LiFeP04 Power Installation (1 Viewer)

[mojo]

Thought you might be interested in what I am doing to our van soon and what I have learned .Many forums discuss the pro cons of such a expensive power supply and I fall in to the try it and see bracket as we are now full time and having invested a lot in to our (new to us) Hymer Starline I want bells and whistles.

The cons say stick with conventional batteries as the technology will get cheaper as time goes and the pro say its the best thing they have had fitted to their vans.

We had Road Pro install the inverter some months back to allow use of 240v items such as kettle,hotplate,microwave,etc but soon learned that our expectations were high.The batteries ( 3x100 amp gel -usable 150 amp ) soon flattened and we found more experienced motorhomers only used their invertors sparingly.

The problem is that the batteries are not designed to supply large lumps of power but a smaller steady 12v supply.Along with that they take quite a while to charge again despite having 3x100 amp solar roof panels and a 180 amp “smart” alternator.

My research brings us to the LiFe04 technology and a better understanding of what is going on in the power supply presently on the van.


1 The expensive single NDS 150 amp LiFe04 battery can discharge down to 10% and the standard batteries down to 50% .The NDS weighs 21 kg and the three older ones weigh 60kg + .

The NDS can charge much quicker so replacing 30 % lost power even when just tick over on the engine for half hour,the old would require more to achieve that.

It works better with a inverter than standard due to its ability to give larger output without any detrimental harm to the cells ,unlike standard.

“IF” it works as promised it will have a long life 12 to 20 years and pay itself back by avoiding campsite electric charges typically £3.00 per day and can be transferred to any new van we may purchase in the future.


2 I now understand that the regulator for my solar panels could provide more power to the battery if it was a MPPT type .This boosts the input when needed for a quicker charge .


3 I now understand that a battery to battery charger will also provide a much quicker charge from the engine and that the standard item probably does not allow for the fact that this vans Euro 6 engine has a “smart” alternator.This has regenarative braking and provides peaks and troughs that can damage batteries.

The Sterling Power video on B to B for smart inverters would be interesting to any Euro 6 owners.Perhaps all new vans should have a similar device fitted as standard for battery protection.


So there we have it ,best part of three grand with fitting to get the best 12v power supply presently available .All change in a few years time maybe but then you can constantly put off buying the newest tech .


Work will be carried out by Road Pro and fitted to a forward locker instead of in the rear garage as we have rear axle load issue.

 

[Stealaway]

We had Road Pro install the inverter some months back to allow use of 240v items such as kettle,hotplate,microwave,etc but soon learned that our expectations were high.The batteries ( 3x100 amp gel -usable 150 amp ) soon flattened and we found more experienced motorhomers only used their invertors sparingly.

How much!!
Can you not rationalise your electrical consumption. There are compromises that can be made - Gas kettle?
Most wild campers, myself included, manage quite happily without resorting to this amount of expense.

 

[Lenny HB]

Hope it lives up to your expectations and if you can justify it why not.
I do not think you hadn't really explotied your original system fully, 300 watts of solar is not really enough for full time all year round use probably need at least 600 watts and a good quality MPPT regulator such as the Victron or Votronic would make a big difference at this time of year. Your Gel batteries can be discharged to 20% and still give a long service life.

If you are thinking of fitting a B2B have a look at the German Votronic ones a much better product but they are a bit dearer.

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[138go]

Really cannot believe you want to run everything of electric. How do you expect to recharge the batteries. You are not going to be very popular if you leave your engine running on a campsite. It won't do the engine a lot of good either the bores can glaze over as the engine is not doing any work. To get any sort of output from the alternator engine needs to be doing over 1000 rpm. Gas cooking is far more suitable than an electric hot plate. You will also have to watch the discharge rate as I don't think you will be able to use electric hot plate and microwave together.

 

[CazPaul]

x3 100amp gels is a good system, if they soon flattened then you are hammering the inverter, no matter what you have you need to monitor inverter use carefully.
We had x2 Rolls Surrette 6 volt batteries when we were full timing, absolutely brilliant they were plus 360 watt of solar and mppt.

 

[PaulW2]

This may or may not be correct, but I was told that you couldn’t/shouldn’t draw more than about 100 amps from these batteries. If you power an inverter and then use (say) a 1,500 watt electrical appliance at 240 volts, this will result (allowing for less than 100 percent efficiency) in a draw of say 150 amps at 12 volts.

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[olley]

Your money, your choice, hope it does what you want.

 

[Freespirit1]

Your money, your choice, hope it does what you want.

Yes - and having read what has been said (and very interesting) about these EZA systems on the other thread it's good that some like @mojo share their ideas and experiences for us all to think about and benefit - don't you think?

 

[tonyidle]

Yes - and having read what has been said (and very interesting) about these EZA systems on the other thread it's good that some like @mojo share their ideas and experiences for us all to think about and benefit - don't you think?

Maybe ............ but it would be even more interesting (and add context to the equipment described) if we understood why such a course was embarked upon. My own energy usage rationale, for example, is to operate every appliance possible using the most easily replenished fuel. To me that is LPG so any heating or cooking would primarily use that fuel. The only other available fuel or power source is 12v from a storage battery so I would aim charge to charge it efficiently then use it as efficiently as possible. Charging would involve as much solar as there is room on the roof and the best solar regulator. Then anything that can be directly powered from 12v should be: 12v chargers for tech, toothbrushes, and vacuum cleaners should be checked for availability. Inverter output mains is there to charge or operate appliances that cannot operate by any other means. In general these comprise microwave ovens and hair care devices - both used relatively briefly.

I'm certainly not knocking the OPs choices and I'm pleased that we'll all learn from his experiences.

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[olley]

Maybe ............ but it would be even more interesting (and add context to the equipment described) if we understood why such a course was embarked upon. My own energy usage rationale, for example, is to operate every appliance possible using the most easily replenished fuel. To me that is LPG so any heating or cooking would primarily use that fuel. The only other available fuel or power source is 12v from a storage battery so I would aim charge to charge it efficiently then use it as efficiently as possible. Charging would involve as much solar as there is room on the roof and the best solar regulator. Then anything that can be directly powered from 12v should be: 12v chargers for tech, toothbrushes, and vacuum cleaners should be checked for availability. Inverter output mains is there to charge or operate appliances that cannot operate by any other means. In general these comprise microwave ovens and hair care devices - both used relatively briefly.

I'm certainly not knocking the OPs choices and I'm pleased that we'll all learn from his experiences.

That's a rational approach, not all of us follow that way of thinking.
I often buy things on whim, I expect if some of us had a look in our workshops, we would find a few items bought, used once and stuffed in a cupboard.

 

[two]

Good for you. Please keep us updated and share your discoveries. I, for one, will be watching with interest as LiFePO4 is also part of my upgrade plan. Do you have a battery monitor installed?

 

[mojo]

Thanks all for your thoughts.I have also posted on the full timers section.Give it a look and the link to someone who has used lithium for last 4 years .

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