HELP! Buying new and have payload question (1 Viewer)

[petesax]

Hi there all, I’m buying a brand new Roller Team 756 and I’m concerned by the payload. I have expressed these concerns with the dealer and they have today sent me the below image of a weight check done on the specific vehicle that I’m buying. I’m struggling to work out what the actual MRO number is based on the actual weight. The spec details are MRO 3058kg but from what I can understand on this sheet this is under….thoughts? By the way I know it will be a little tight for 2 adults and an 8 year old but willing to go light-ish for a while until I take C1 test and upplate to 3,850 or possibly 3,950 but thanks to Covid this is unlikely to be until next year. So light-ish is one thing but having to leave the wife or son behind might not go down too well!!!!

 

[Badknee]

Where does the 142 come from? Only 3 of us 2 adults 1 8 year old

No probs, you work the maths out then clothes, towels, bedding, coats, shoes ‘n boots for the three of you plus a tank of fuel, water, gas bottles, outside chairs and a table perhaps, ramps, groundsheet, and loads of other bits and pieces we all have on board.
If you’ve made your mind up to buy then there’s nothing anyone can say to help you.

 

[rolosroller]

5 seater but only 3 of us using it 95% of the time, want space for friends and family to come meet us.

Where does the 142 come from? Only 3 of us 2 adults 1 8 year old

5 seater but only 3 of us using it 95% of the time, want space for friends and family to come meet us.

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[Speve]

I think you would be better off buying Perhaps a used Hymer A class they seem to have good payloads and nice vans,take a look in classifieds on the forum that will give you an idea of what’s on offer. just need to ensure you have reasonable amount of payload if you read Jim’s guide that will help?

 

[Lenny HB]

Unuseable even with up-plating?

Would still be very tight, you really need to be looking at vans with at least a 1000kg payload.
From my our experance 700 kg is just enough for 2 people.

 

[petesax]

5 seater but only 3 of us using it 95% of the time, want space for friends and family to come meet us.

Sorry I’m not being difficult just wondering how you calculated the 142 payload after passengers?

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[petesax]

Would still be very tight, you really need to be looking at vans with at least a 1000kg payload.
From my our experance 700 kg is just enough for 2 people.

Would still be very tight, you really need to be looking at vans with at least a 1000kg payload.
From my our experance 700 kg is just enough for 2 people.

I can’t see anything with 5 travel seats and a payload of 700kg+

 

[Speve]

Sorry I’m not being difficult just wondering how you calculated the 142 payload after passengers?

It’s quoted in your data sheet you posted useful load (pay load) what’s left after they included the other items.

 

[petesax]

It’s quoted in your data sheet you posted useful load (pay load) what’s left after they included the other items.

But am I not right in thinking that the weight of 2 travelers that won’t be in the van will add an additional 150kg to that number?

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[Lenny HB]

Sorry I’m not being difficult just wondering how you calculated the 142 payload after passengers?

The 142 comes from your dealer info with 5 people. You passenger load the 3 of you will be around 200 kg so you can add 175 to the 142.
That will give 317 before any extras fitted or the 5% allowance which would probably give you a negative payload at 3500kg and a very small unusable payload at 3850 kg.

 

[Spriddler]

I can’t see anything with 5 travel seats and a payload of 700kg+

That's probably because of your limit of 3500kg max weight.
There's no great demand for motorhomes with end lounge, 5 travel seats and an inadequate payload.

Maybe the Rollerteam is aimed at the rental market (esp as you said solar, bike rack and awning is fitted as standard) when hirers won't have all the paraphernalia that an owner collects.

 

[Googlebot]

Our Hymer Exsis has a 700KG payload. With the kids and dog on board, 4 people, we have a choice of bikes or water, we can’t take both and even then it is tight. We are right on the limit every time we go out.

I would tend to agree with everyone else, the van will be very difficult to use as you wish at 3500kg.

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[Lenny HB]

I can’t see anything with 5 travel seats and a payload of 700kg+

Hymer T class S685 has over a 1200kg on the 4200kg chassis.
5 berth on a 3500kg chassis is just not practical.

 

[Lenny HB]

Our Hymer Exsis has a 700KG payload. With the kids and dog on board, 4 people, we have a choice of bikes or water, we can’t take both and even then it is tight. We are right on the limit every time we go out.

I would tend to agree with everyone else, the van will be very difficult to use as you wish at 3500kg.

Our last van was an Exsis I678 had 600kg payload we ended up uprating it to 3850kg just for the two of us and we are fairly small people the two of only weigh 125kg together.

 

[AXO66]

Suggest you get it weighed as it going to be sold to you. Without any water or gas bottles and very little fuel.

Then you can start adding on the all, and every known weight that will fill the cupboards and sit on the seats.

Reckon by doing that you can then know what compromises you will have to make, until you can get it all up - weighted.

Good luck.

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[Googlebot]

Our last van was an Exsis I678 had 600kg payload we ended up uprating it to 3850kg just for the two of us and are fairly small people the two of only weigh 125kg together.

We are stuck to 3500kg as Lucy won’t take the C1 test. In fairness, it is a massive faff! I was lucky enough that work paid and sorted it.

I am happy we are safe as it isn’t overloaded in an engineering fashion, I am however anal about being legal as well so will never knowingly travel overweight.

We looked at Bailey vans, one I worked out that after we were all in the van, we had 90kg left. No water, extras, gas, clothes etc.

 

[suavecarve]

I followed the previous thread, I think for his usage, in the short term, it is possible, not ideal at all, but if wanting to remain legal, being extremely tight on stuff, staying relatively local (not touring europe), perhaps even taking the car with them, until the C1 can be gained, which he is giving thought to in due course, then it is possible.

I dont believe for a second the awning and solar are included in that weight that was stated.

petesax whereabouts are you buying it from/living as someone might have a set of weighing scales you can borrow (me)

I had similar "no Payload" on our 690, but if i didnt take the motorbike, me and the wife could just about get away with it, but we do travel very lightly, but no chance of taking any real luxuries such as excess clothing.

 

[Falcon 269]

To my understanding, what counts is the real weight of the vehicle from the weighbridge. If that's the actual vehicle you're hoping to buy, including whatever extras it's coming with - solar panel, bike rack etc - then you know that it weighs 2998kgs without driver or liquids.

Ignoring the 90% liquids calculation, a Ducato carries @ 85 ltrs of diesel (72kgs), the Roller Team brochure says 2 x gas bottles (30kgs) and the water tank is 100 ltrs (100kgs). Assume you leave home with full fuel tank, 2 full gas bottles & a half tank of water, that's around 152kgs of liquids, despite what the data sheet told you.

So far then, a nice round 3150 kgs of vehicle and liquids.

Add two adults (150kgs) and a child (@30kgs) you're now up to 3330kgs before you've added a single item of clothing, personal/leisure equipment and food.

Your usable payload appears to be around 170kgs. And this, as everyone else has said so far, just ain't enough for your needs. We could all debate what we actually think we need to take but I would want at least double that for a trip of any duration longer than a week.

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[Mr porky]

Don’t forget a bottle of wine/ spirits weighs 1.4kg, doesn’t take long for that to eat into your payload.

 

[Falcon 269]

Buy 5 liter boxes and save bottle weight! Also, easier to pack.

Be payload canny!

 

[suavecarve]

Buy 5 liter boxes and save bottle weight! Also, easier to pack.

Be payload canny!

Amateur, load up the water tank, shower in Rose

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[Falcon 269]

I am humbled in your presence, master.

 

[suavecarve]

I am humbled in your presence, master.

Someone will outdo me and say it should be vodka !!!!

 

[TerryL]

That data sheet, to me, is simply the authorisation for the van to be below the empty weight used to calculate if it's below 3050kg and thus different speed limits (in the UK) apply. As a tool for calculating usable weights it's pretty useless.

The van will have a weight plate showing MAUW, front and rear axle weights, which is all you need from the official point of view. After that you need a weight ticket for total weight and also axle weights.

Once you've got those you can then calculate how much you can actually load, passengers, wine, fuel, water, extras etc. etc. and still remain "legal". Trying to work it out any other way is a pointless exercise - when you are stopped on the motorway and taken to a weighbridge the only thing they will be interested in is the weight plate and how much the van actually weighs. Apart from the fine about being overweight, not having a licence to drive vehicles over 3500kg can (I don't say will, depends if it's a jobsworth) also leave you open to other driving offences.

But like most everyone else, I don't think, even if you try and remain light, you will be able to use that van. Legal it may be, but it is morally wrong for manufacturers to sell vehicles in this way.

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[Lenny HB]

Buy 5 liter boxes and save bottle weight! Also, easier to pack.

Be payload canny!

Encourages me to drink too much , better to buy a van with a decent payload.

 

[Gellyneck]

A very rough and ready calculation including only the absolute bare essentials (you will, almost certainly, have to add in other items). Yes, you could run with zero water and increase payload but, as the majority have said, far to close to the 3,500kg threshold.

empty 2,920.0
gas 15.0
water 90.0
fuel 81.0
ehu cable 10.0
passengers 150.0
child 35.0
sub-total 3,301.0

alarm \ tracker 2.0
basic toolkit 3.0
bedding 8.0
bikes 42.0
bike locks 3.0
crockery 2.2
cutlery 1.5
dry food 7.0
fridge essentials 10.0
water hose 2.2
kettle 0.5
pots and pans 2.0
toaster 0.8
toilet chemicals 2.0
chairs 10.0
clothing 60.0
sub-total 156.2
total 3,457.2

tolerance 146.0
potential weight 3,603.2

 

[Jim]

Averages. Easy to remember 400 +100 pp.

To get the best out of your motorhome you'll need the minimum payload of 400kg for a van and couple. Then add 100kg per person, whether that person is adult or child. Any less than that and you'll struggle to stay legal, or be like a lot of people with 3.5t vans, illegal most of the time.

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[Speve]

Of course there is always the option to tow a trailer? But remember the weight of the towbar is added to your van GVW.

 

[Jonno1103]

But am I not right in thinking that the weight of 2 travelers that won’t be in the van will add an additional 150kg to that number?

Yes.
Pete, The Roller Team weight includes solar panel and the bike rack, they are factory fitted and the vehicles are weighed & water tested post installation... seen it first hand.

You need to read the small print in terms of weights as manufacturers differ, some include a 6kg gas bottle, 75 kg for the driver & 20L onboard water some don't and some offer a derivative of the two.

Cost option after sales awnings are not a component of your MIRO. A Fiamma F45S 3.5m awning for example will add 27kg when you take the fixing brackets etc into consideration. Also note that it will probably come with a 60L fuel tank.

Bottom line is, if you don't have C1 and don't really want to go through the faff of the test as you enter this recreational pursuit for the first time, you will have to make compromises if you want a van with 4-6 berths and the accompanying travel seats when you carry more than the three of you and want two zone living. This is the case with any van.

My suggestion as a quick work around would be to have a tow bar fitted and look at an ex demo/ex hire unbraked trailer with an ABS lid which will give you around an extra 500kg. Brother in law has just bought one from Litchfield Trailers for £600 which looks brand new and there are loads of pre loved ones on EBay.

This way you get the van you've clearly set your heart on and have the option of leaving the trailer behind when not running uber full... 3 of you, weekends and such... you only lug the weight when you need to.

Later, if you do decide that the C1 path is your best option, you can easily sell the trailer here, it'll probably be sold in a day and you have motorhome with a tow bar which may add value if or when you decide to sell or change.

We kept our trailer and now find it very useful, recycling runs, Ikea etc.

 

[marchie]

Would still be very tight, you really need to be looking at vans with at least a 1000kg payload.
From my our experance 700 kg is just enough for 2 people.

My apologies for cross posting/butting in [my terminology may well be wrong, so apologies for that too ..]. We have NO experience of motorhomes, but are searching for one. Your '700kg just enough for 2 people' has scared the bejazers out of me! I've listed everything we'll be taking, and added 1kg for every litre of fuel + water, and added the extra weight that we carry round our waist to the 75kg for the driver,and have finished at 432kg payload need. I have been generous in allowing for bike weights, clothing etc so actual payload need is likely to be 15-20kg lighter. Have I made a huge error? We've found a couple of m/homes with 600kg to 700kg payload and thought we should be OK. Neither of us drink, so the freshwater tank + jar of coffee + kettle will be all that's needed, and we won't have the weight of a TV,or dogs or similar to worry about.

We haven't committed to anything yet, so can change our search criteria once the panic subsides.

Apologies again for butting in

Steve

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[Gellyneck]

My apologies for cross posting/butting in [my terminology may well be wrong, so apologies for that too ..]. We have NO experience of motorhomes, but are searching for one. Your '700kg just enough for 2 people' has scared the bejazers out of me! I've listed everything we'll be taking, and added 1kg for every litre of fuel + water, and added the extra weight that we carry round our waist to the 75kg for the driver,and have finished at 432kg payload need. I have been generous in allowing for bike weights, clothing etc so actual payload need is likely to be 15-20kg lighter. Have I made a huge error? We've found a couple of m/homes with 600kg to 700kg payload and thought we should be OK. Neither of us drink, so the freshwater tank + jar of coffee + kettle will be all that's needed, and we won't have the weight of a TV,or dogs or similar to worry about.

We haven't committed to anything yet, so can change our search criteria once the panic subsides.

Apologies again for butting in

Steve

Are the 600 - 700 kgs the "brochure" payload or the actual payload? Remember there could be anywhere up to a 5% discrepancy on the "brochure" weights.
Also remember the "brochure" weights may not include add on items such as solar panel, leisure batteries, awning, bike rack, etc.......