Going abroad out of season. (1 Viewer)

GWAYGWAY

Free Member
Sep 6, 2014
4,213
3,305
Dover
Funster No
33,216
MH
Hymer ML I 580
Exp
4 years
Now the cat has gone, we can look to going abroad again so I need to know a few little tip and tricks that a load of you lot already know.
Do the aires in France remain open in the off season and do they still have the water etc open? If not where do you get it in villages off the beaten track without begging householders for their tap etc.
Can you really get to Spanish border or the South of France without going onto the Autoroutes?
Is fuel very dear no over there and is it easy to get off Autoroute or are supermarkets all over with fuel to get a MH into?.
Does it get DODGY in December or like here not until Jan/ Feb time.
What do you do for cassette dumping if the aires are closed?
What about proper rubbish dumping are there places to get rid of it or do we need to bring it back?, not fancying getting into trouble by putting it in the wrong place.
Are all the bigger supermarkets in the difficult to get parts of the larger towns, for food and fuel.AND what about the gas situation, is it easier than the UK?
Have we left it too late to go now?
Does Germany require REAL snow tyres or do my all season ones do for them. and from when to when are they required?
Will I be lonely over there or do the Brits travel to Spain and stop there.
Will my Newish MB van make it to the south of France or Spain while still under Guarantee????? Recovery policy is held with Nationwide but might be problematic. I do have a spare Wheel.
HELP! before we chicken out again. The first attempt went BADLY WRONG as you may remember. but better now. We want to go and avoid Christmas in UK hopefully keep warm. I still have two ticket on the tunnel to use the last one being a daytrip to Arras.
 

magicsurfbus

Free Member
Oct 11, 2010
4,673
10,127
NW England
Funster No
14,057
MH
Bessacarr Coachbuilt
Exp
Since 1997
Some aires shut down their taps over winter to avoid burst pipes, but there's not as much point plugging the drains. I find it useful to carry a 10 litre plastic watering can for topping up the water as and when rather than letting the tank get empty. Service areas often have some sort of water tap available near the truck parking, but you mentioned not wanting to use autoroutes. I've seen winterised aires in the Alps (ie Montgenevre) but they're the exception.

The A75 goes down the middle of France to the south and is toll-free, but it's quite high up in places, often well over 1,000 metres, so weather would be a factor in winter. Some of the main roads in Spain are quite high up too - worth thinking about.

Supermarket fuel is generally about 20 cents a litre cheaper than autoroute services but with the current lousy exchange rate you're paying pretty much the same as it costs here. Still, at least we got our country back eh?

Waste drains are more likely to be open than fresh water taps. If desperate you could always dump it down a public loo - maybe best to use green non-toxic bog fluid.

Recycling and waste points can be found in most towns and villages, often near supermarkets and community centres.

LPG Gas in France is called GPL and you need a bowl/cup shaped adapter for refilling. I've not yet had any bother on autoroute services with gas refills. As a precaution I carry a Camping Gaz adapter that would fit my refillable's hose if I couldn't get a top up anywhere. Camping Gaz cylinders are available everywhere.

Some more mountainous provinces and departements in Europe expect you to have winter tyres fitted by law during certain months - details presumably online.

You're never lonely if you know a bit of the local language. :)
 
Oct 30, 2010
4,256
20,707
Suffolk or France or ........
Funster No
14,290
MH
A Class Carthago Chic
Exp
Since 2008
Don't panic Capt Gwaygway, don't panic. :D:D

France doesn't close down in winter and people don't stop travelling.
Almost all aires will be open although some will shut off the water to stop freezing. Even with the water off there will usually be dump facilities and you can usually empty the cassette but perhaps not rinse it out, which is really not a problem. Rubbish and re-cycling bins are everywhere. Just fill with water where you can and be frugal and make it last.
Most supermarkets are located by busy roads for easy access, just as they are in the UK. They are often on by-passes around larger towns and most have two sections to the forecourt. One section, usually to the left, where you pay at the kiosk after filling. They are often very tight for a large motorhome to negotiate. The right hand section is usually 24/24, unmanned and pay at pump by credit card. Always the section to go for as the exit is usually straight forward with plenty of room. Like the UK some sell gas (GPL) some don't. Parking to stock up with food is rarely a problem although there are very occasionally height barriers. Just keep your eyes peeled as you enter.
There will be lots of Brits about, probably including us.

Just go and relax. Driving through France is a real joy. Quiet and excellent roads including lots of free motorways. You really don't need to pay tolls as the D roads are first class and lots of the routes south are toll free motorways. The A75 is a great example, free from Clermont-Ferrand to Beziers apart from the Millau Viaduct which you can by-pass.

Have fun.

Richard.

Subscribers  do not see these advertisements

 

Alistair33

Free Member
Aug 23, 2016
1,079
3,258
North Yorkshire
Funster No
44,753
MH
Hymer
Exp
None
Dam the original post and the response were to long for me to read, I’m abroad out of season and enjoying it!

Would be better if in France with their Aires and cycle paths........ but sadly the weather means we need to be in Spain, beer is cheep, Aries are few and far between, and don’t let anyone tell you this a baron country, 40% of the worlds olives, god knows how many of the worlds oranges, along with all of Europe’s salads etc and this must be Europe’s most fruitful country
 
Feb 26, 2013
407
712
derbyshire
Funster No
24,865
MH
Autocruise stargazer
Exp
since 2013
It's not too late to go now but be prepared as it won't get much warmer until you're quite far south. We were swimming and enjoying the sun in Provence last week but it was getting a bit cooler and having some rain.

You can get to south of France and Spain without tolls but its a long haul. We found it worthwhile using them to bypass cities and then getting back to the D roads.

I agree with all the points above. Go and enjoy it!
 
OP
OP
GWAYGWAY

GWAYGWAY

Free Member
Sep 6, 2014
4,213
3,305
Dover
Funster No
33,216
MH
Hymer ML I 580
Exp
4 years
How do you tell from a route planning that the Autoroute is pay, or free, do the maps show it and do the GPS know the pay ones like the M6 Toll over her tries to get you on regardless.
We would like to just meander along looking for the real country and do not mind old roads. Last time I drove in France the way to Paris was the N1 as the Motorways stopped at ARRAS??? not going near Calais and the N1 went all the way. It was a long time ago.

Subscribers  do not see these advertisements

 
D

Deleted member 29692

Deleted User
Haven't read all the posts so apologies if I'm repeating stuff.

We've probably spent more time in France and Belgium in the winter than we have in summer and we always use aires.

To date we've never found one closed and the only time we've not been able to get water was because the borne had been vandalised and from memory that was in the summer anyway.
 
Feb 26, 2013
407
712
derbyshire
Funster No
24,865
MH
Autocruise stargazer
Exp
since 2013
We have a Michelin mapbook for France that shows the toll routes but the best one I use is the "All the Aires" map which is really clear. Not sure about GPS but I think some can be set for non toll routes?
 
Aug 18, 2014
23,539
131,310
Lorca,Murcia,Spain
Funster No
32,898
MH
Transit PVC
Exp
16 years since restarting
Do the aires in France remain open in the off season and do they still have the water etc open? If not where do you get it in villages off the beaten track without begging householders for their tap etc.

:)Yes many do. Most laybysAire de repos have toilet & water facilities.

Can you really get to Spanish border or the South of France without going onto the Autoroutes?

:)Yes, easily & without tolls .I do it all the time.

Is fuel very dear no over there and is it easy to get off Autoroute or are supermarkets all over with fuel to get a MH into?.

:) Dearer in France than here in Spain & far cheaper anywhere other than toll roads & the motorways.( A roads)
Spain doesn't normally have much difference in prices.

Does it get DODGY in December or like here not until Jan/ Feb time.

:)As others have posted the centre route via Orlean/Clermont Ferrand can have problems but as it is a major route usually addressed in no time.

What do you do for cassette dumping if the aires are closed?

:)As above, unlike the UK most lay bys /Aire de repos have toilets as do major service areas with parking have dedicated cassette emptying points.

What about proper rubbish dumping are there places to get rid of it or do we need to bring it back?, not fancying getting into trouble by putting it in the wrong place.

:)unlike the UK most lay bys /Aire de repos are inundated with bins & many have the large industrial wheelie bins.

Are all the bigger supermarkets in the difficult to get parts of the larger towns, for food and fuel.AND what about the gas situation, is it easier than the UK?

:)No & Yes gas is no problem.
even easier in spain.

Have we left it too late to go now?
:)No.

Does Germany require REAL snow tyres or do my all season ones do for them. and from when to when are they required?

:unsure:Not dead sure but think they must have the snowflake/little mountain mark on them ? Others might know exactly.

Will I be lonely over there or do the Brits travel to Spain and stop there.

:)Might be sparse in France but in the beach areas here you will be inundated with them.You'll wish you were lonely.:D2

Will my Newish MB van make it to the south of France or Spain while still under Guarantee????? Recovery policy is held with Nationwide but might be problematic. I do have a spare Wheel.

:)My 30 year old one does so I'd hope yours might last the journey :LOL:


Do not over worry the travelling. at the end of the day you can easily contact using the forum & get assistance.(y)

How do you tell from a route planning that the Autoroute is pay, or free, do the maps show it and do the GPS know the pay ones like the M6 Toll over her tries to get you on regardless.
We would like to just meander along looking for the real country and do not mind old roads. Last time I drove in France the way to Paris was the N1 as the Motorways stopped at ARRAS??? not going near Calais and the N1 went all the way. It was a long time ago.

Go on Michelin ,it usually shows toll roads, non toll etc.

Subscribers  do not see these advertisements

 

Allanm

Free Member
Jun 30, 2013
5,431
9,191
Cotes d'armor, France
Funster No
26,730
MH
Burstner Harmony TI 736 G
Exp
Since 1987
We rarely use toll roads, you can get anywhere in France without them and the scenery is nicer. As has been said, most aires in winter will have water turned off, but we have been on some and asked at the local Marie if they can either turn the water on for us ( as long as it isn’t frozen) or let us get water
We carry a 20 litre container and a 15 litre watering can for when we can’t get the hose on a tap
If you get stuck for water, there is generally a tap at a cemetery where, if you are not too obvious, you may get to use. If you are really stuck for water, it’s dirt cheap at supermarkets in 2 to 5 litre containers.
If you need washing doing there are plenty of outdoor laundrettes dotted around, usually at the big supermarkets.
Get some snow chains. Even if you have winter tyres, some places will require you to fit them. Don’t buy cheap ones, I have a set of Thule chains on their 3rd winter and still going strong.
Fuel in France is still cheaper than the UK, I paid around £1.06 a litre a couple of weeks ago
Your newish van should be OK, but if it’s raining and you have a Hymer or Cathargo, take extra Sikaflex sealant with you......:whistle:
 
Oct 8, 2014
1,541
4,558
Todmorden
Funster No
33,748
MH
Compactline 143
Exp
I'm a newbie and always will be. You never know it all.
Tom Tom can be set for None Toll and will serve you well. Just turn right when you get off the Train/Ferry and enjoy. I don't do planning I don't.;)(y)
 
Oct 5, 2012
4,283
9,569
Ayrshire
Funster No
23,166
MH
Carado T132
Exp
5 years, feel free to ask me about the Carado!!
I found Garmin the most reliable for identification of tolls and it also identifies 'safety camera' areas in France. D roads are fine if you like ending up in a small town after small town, I have done most of France on those, but be prepared for confusing junctions and disappearing signs. From memory the magic date (at least in Germany Austria and Italy) is somewhere around november 11th for snow tyres, I saw this date advertised on a lot of main roads in high areas. The AA or RAC websites have the exact dates on them for each country and what is required in winter.
Be prepared for France to virtually shut down in the rural areas from Saturday afternoon until Monday morning, the only things you can often buy are bread and flowers.

In some areas of France (rural south particularly) it can be very difficult to buy fuel with cash, take as many bank cards with you as you can muster for built in redundancy.

Subscribers  do not see these advertisements

 
Last edited:

sallylillian

LIFE MEMBER
Oct 29, 2011
3,944
5,013
Falmouth, Cornwall
Funster No
18,670
MH
Palace Liner 90LO
Exp
2011
As stated the snowflake on the tyre is the key. As to having to fit chains, I have driven up the mountains to ski for 30 years and been checked at police stop points in bad weather, with winter tyres they let you through.
 
Sep 19, 2016
1,175
2,346
Llyn Peninsula
Funster No
45,203
MH
Dethleffs Globebus t7
Exp
Four years
You will be amazed how much easier it is than in the uk. I would only book for the Christmas and new year period , if you want somewhere with something going on, rest of the time don't plan. The only thing we do decide is our 1st nights stop after getting off the ferry and set it ready in sat nav. Every evening we decide our next nights stop and route and check weather. ACSI card invaluable, get the app too
 

Armytwowheels

LIFE MEMBER
Aug 10, 2012
6,446
14,775
Market Harborough
Funster No
22,346
MH
Carthago S Plus - Iveco
Exp
Since 2011
How do you tell from a route planning that the Autoroute is pay, or free, do the maps show it and do the GPS know the pay ones like the M6 Toll over her tries to get you on regardless.
We would like to just meander along looking for the real country and do not mind old roads. Last time I drove in France the way to Paris was the N1 as the Motorways stopped at ARRAS??? not going near Calais and the N1 went all the way. It was a long time ago.
We have travelled through France and Spain for the last 3 years in the off season and never used toll roads. We simply set our sat nav (Snooper) to avoid them. Even if using Google maps you can set it to avoid toll roads. We use the Snooper as it can be programmed with the height, weight and width of the motorhome, but sometimes have Google running along side as it it's quicker with the traffic updates.

The only time we have struggled in France for water is when we let our tank go a bit too low and the water machine on the aire would not take our UK debit card. We simple drove up to the nearest supermarket and loaded up with the cheapest bottles water and put that in the tank. We got enough for 2 people to shower and the usual cooking, washing up etc. It only cost us a few cents more than if we had paid at the aire.

The one thing I would hate to be without is the Camper Contact app. If you have a smart phone or tab, download it, pay for the full version and learn how to use it before you go. It is the best and easiest app to use for finding great places to stay.

Others will of course disagree with the above, but these comments are based on our experiences and they work for us.

The one last and best piece of advice I can offer, is if something goes wrong or your are not sure of something, post on here and someone will be back to you with advice within minutes. Also there are loads of us out here, you will never be too far from a Funster.

Subscribers  do not see these advertisements

 

The Nomad

Free Member
Aug 24, 2016
1,052
1,064
Wandering in Europe
Funster No
44,781
MH
Overcab
Exp
Many years
Like others, we tour in Framce loads out of summer season. We avoid the Jan to March period, not because its mot possible then but because we get no pleasure from sitting in the mh whilst the rain lashes down day after day and it's perishing cold..... That's the time to be in coastal Spain or the Algarve.

We never use toll roads, we set our sat nav to avoid them. As a result we travel through what to us is far far more interesting scenery, countryside, villages and towns.
We use the Camperstop Europe guide plus Pop's of Aires and wildcamp spots downloaded onto our smartphones on the Maps.me app. Most indicate the dates that a particular Aire is open.

In the absence of an official aire, It has never been a problem to quietly park up for the night in some quiet corner of a village car park out of summer season....the local bread and other shops appreciate your business.....just check first with the locals that it isn't market day in that square/car park the following morning.
 

Lenny HB

LIFE MEMBER
Oct 18, 2007
52,698
147,629
On the coast in West Sussex
Funster No
658
MH
Hymer B678 DL
Exp
Since 2008 & many years tugging
Not much to add to what everyone has said. We use Newhaven/Dieppe and it's a fairly easy two day drive to the Spanish boarder without using toll roads, but I prefer to spend a few days doing it if the weather is nice. Do make sure you have plenty of gas on board, year before last my mate got stuck overnight on the Motorway just south of Santander due to snow, police moved them to a hotel at 4:30 in the morning.
Satnags are probably the best way of avoiding toll roads.

When using Supermarket fuel stations a lot now have been converted to 24/7 auto pumps they often won't take pre paid cards like Caxton so make sure you have a couple of real cards with you. On the ones with joint autopay and a cashier go to the autopay some of the exits via the cashier are a nightmare. A few weeks ago went into the Auchan at Orleans although it was autopay you still had to exit via the old cash desk barely got out, had about 2" to spare on each side and I have a narrow van, crawled throught at 1mph with the boss screaming in panic.

As said the cemetery is a good place for water also often taps outside of churches. Never had a problem dumping a cassette in France but we always carry a spare anyway also have a shovel for real emergencies not used it yet.

Winter tyres ones with M&S markings are OK for now but I believe from 2018 you will need snowflake marked tyres in countries that require winter tyres. Worth carring a snow shovel you will probably never use it but it's a good insurance policy.

Will you be lonley- hopefully what's the point of going aboard and staying with loads of Brits might as well stay at home. Nice to meet the odd Brit and we have made some friends over the years, generally we are happy on our own.

I believe the NW breakdown service works well like all these services they are put out to local companies in the counrty you are in. Doesn't your Merc come with two year breakdown cover like the Fiats?
 
Feb 9, 2008
8,924
18,663
Corby, Northants
Funster No
1,455
MH
Coach Built
Exp
Since 2007
Now the cat has gone, we can look to going abroad again so I need to know a few little tip and tricks that a load of you lot already know.
Do the aires in France remain open in the off season and do they still have the water etc open? If not where do you get it in villages off the beaten track without begging householders for their tap etc.
Can you really get to Spanish border or the South of France without going onto the Autoroutes?
Is fuel very dear no over there and is it easy to get off Autoroute or are supermarkets all over with fuel to get a MH into?.
Does it get DODGY in December or like here not until Jan/ Feb time.
What do you do for cassette dumping if the aires are closed?
What about proper rubbish dumping are there places to get rid of it or do we need to bring it back?, not fancying getting into trouble by putting it in the wrong place.
Are all the bigger supermarkets in the difficult to get parts of the larger towns, for food and fuel.AND what about the gas situation, is it easier than the UK?
Have we left it too late to go now?
Does Germany require REAL snow tyres or do my all season ones do for them. and from when to when are they required?
Will I be lonely over there or do the Brits travel to Spain and stop there.
Will my Newish MB van make it to the south of France or Spain while still under Guarantee????? Recovery policy is held with Nationwide but might be problematic. I do have a spare Wheel.
HELP! before we chicken out again. The first attempt went BADLY WRONG as you may remember. but better now. We want to go and avoid Christmas in UK hopefully keep warm. I still have two ticket on the tunnel to use the last one being a daytrip to Arras.
Some recommendations for some of your questions!

Firstly, routes and route maps for France and Spain. This first link is for an award winning database about France. It’s big and with a host of information on best routes to many locations. I have selected the famous N10 route from Calais to Irun which is used by many motorhomes when travelling to Spain. It’s almost Toll free (more on that a little later) and almost all duel carriageway from start to finish with the exception of about 100 K. The whole route is great for motorhomes small, medium and large.

https://about-france.com/tourism/no-tolls-routes.htm

Tolls: We avoid the toll road from Calais to Abbeville and save 12.50 Euros. The non-toll route is quite scenic and fairly straight forward, between Boulogne-sur-Mer and Abbeville.

At Abbeville, join the A28 and cross the river Sein at Rouen. We take the second exit immediately after crossing the bridge (about 50 m past the first exit at the end of the bridge), swing down and under the bridge you have just crossed and continue on this road and join the A13 motorway until the N154 which takes you down to Evreux (Note: there are a number of different options for getting through Rouen and no doubt other members will have their own preferences. We find this very straight forward on both outward and return legs).

Approaching Tours on the D910, join the A10 toll road at Jct. 19 and exit at Jct. 23. This will take you through the city via the toll road. (about 2.50 euros). At Jct. 23 take the exit lane for Montbazon which returns you to the D910. (Reverse for the return leg). That’s the last toll to pay until you hit the bottom of the A63.

A63 south of Bordeaux please read the route recommendations in the above link. Do not come off the A63 near the bottom as all roads will be heavily congested and it’s worth paying the last few tolls. (Fuel costs approx. €126.72. (Based on 1056 K @10K per Ltr. @€1.20 per ltr.)).

This route is also recommended during winter, due to its proximity to the Atlantic sea which means little to no problems with ice and or snow, unlike using the A75 to cross the Massif Central. Although the roads are quickly cleared, it is advisable to have winter tyres fitted and there may be some small delays due to snow ploughs clearing the roads.

If heading to the Mediterranean side of Spain, it’s worth taking the N121-A to Pamplona after crossing the Spanish boarder at Irun. It’s clearly sign posted (Large white sign) about 300 m after passing through the last tollbooth and crossing the river.

You will find more details in this link for the N121-A and how to navigate Spain toll free.

https://about-spain.net/travel/no-tolls.htm

As for stop overs along this route, should you choose to use it in the future, you can’t go wrong using the App below which is free but I would recommend getting the paid version for about £6.00 which you can then use off line. You will find numerous places to stop along the above route and I have deliberately not made any recommendations so drivers can make their own choices. This app is also brilliant for finding other places too and highly rated by many users.

https://www.campercontact.com/en/content/app

There is another popular app/website that is used which you may also find useful if you’re doing a lot of wilding and looking for free overnight stops. It too is used by many motor homers in Europe.

https://www.park4night.com/


Finally, probably the best off line maps App and used by many. It also includes a sat-nav function which is quite good and can also be used off line. Again many motor homers use this, especially in Morocco.

Broken Link Removed

Subscribers  do not see these advertisements

 

roamingman

Banned
Mar 14, 2014
204
220
Angus
Funster No
30,525
MH
Coach build
Exp
2012, tents, caravan. 1990
Regarding snow chains, used to drive HGV's in Europe many many years ago had snow chains, but if it was bad and needing them, would rather park up.
 
May 31, 2015
11,526
43,744
Cornwall
Funster No
36,638
MH
Ducato PVC
Exp
Getting Better
All good advice above so all I can say is do it and you will wonder what all the fuss was about, it is so much easier in France/Spain....(y) get a good sat-nav and put in no tolls and get “Campercontact”

All I do is put in where I’m going from Calais and just sit back and enjoy the trip and a few days later I’m in the warm sun...

You will find plenty of places to shop, stop and service along the way..:)
 
  • Like
Reactions: JJ

JJ

Mágica
May 1, 2008
19,230
47,725
Quinta Majay, Pinheiro Bordalo, Portugal
Funster No
2,459
MH
Burstner Privilege T
Exp
over 50 years
Reading the OP made me realise just how much acquired knowledge we old Motorhomers have picked up over the years.

Well done Funsters for sharing it

A lot of us had to learn by trial and error...

Motorhome Fun Rools Ok.

JJ :cool:

Subscribers  do not see these advertisements

 
Feb 9, 2008
8,924
18,663
Corby, Northants
Funster No
1,455
MH
Coach Built
Exp
Since 2007
How do you tell from a route planning that the Autoroute is pay, or free, do the maps show it and do the GPS know the pay ones like the M6 Toll over her tries to get you on regardless.
We would like to just meander along looking for the real country and do not mind old roads. Last time I drove in France the way to Paris was the N1 as the Motorways stopped at ARRAS??? not going near Calais and the N1 went all the way. It was a long time ago.
Use this route finder and select Caravan under route options then Toll roads and your toll costs will be calculated the same as a class 2 motorhome. Other options are also available. A very good route planner.
https://www.viamichelin.co.uk/
 
Oct 30, 2010
4,256
20,707
Suffolk or France or ........
Funster No
14,290
MH
A Class Carthago Chic
Exp
Since 2008
Reading the OP made me realise just how much acquired knowledge we old Motorhomers have picked up over the years.

Well done Funsters for sharing it

A lot of us had to learn by trial and error...

Motorhome Fun Rools Ok.

JJ :cool:
@JJ is quite right of course.
Fun is a quite brilliant resource for information and whatever question someone has there always seems to be plenty of people more than willing to share their knowledge.
I sometimes wish the population in general were as generous with help to their fellow humans as Funsters are.
Wouldn't it be a much better world?

Sorry @GWAYGWAY for going off topic. :)

Richard.
 
Oct 30, 2010
4,256
20,707
Suffolk or France or ........
Funster No
14,290
MH
A Class Carthago Chic
Exp
Since 2008
Best maps for France are probably Michelin.

You need a large country map for route planning, Michelin 721 National France 1:1,000,000 map will do the job.
For more local searching and day to day route planning the laminated Michelin 1:250,000 Atlas Routier is excellent.
It is a ring binder and being laminated you can mark out your intended route with non-permanent marker pen then wipe it clean afterwards. It is very strong and the pages won't tear so will last a few years.
The atlas also clearly shows toll and non-toll motorways.

Richard.

Subscribers  do not see these advertisements

 

Join us or log in to post a reply.

To join in you must be a member of MotorhomeFun

Join MotorhomeFun

Join us, it quick and easy!

Log in

Already a member? Log in here.

Latest journal entries

Funsters who are viewing this thread

Back
Top