If a dealer goes into administration?

[DT]

Few years ago our local Swift dealer tried the pay before collection for a new caravan. I had placed £500 cc deposit and refused the pre payment. Upon collection and inspection one outer panel had damage so despite the repair/respray offer as no other identical van available for weeks I declined to take delivery and asked for a deposit refund. But suprise suprise they obtained a replacement in less that ten days.

 

[Minxy]

6 years, we paid a deposit and then used 13 different zero % credit cards to pay off the balance of well over £100k at collection / handover.

It was easier to obtain zero% credit cards back then and we came to an arrangement with the dealer regarding paying the % he was charged for using credit cards

How much did you have to pay the dealer for the % fee? Was it less than the interest you earned on the money in your savings accounts allowing for the card payments?

We then kept the money in our account earning interest and paid the credit cards off when the zero % was ending (ranging from 15 to 27 months). So a win win for us all together with the protection of the CC agreement.

No you're wrong, no CC protection as over £30k total purchase cost.

 

[Fulham Dave]

How much did you have to pay the dealer for the % fee? Was it less than the interest you earned on the money in your savings accounts allowing for the card payments?


No you're wrong, no CC protection as over £30k total purchase cost.

Yes, far far less - we split the fee, so 0.5% each - we were receiving roughly 9% on our money.

I thought as the purchase I made with each card was less than £30,000, then we were covered - my mistake. Would the initial deposit have been covered?

 

[Minxy]

I thought as the purchase I made with each card was less than £30,000, then we were covered - my mistake. Would the initial deposit have been covered?

No, it's to a maximum overall value of £30k, over that it doesn't cover anything. Even if your deposit is below that the total cost is the deciding factor.

 

[Steve-N]

Never, ever pay before collection day. Ideally, you'll be holding the keys, but at least a bill of sale; as you click send in your banking app

It's all very well saying that, but many dealers want 'cleared funds' before you arrive to collect your van, especially if its a brand new one.
Our dealer wanted exactly that, but it was a big company and I did a companies house credit check beforehand and was happy their own credit rating was good.
The difference was it had been registered a couple if days before in my namen and the emailed a copy of proof of registration.
The actual V5 arrived in the post a few days later from DVLA.
We had no issues whatsoever, we arrived to a pre-booked collection time slot and handover, as did others who were also collecting their vans.

 

[Minxy]

It's all very well saying that, but many dealers want 'cleared funds' before you arrive to collect your van, especially if its a brand new one.

Tough-titty to them then! We've bought a few new ones and never paid in full before collection day and never would. They can 'want' all they like but there's no safe way to do so thus the dosh stays with us until we get our mitts on the MH.

 

[Jim]

, but many dealers want 'cleared funds' before you arrive to collect your van,

They do, but not more than they want to sell the van. If they can get away with getting paid early, they will. If you refuse, they’ll work around it.

 

[Dippy9]

I always pay the balance on the day of collection once I have actually seen the van .Also I always put a small amount on finance . This will give you additional rights and the paperwork is not signed until you collect . It should mean the title of the van belongs to the finance company until your last payment.Also some dealers finance their stock so title actually belongs to them until your dealer has paid for it. Some dealers can’t pay their finance until you pay them !By you taking a small finance on the van it stops them doing this as It has to be title free before it can be financed . I would not hand over a large amount of money until the van is in my sight .

Got it, thank you.

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[Dippy9]

Whenever buying vehicles (motorhome / cars), I've always paid the deposit on credit card.
Then on day of collection, I take my laptop and pay the balance by bank transfer. That's my method, and I won't change.
Standard bank transfer limit of £100K can be raised by the bank temporally (normally for an hour).

The limit at my bank is 50k but I need to speak to them again I think to see if they can do something like this.

 

[The Wino]

The limit at my bank is 50k but I need to speak to them again I think to see if they can do something like this.

From the internet


A CHAPS payment (Clearing House Automated Payment System) is a secure, same-day electronic bank-to-bank transfer system in the UK, used for high-value or time-critical payments like property deposits, ensuring funds arrive by the end of the business day if sent before the cutoff. It's a reliable method for large transactions when Faster Payments aren't suitable, offering guaranteed settlement, though typically involves a fee and is processed in £ Sterling.

 

[Loopyxlou]

Can’t you use your debit card? We used it to pay our balance on our new motorhome last year. I think we rang the bank beforehand just to see if anything needed doing and they said just use it as normal.

 

[Lenny HB]

Can’t you use your debit card? We used it to pay our balance on our new motorhome last year. I think we rang the bank beforehand just to see if anything needed doing and they said just use it as normal.

Most dealers won't take payments with debit cards now as they charge a percentage like credit cards.
Even car dealers are the same, when we bought a car last year they wouldn't accept a DC, always paid for cars that way in the past.

 

[KASPAR]

Most dealers won't take payments with debit cards now as they charge a percentage like credit cards.
Even car dealers are the same, when we bought a card last year they wouldn't accept a DC, always paid for cars that way in the past.

Due to collect new car shortly (hopefully end of next week), checked with dealer about paying; debit card preferred with no charges. Will transfer funds into current account that I remember the PIN number for earlier on the day of collection!!

 

[The Wino]

Most dealers won't take payments with debit cards now as they charge a percentage like credit cards.
Even car dealers are the same, when we bought a car last year they wouldn't accept a DC, always paid for cars that way in the past.

I wonder when it changed when we ran our buisness it was a flat charge and a very low one for debit cards.

 

[Lenny HB]

I wonder when it changed when we ran our buisness it was a flat charge and a very low one for debit cards.

Fairly recent, bought our van in June 2024, dealers info on payment said they don't accept DC, I spoke to the dealer he said it was because of the charges.

The we bought from Motorpoint last May they also would only accept bank transfer.

 

[BikerGraham]

Fairly recent, bought our van in June 2024, dealers info on payment said they don't accept DC, I spoke to the dealer he said it was because of the charges.

The we bought from Motorpoint last May they also would only accept bank transfer.

same with me. Bought a Mercedes last August at local dealer and paid holding deposit on credit card. But it had to be bank transfer for the balance. Would not accept cards.
They wanted cleared payment no later than the day before collection. I paid on arrival via my banking app, having checked the car over. They reluctantly accepted this as I gave them no choice, either accept that or lose the sale.

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[The Wino]

same with me. Bought a Mercedes last August at local dealer and paid holding deposit on credit card. But it had to be bank transfer for the balance. Would not accept cards.
They wanted cleared payment no later than the day before collection. I paid on arrival via my banking app, having checked the car over. They reluctantly accepted this as I gave them no choice, either accept that or lose the sale.

Can you imagine selling to a dealer and asking them for cleared payment the day before they see it!

 

[KnisteUK]

We are picking up a brand new van next week and I have to make the final payment this week; the price is significantly over £100k though we’ve paid a substantial deposit already. Once the remaining balance has been paid in full (bank transfer is the only viable option) the vehicle will be registered in my name. For no real reason I’ve started worrying about what would happen if the dealer went into administration after I’d paid but before I’ve collected. I’m kind of assuming that once the vehicle is paid for and registered to me it’s my property and so I would not be an ‘unsecured creditor’ but simply someone who needs to recover their property from the dealer’s premises though I recognise that this in itself might be fraught. Grateful for any thoughts or insight from those who know more than me on this subject.

If you are worried, then enter the shop, execute final transfer, collect receipt, collect car papers and then go and register the van in your name.

 

[The Wino]

If you are worried, then enter the shop, execute final transfer, collect receipt, collect car papers and then go and register the van in your name.

I'm not sure if it's a new vehicle if you can do this. You need a registration number to get tax and it needs to be registeted to you unless you want to be registered as the second owner.

 

[KnisteUK]

I'm not sure if it's a new vehicle if you can do this. You need a registration number to get tax and it needs to be registeted to you unless you want to be registered as the second owner.

another way to look at it:
That is a nightmare scenario for any buyer. When you’ve handed over GBP100,000 and the seller goes bust before the goods arrive, you stop being a "customer" and effectively become an unsecured creditor in a bankruptcy proceeding.
Here is the breakdown of your legal and financial position in this situation.

---

1. The Legal Reality: Ownership vs. Debt​

The biggest hurdle is determining whether you actually own the item or if you are simply owed the item.

• If the item is "Identified": If the specific item (e.g., a car with a specific VIN or a piece of machinery with a serial number) was set aside and tagged for you, you may have a claim that the title has already passed to you. In this case, you might be able to demand delivery.
• If it's "Generic" Stock: If you just ordered "one unit" from a warehouse of many, you likely do not own it yet. The item remains part of the seller's "estate," which will be liquidated to pay off their debts.

2. Your Place in the "Payment Line"​

Bankruptcy courts follow a strict hierarchy of who gets paid first. Unfortunately, individual buyers are usually at the bottom.

Priority	Creditor Type	Likely Outcome
High	Secured Creditors (Banks/Lenders with liens)	Paid first from asset sales.
Medium	Administrative Expenses (Lawyers/Liquidators)	Paid to keep the lights on during the process.
Medium	Employees	Owed wages often get a small priority.
Low	Unsecured Creditors (You)	Share whatever "crumbs" are left after everyone above is paid.

 

[Dippy9]

Few years ago our local Swift dealer tried the pay before collection for a new caravan. I had placed £500 cc deposit and refused the pre payment. Upon collection and inspection one outer panel had damage so despite the repair/respray offer as no other identical van available for weeks I declined to take delivery and asked for a deposit refund. But suprise suprise they obtained a replacement in less that ten days.

Out of interest, on what basis can you refuse delivery and ask for your deposit to be refunded? How bad does the damage have to be? A damaged panel doesn’t sound terminal.

From the internet


A CHAPS payment (Clearing House Automated Payment System) is a secure, same-day electronic bank-to-bank transfer system in the UK, used for high-value or time-critical payments like property deposits, ensuring funds arrive by the end of the business day if sent before the cutoff. It's a reliable method for large transactions when Faster Payments aren't suitable, offering guaranteed settlement, though typically involves a fee and is processed in £ Sterling.

From the internet


A CHAPS payment (Clearing House Automated Payment System) is a secure, same-day electronic bank-to-bank transfer system in the UK, used for high-value or time-critical payments like property deposits, ensuring funds arrive by the end of the business day if sent before the cutoff. It's a reliable method for large transactions when Faster Payments aren't suitable, offering guaranteed settlement, though typically involves a fee and is processed in £ Sterling.

I’ve cleared the use of a debit card with them this morning.

 

[Dippy9]

From the internet


A CHAPS payment (Clearing House Automated Payment System) is a secure, same-day electronic bank-to-bank transfer system in the UK, used for high-value or time-critical payments like property deposits, ensuring funds arrive by the end of the business day if sent before the cutoff. It's a reliable method for large transactions when Faster Payments aren't suitable, offering guaranteed settlement, though typically involves a fee and is processed in £ Sterling.

Works well for buying a house where a solicitor is involved but it’s not instant. They only guarantee by end of day so I can’t leave the dealer till it’s arrived, maybe late in the afternoon.

 

[Dippy9]

I'm not sure if it's a new vehicle if you can do this. You need a registration number to get tax and it needs to be registeted to you unless you want to be registered as the second owner.

You also need a registration number for insurance.

 

[Dippy9]

another way to look at it:
That is a nightmare scenario for any buyer. When you’ve handed over GBP100,000 and the seller goes bust before the goods arrive, you stop being a "customer" and effectively become an unsecured creditor in a bankruptcy proceeding.
Here is the breakdown of your legal and financial position in this situation.

---

1. The Legal Reality: Ownership vs. Debt​

The biggest hurdle is determining whether you actually own the item or if you are simply owed the item.

• If the item is "Identified": If the specific item (e.g., a car with a specific VIN or a piece of machinery with a serial number) was set aside and tagged for you, you may have a claim that the title has already passed to you. In this case, you might be able to demand delivery.
• If it's "Generic" Stock: If you just ordered "one unit" from a warehouse of many, you likely do not own it yet. The item remains part of the seller's "estate," which will be liquidated to pay off their debts.

2. Your Place in the "Payment Line"​

Bankruptcy courts follow a strict hierarchy of who gets paid first. Unfortunately, individual buyers are usually at the bottom.

Priority	Creditor Type	Likely Outcome
High	Secured Creditors (Banks/Lenders with liens)	Paid first from asset sales.
Medium	Administrative Expenses (Lawyers/Liquidators)	Paid to keep the lights on during the process.
Medium	Employees	Owed wages often get a small priority.
Low	Unsecured Creditors (You)	Share whatever "crumbs" are left after everyone above is paid.

Yes, the vehicle is identified, it’s from their stock. we’ve seen it and crawled all over it and the make/model is identified on the sales invoice.

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[Dippy9]

Can’t you use your debit card? We used it to pay our balance on our new motorhome last year. I think we rang the bank beforehand just to see if anything needed doing and they said just use it as normal.

I’m checking with the dealer today. The bank have said

 

[AshWattGuardz]

So last week I collected my new works van. Bought direct from Ford and initially only paid them a £1000 deposit. When the vehicle arrived at the showroom late February they registered the vehicle in my name ready for collection in March with no mention for any additional upfront funds. If they had it would have been a resounding "no" even though that was with a main Ford dealer and not a middle man (like every motorhome dealer out there). Money was transferred into their account Thursday morning, I collected it later that day.
Now accessories are different. If you want a load of personalised additions added to the vehicle prior to collection then I think the dealers are well within their rights to ask for that money upfront. If you chose to pull out the deal then that would be non refundable and the products would already be fitted.

 

[The Wino]

So last week I collected my new works van. Bought direct from Ford and initially only paid them a £1000 deposit. When the vehicle arrived at the showroom late February they registered the vehicle in my name ready for collection in March with no mention for any additional upfront funds. If they had it would have been a resounding "no" even though that was with a main Ford dealer and not a middle man (like every motorhome dealer out there). Money was transferred into their account Thursday morning, I collected it later that day.
Now accessories are different. If you want a load of personalised additions added to the vehicle prior to collection then I think the dealers are well within their rights to ask for that money upfront. If you chose to pull out the deal then that would be non refundable and the products would already be fitted.

Not the dreaded " Wet belt" that everyone is having kittens about on here! My friends an ex motor dealer and has a wet belt one he's pretty chilled about it but very careful on oil changes and it's used a lot.

 

[AshWattGuardz]

Not the dreaded " Wet belt" that everyone is having kittens about on here! My friends an ex motor dealer and has a wet belt one he's pretty chilled about it but very careful on oil changes and it's used a lot.

No I was sensible and went for the Petrol Hybrid so mine has a chain

 

[eddie]

No I was sensible and went for the Petrol Hybrid so mine has a chain

And it's green

 

[Gellyneck]

And it's green

and Irish?