HGV or not
- Thread starter caz
- Start date
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Geo
Trader - Funster
I thought that was always the case
Geo
Geo
Tony Hunt
Free Member
That point was always argued by GT. Wheres he gone these days, did somebody upset him? or did he upset somebody ?
Geo
Trader - Funster
Im the nearest in name so I got the Job
artona
Free Member
- Jul 31, 2007
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- 30 yrs and still not got a release date
Hi Caz
I have heard a few theories recently. At Shepton I was told by a haulage firm boss who was also driving a fantastic library bus conversion that other than the name Volvo on the back looked almost the same as RR's RV that he had read up The Coronas (or something) and he was of the opinion that you did not need an HGV license. The coronas are apparently the hauliers bible, although I have never heard of them.
I was told of the forthcoming change by a policeman but then again I read that Europe wants to stop us all driving anything over 3.5 tons.
Very confusing. Anyone heard of the coronas before
stew
I have heard a few theories recently. At Shepton I was told by a haulage firm boss who was also driving a fantastic library bus conversion that other than the name Volvo on the back looked almost the same as RR's RV that he had read up The Coronas (or something) and he was of the opinion that you did not need an HGV license. The coronas are apparently the hauliers bible, although I have never heard of them.
I was told of the forthcoming change by a policeman but then again I read that Europe wants to stop us all driving anything over 3.5 tons.
Very confusing. Anyone heard of the coronas before
stew
Croners
Hi Artona
I believe you are refering to 'Croners'
Croner - business compliance information and services
Regards Pat
Hi Artona
I believe you are refering to 'Croners'
Croner - business compliance information and services
Regards Pat
Tony Hunt
Free Member
At £625 for a years subscription there wont be many takers for that 
Forestboy
LIFE MEMBER
Yeah it's Croners
I subscribed to it for a year when I ran my own trucks but to be honest never read it in my opinion it was just too much information for a small business man to absorb. Mind you like RR said I'm a dumbo anyway
I subscribed to it for a year when I ran my own trucks but to be honest never read it in my opinion it was just too much information for a small business man to absorb. Mind you like RR said I'm a dumbo anyway
Hi Tony
To be fair it is directed at the Road Haulage Industry, one of the most regulated industries in the country, as such I imagine it is worth much more than that to prevent the loss of your business/livelyhood through non compliance to the very complex and constantly changing laws imposed on the road transport industry!
Running /taxing/servicing a motorhome is not the easiest thing in the world but please imagine having all of that plus tachographs, taxation classes/ operating licences/operating centres/weights/maintenance contracts/inspections/ records/health and safety/waste disposal/waste carrying licences all of which have to be documented and recorded with all the various agencies breathing down your neck.
The police and enforcement agencies don't seem that bothered with the various grey areas of the caravan/motorhome scene such as required driving licences or the question of the legality of 'A' frame towing, the main enforcement I have witnessed at VOSA inspections in lay bys or in service areas seems to be concentrated with on weight i.e the overloading of such vehicles and condition of tyres.
Regards Pat
To be fair it is directed at the Road Haulage Industry, one of the most regulated industries in the country, as such I imagine it is worth much more than that to prevent the loss of your business/livelyhood through non compliance to the very complex and constantly changing laws imposed on the road transport industry!
Running /taxing/servicing a motorhome is not the easiest thing in the world but please imagine having all of that plus tachographs, taxation classes/ operating licences/operating centres/weights/maintenance contracts/inspections/ records/health and safety/waste disposal/waste carrying licences all of which have to be documented and recorded with all the various agencies breathing down your neck.
The police and enforcement agencies don't seem that bothered with the various grey areas of the caravan/motorhome scene such as required driving licences or the question of the legality of 'A' frame towing, the main enforcement I have witnessed at VOSA inspections in lay bys or in service areas seems to be concentrated with on weight i.e the overloading of such vehicles and condition of tyres.
Regards Pat
moandick
Free Member
Neither Fish nor Fowl
Hi Tony - tread careful, mate - it was this very subject that got GT into trouble which, in my opinion, was a great shame as he was a wealth of knowledge on the subject. Very much opinionated BUt a stickler for the Rules which he took the time and trouble to read very, very deeply in an effort to understand the legal terminology.
Whatever anybody else might say - it would appear at the moment that an RV does not fit into any little square box on any little square form, necessary for the little square legal offices.
We are NOT an HGV because we cannot carry heavy goods, we do not need tachographs, driver working hours and we are not subject to the same speed limits (within reason) etc., etc., etc.
We are not a car (because of the weight) BUT we are MOT'ed as a car.
The EU and DVLA and various other agencies are all trying to reclassify vehicles by weight rather than by type BUT according to GT that has not yet happened so according strictly to the written law as it stands today - we are closer to a car classification than an HGV.
The RVDA, I am told, are working with the various Authorities on this subject but I am not privvy to their workings therefore at present, it is very much up to the individual to license themselves as they think they should.
Most of us think that driving an RV over 7.5 tons needs extra tuition and therefore go down the HGV route - whereas other people consider that driving an RV at 40ft is no different to driving a car at 14 ft and continue to do so on a car license.
Maybe, just maybe, someone has at last done something sensible and sorted out a very, very grey and much debated subject - and maybe, we will soon have proper guideline to abide by.
Hi Tony - tread careful, mate - it was this very subject that got GT into trouble which, in my opinion, was a great shame as he was a wealth of knowledge on the subject. Very much opinionated BUt a stickler for the Rules which he took the time and trouble to read very, very deeply in an effort to understand the legal terminology.
Whatever anybody else might say - it would appear at the moment that an RV does not fit into any little square box on any little square form, necessary for the little square legal offices.
We are NOT an HGV because we cannot carry heavy goods, we do not need tachographs, driver working hours and we are not subject to the same speed limits (within reason) etc., etc., etc.
We are not a car (because of the weight) BUT we are MOT'ed as a car.
The EU and DVLA and various other agencies are all trying to reclassify vehicles by weight rather than by type BUT according to GT that has not yet happened so according strictly to the written law as it stands today - we are closer to a car classification than an HGV.
The RVDA, I am told, are working with the various Authorities on this subject but I am not privvy to their workings therefore at present, it is very much up to the individual to license themselves as they think they should.
Most of us think that driving an RV over 7.5 tons needs extra tuition and therefore go down the HGV route - whereas other people consider that driving an RV at 40ft is no different to driving a car at 14 ft and continue to do so on a car license.
Maybe, just maybe, someone has at last done something sensible and sorted out a very, very grey and much debated subject - and maybe, we will soon have proper guideline to abide by.
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Tony Hunt
Free Member
Thanks for all that information guys. I actually own 3 7.5 tonne Box lorries that we use in conjunction with our Nursery business so i know all about operators licences, tachos etc. Quite agree its a major minefield and the sooner I can get out of it the better. I really envy some of the guys on here like Scotjimland who are free to roam having retired early.
Going back to GT he was an argumentative sod but he took the trouble to delve into things like you say and was very knowledgeable. He was adament that an RV could be driven on a car licence whatever its size and after reading all his arguments on the subject I would have had no hesitation to take a chance If I needed to like a lot of others seem to do. I think its a similar grey area like A frames where its never been properly challenged in court to prove anything one way or the other. I quite agree that the average car driver needs to take some HGV lessons to drive any size RV to be safe on the road for their own families sake as well as others. An RV is a totally different animal to your normal size Motorhome and needs treating with a lot of caution re width, overhang, height etc. At the moment Im more than happy to just live in my 38 footer on site and not drive anywhere in it, its cheap luxury accomadation as far as Im concerned and while I can get 23 to the gallon out of my Bessacarr while touring the Newmar at 8 mpg can stay jacked up
Going back to GT he was an argumentative sod but he took the trouble to delve into things like you say and was very knowledgeable. He was adament that an RV could be driven on a car licence whatever its size and after reading all his arguments on the subject I would have had no hesitation to take a chance If I needed to like a lot of others seem to do. I think its a similar grey area like A frames where its never been properly challenged in court to prove anything one way or the other. I quite agree that the average car driver needs to take some HGV lessons to drive any size RV to be safe on the road for their own families sake as well as others. An RV is a totally different animal to your normal size Motorhome and needs treating with a lot of caution re width, overhang, height etc. At the moment Im more than happy to just live in my 38 footer on site and not drive anywhere in it, its cheap luxury accomadation as far as Im concerned and while I can get 23 to the gallon out of my Bessacarr while touring the Newmar at 8 mpg can stay jacked up
Jim
Ringleader
I will have to correct that Dick. George did not get into trouble here through any motorhome subject. Even when debating his old favourites such as Licences and A Frames and he was always well researched and presented.
moandick
Free Member
Sorry, Jim - I wasn't implying that GT got into trouble with the site - he got into trouble with various members because of his very forthright views on certain subjects.
I don't know what happened to GT BUT because I sided with him on those subjects I did get a couple of PM's from certain people who were very, very rude about him - that is what I was trying to say, without being too specific - or raising old scores again.
I don't know what happened to GT BUT because I sided with him on those subjects I did get a couple of PM's from certain people who were very, very rude about him - that is what I was trying to say, without being too specific - or raising old scores again.
Tony Hunt
Free Member
Shame hes gone missing again he certainly was knowledgeable.
Camperian
Free Member
Has anyone actually heard of a driver being prosecuted in the UK for driving an over 7.5t motorhome on a C1 licence only?
Ian
Three Green
Ian
Three Green
Jim
Ringleader
Its not happened as far as anyone is aware. A Travelworld employee was stopped a couple of years ago and the police nicked him, however I believe TW prepared a robust defence and in the end the CPS decided not to prosecute.
I do know though that the TW employee now has a C licence
I do know though that the TW employee now has a C licence
moandick
Free Member
The story most often heard is that a TW man was charged for driving an RV in the fast lane of a motorway - he was pulled over and charged for driving an HGV in the outside lane of a motorway and exceeding the HGV speed limit.
Apparently the Judge decided that an RV cannot be classed as an HGV because there is nowhere to carry the 'Heavy Goods' - therefore the RV could not be an HGV - and consequently there was no case to answer.
That is generally thought to be the start of the 'grey' area as to what licence various people needed to drive RV etc., etc., etc.
Having said all of that - it probably comes down to the old statement from the War time where a message sent from the front-line saying "Send re-inforcements" eventually arrived as "Send three and fourpence"
Apparently the Judge decided that an RV cannot be classed as an HGV because there is nowhere to carry the 'Heavy Goods' - therefore the RV could not be an HGV - and consequently there was no case to answer.
That is generally thought to be the start of the 'grey' area as to what licence various people needed to drive RV etc., etc., etc.
Having said all of that - it probably comes down to the old statement from the War time where a message sent from the front-line saying "Send re-inforcements" eventually arrived as "Send three and fourpence"
Road Runner
Free Member
Thanks for clearing that up Dick
:thumb:
:thumb:
Tony Hunt
Free Member
Makes you wonder how many RVers are actually driving large coaches on their car licences. More than a few I bet.
Road Runner
Free Member
Why would they want to?
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