking at 3 months before I can get to a campsite where I can get internet access and a hookup.

This is the middle of prime weather time where I doubt I will be spending much time inside programming unfortunately... Unless we have another typical English summer of course.

I am sorry to say this project is going on the back burner until later in the year. However, I have not forgotten about it nor have I abandoned it.
It will be done but not quite as soon as I hoped to sorry.

I am getting a break in the middle of June. My sister and nephews are coming down for a week to give me a break and I will be taking that opportunity to go to Stratford. So if anyone is there that wants a chat about the App, I am sure we can improve the basic plan no end ready for when I can sit down to write it.:thumb:

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[Deckard]

Gromett, you have other things which are a greater priority...the app will get written in good time I am sure.

Best wishes for your mum :thumb:

 

[WynandJean]

I am finding this thread fascinating from the point of view of realising that programming involves so much more than just sitting down and writing a set of instructions, clicking 'run' and it's done. While not understanding much of the thread it is fascinating to follow it!

Does that make sense? or maybe it is just me

Wyn

 

[Gromett]

There is a difference. Developing opposed to programming.
A programmer can be paid by a large company to perform a specific function and he will just sit down and bang out code to the specification and tests.
He won't be involved in the design process, he won't do any ui development, he won't write the unit tests and won't have much to do with overall security.

However developing a software package or program is much more than just banging in code.

You first have to decide what the program has to achieve. This is harder than you might think. Some features are obvious but others have to be thought about carefully. Does it belong in this program, can we do it well enough that it will be useful within the resource allocation. Is there other software out there that does or can do it better than our attempt.

Once you have the feature list etc. You then have to work out the user interface. Just writing each feature in order won't work as you will end up with a higgledy piggledy mess and quite often half way through you will realise that the format/database you are using for your data won't work and you have to redo that bit and rewrite anything that uses that data. So the up front design process is vital. Decide on the layout (ui), database and file formats and feature list etc.

You have to write unit tests. You have to imagine every way possible that a user can mess things up and create automated tests. A unit test for a single data entry field could end up with 10's of tests each entering different types of random data 1,000's of times into a text box to see if the program handles it correctly or breaks in unexpected ways. These tests quite often take longer to write than the component you are testing :Angry:

There is a lot more to it than the above. But while you are doing all this you have to be anticipating 2 things. Security, how could this be broken into or abused to gain access to the system it is running on. Stability. What happens if the battery goes flat at this point or we lose internet connection half way through saving/reading/writing data.

Banging out a quick App, is possible if it is incredibly simple and you don't care about security or failure modes. But Apps that are created this way will very quickly get low ratings and fall to the bottom of the heap.

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[JJ]

Please don't forget to incude that design feature which I suggested where the presence of Fray Bentos Pies is detected and that motohome is directed to QMJ automatically... :thumb:

JJ :Cool:

PS. Could you programme it to ignore pies with kidney or chicken in them... I can't eat those...

 

[Philcott]

Just caught up with this thread and I'm really looking forward to hearing more about this app. As others have said, a lot more goes into 'making' them than I realised.

Best wishes to you mum - I do hope her recovery is speedy, both for your's and her's sake.

(also means you can get on with the app quicker! )

Oh and thanks for wanting to share it with us loop fruits!

 

[Gromett]

I had a couple of hours to play today so I installed the Android Development environment and spent those hours trying to get windows to play nice...

It's not as easy to set up as it is under Linux.

Anyway I am now up and running but I could do with some info off you guys please.

This is only relevant to Android users not IOS.
Can you tell me what Android Version you are using ie V4.1.2 and your screen resolution please.

I want to set up a few test devices to ensure my screen resizing algorithms will work ok.

Thanks.

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[Spenders]

This is only relevant to Android users not IOS.
Can you tell me what Android Version you are using ie V4.1.2 and your screen resolution please.

I want to set up a few test devices to ensure my screen resizing algorithms will work ok.

Thanks.

Grommet,

I am using a Samsung Galaxy SIII Mini, which runs on Android 4.1.2 (Jelly Bean) with a screen resolution of 800x400 (so I'm told!).

Hope that helps.

Simon

 

[scotjimland]

Galaxy SIII

Android 4.1.2

screen resolution of 1280 x 720

also

Galaxy Ace 2

Android 2.3.6

screen resolution 800 x 480

 

[GJH]

There is a difference. Developing opposed to programming.
A programmer can be paid by a large company to perform a specific function and he will just sit down and bang out code to the specification and tests.
He won't be involved in the design process, he won't do any ui development, he won't write the unit tests and won't have much to do with overall security.

However developing a software package or program is much more than just banging in code.(snip)

Takes me back. I was just trying to find my files from when I used to both do it and train people in it but must have put them in a safer place than I thought.
The basic stages are Requirements Definition, System Design, System Development (the banging out code bit), Testing and Maintenance (other terminology is available).
A resource/time graph comes out looking a bit like a snail with few resources being employed in Requirements Definition, building up to the most being expended in Development, less in Testing and (if the job is done right) relatively few in Maintenance.
The main things to remember are:
a) If you don't get RD right you haven't a cat in hell's chance of the system doing what is really required.
b) Test against the system requirements not what the program spec says.
c) Test using properly structured test data (where it is possible to know the correct results because the inputs are defined) not just some field trials pretending to be tests because they are labelled "Beta".
Dead easy

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[ShiftZZ]

And then you get Westward Ho buggering it all up.. !!!! oh:

 

[Bailey58]

Grommet,

I am using a Samsung Galaxy SIII Mini, which runs on Android 4.1.2 (Jelly Bean) with a screen resolution of 800x400 (so I'm told!).

Hope that helps.

Simon

Same phone and OS for me so assume Screen res is the same.

 

[Gromett]

Looking good now I have the dev environment setup... Working on the basic UI setup now.

Google IO had an interesting feature which I wish was in Eclipse already.
http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2013/05/google-gives-developers-app-beta-testing-multi-player-api/

Java is proving to be an easier nut to crack than I expected. However the API and things to learn list is HUGE and getting bigger. Each time I learn something new 5 more things show up to learn... It's all good though. Lots of neat little tricks to make the App interesting and useful. I am playing around with autocomplete at the moment to make searching for stuff easier for you lot :thumb:
I really should get back to the basic UI though rather than playing with the shiny shiny...

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