Mass in Service vs MIRO and other weight questions?

[Robster100]

Hi

REALLY new to this Motorhome stuff so please treat me gently!

Mass in Service in my V5 says 3080Kg, is this the same as MIRO or is it Unladen weight (for calculating driving speeds)?

If it is the same as MIRO, where can I find the unladen weight, cannot see this anywhere on V5!

Just been to weigh bridge for the first time, garage is fully loaded, fuel tank is full, water tank (120Lt) is full, 1 x 11Kg and 1 x 6Kg gas bottles), but no food, clothes or people on board.

Weights were front Axle 1620Kg, rear Axle 1860Kg (ratings on van are 1850Kg, 2000Kg and 3850Kg gross), so I have some leeway but my questions is, I need to add a towbar, do you think 140Kg is enough to add the towbar or will this push me too close to the axle limit?

Robin

 

[gus-lopez]

the actual towbar will weigh around 30kgs. then if just towing it will be nose weight + a bit for the cantilever affect. Doesn't leave mucg for people food ,clothes etc. Unless they all go in the trailer

 

[lunarman]

Robster100 I have recently removed the towbar from my van. The bar is a talk01 for an alko chassis. It weighs 37kg, when you take into effect the lever action the bar itself put 50kg+ on the back axle. Add the load on the ball and you would be perilously close to the 2000kg limit on your van.

 

[DBK]

Mass in Service is the weight of the vehicle plus 75kg for the driver but not including any extras added. It's meaningless so I wouldn't worry about it.

You should be OK with a towbar but only if you are not going to hang a scooter on it. You don't have 140kg to play with as the overhang at the rear will increase the load on the rear axle. How much depends on the distance from the towbar load to the rear axle and the wheelbase. You may only have 100kg, which would be ok for push bikes and possibly ebikes.

 

[Robster100]

I am planning on towing a small car on an A Frame.

There should actually be very little weight on the towwbar from the A frame itself and yes, I plan on using the tow car for anything extra heavy I want to take with me.

I don't understand what I would need to do to update the rear axle to give me a couple of hundred extra Kg for safety margin, and how much it would cost, I cannot do it myself.

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[Lenny HB]

Mass in Service in my V5 says 3080Kg, is this the same as MIRO or is it Unladen weight (for calculating driving speeds)?

The MIRO will be around 180kg more than the unladen weight, it is the unladen weight that dictates speed limits in the UK, abroad it is MAM (Gross weight). Unladen weight is never given for Motorhomes.

I don't understand what I would need to do to update the rear axle to give me a couple of hundred extra Kg for safety margin, and how much it would cost, I cannot do it myself.

Depends on the chassis if a Fiat chassis you could get air asistance for about £600 fitted, if an Al-Ko chassis £2000 for semi air or £4500 for full air on the rear.
If your wheels are 16" tyres will probably be OK, if 15" you will need to change the tyres for a higher load rating, normally means changing to 225 section tyres.

 

[Robster100]

Regarding food etc. most of this will be in fridge and kitchen cupboards which are all well forward closer to the front axle, so I am hoping will not impact rear axle weight too much!

 

[Robster100]

The MIRO will be around 180kg more than the unladen weight, it is the unladen weight that dictates speed limits in the UK, abroad it is MAM (Gross weight). Unladen weight is never given for Motorhomes.

So if my "Mass in Service" in V5 says 3080Kg, am I restricted to lower speeds or cars speeds?

The question obviously ignores the tow car, I realise that if I am towing I will be at slower speeds regardless of unladen weight.

I just don't understand where I can find the Unladen Weight?

 

[Lenny HB]

So if my "Mass in Service" in V5 says 3080Kg, am I restricted to lower speeds or cars speeds?

The question obviously ignores the tow car, I realise that if I am towing I will be at slower speeds regardless of unladen weight.

I just don't understand where I can find the Unladen Weight?

Unladen weight is never quoted for Motorhomes, with your weight you be well under the 3050kg for car speeds.

I just updated my post #6 with info on uprating the rear axle.

 

[Robster100]

Unladen weight is never quoted for Motorhomes, with your weight you be well under the 3050kg for car speeds.

I just updated my post #6 with info on uprating the rear axle.

Many thanks, useful information.

I think for now I will just the towbar fitted and reweigh.

If necessary I will just move some of the heavier items in the garage to the tow car.

As it is our first motorhome I don't want to spend loads more money and then have the wife say she does not like motor homing!

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[Lenny HB]

Many thanks, useful information.

I think for now I will just the towbar fitted and reweigh.

If necessary I will just move some of the heavier items in the garage to the tow car.

As it is our first motorhome I don't want to spend loads more money and then have the wife say she does not like motor homing!

Towing you will be limited to the lower speed limits anyway.

 

[Joc]

Don’t load up with food and drink, buy it on arrival once you’re there.
Travel with your water tank either empty or partially filled, filling fully on arrival.
If you go to the SVTech web site they have a handy motorhome weight calculator which will work out your GVW for you.

 

[The Wino]

Many thanks, useful information.


As it is our first motorhome I don't want to spend loads more money and then have the wife say she does not like motor homing!

In that case I would suggest a few trips first before sorting out the towcar and towbar. There's another thread about it on here with quite different views both ways.

 

[Bessy765]

Look at your max gross train weight. This takes the weight of the van and whatever you are towing.
if you are on 215/70/r15 to get 3850 kg with a rear axle loading of 2240 kg you will need semi air rear suspension and 225/70/r15 tyres if you van chassis is similar to our old Aspire 255.

 

[TheCaller]

Don’t load up with food and drink, buy it on arrival once you’re there.
Travel with your water tank either empty or partially filled, filling fully on arrival.

A lot of people on this forum are effectively 'there' the minute they leave home. One of the advantages of a motorhome is that you can, if it suits, head for places where there are no shops or water supply.

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[Robster100]

As things stand I think I have enough payload to have both food and water onboard, once we have used the motorhome a couple of times, we will make the decision on the towbar, then life might get more interesting!

 

[EmnM]

I have a Compass Suntor 400. The original weight being 3050kg. Sv tech upgraded it to 3200Kg as standard versus original van when new. Why they did this is beyond me. I had it upgraded to 3500 kg. Just a paper exercise bit why not done in the first instance when Motorhome manufacturers and dealers know motorhomes are running at or near max payload to start with.

 

[busby]

Don’t load up with food and drink, buy it on arrival once you’re there.
Travel with your water tank either empty or partially filled, filling fully on arrival.
If you go to the SVTech web site they have a handy motorhome weight calculator which will work out your GVW for you.

Doing that would be no good to how we travel.We use aires a lot,,some without water etc a never know when or where we will be stopping so need to be fully filled with water,food and drink.BUSBY.

 

[gwyntaxi]

Many thanks, useful information.

I think for now I will just the towbar fitted and reweigh.

If necessary I will just move some of the heavier items in the garage to the tow car.

As it is our first motorhome I don't want to spend loads more money and then have the wife say she does not like motor homing!

All very well putting the extra weight of heavies in the car, as long as it's only in this country and not the EU.

 

[Robster100]

Well I have seen varied advice about towing abroad on an A Frame, however we currently have no plans to travel out of the UK So I don’t see an issue!

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[Stealaway]

Doing that would be no good to how we travel.We use aires a lot,,some without water etc a never know when or where we will be stopping so need to be fully filled with water,food and drink.BUSBY.

We only find water when we need it and then never more than half a tank. There are so many aires with water it's never a problem finding one especially in France.

 

[Lenny HB]

We only find water when we need it and then never more than half a tank. There are so many aires with water it's never a problem finding one especially in France.

France is one place we do have a problem finding water, between November and April 75% of Aires have the water turned off.

 

[Lenny HB]

A lot of people on this forum are effectively 'there' the minute they leave home. One of the advantages of a motorhome is that you can, if it suits, head for places where there are no shops or water supply.

Doing that would be no good to how we travel.We use aires a lot,,some without water etc a never know when or where we will be stopping so need to be fully filled with water,food and drink.BUSBY.

When ever we set off we like to have a full tank, nothing worse than no water for the morning shower.