FLT's - Why? (1 Viewer)

[scotjimland]

Every motorhome owner in New Zealand must be a FLT then,having been converted to a motorhoming following our holiday there we follow their ethos.....we have a self contained unit so why should we pay for facilities we don't need.

yes.. but just as there is in the UK, there are still laws and rules about where you can and cannot 'free camp' in NZ

Freedom camping or 'free' camping
It is a widespread misconception that you can ‘free camp’ anywhere you want to in New Zealand.

Much of the great paddocks, fields, reserves and farmland you see are privately owned and cannot, therefore, be camped on without permission from the land owner.

In addition, many of the public spots that appear good for camping have been treated poorly by campers in the past, prompting local councils to make such spaces ‘No Camping’ zones.

However, there are some areas where you can pull over, park your motorhome or set up your tent and camp for the night, free of charge.

more https://www.newzealand.com/uk/article/where-you-can-camp-in-new-zealand/

and

https://www.freedomcamping.org/home/what-is-freedom-camping/

and you still need water and black dumping facilities..

the same misconception is still being posted about Scotland..

 

[Southdowners]

yes.. but just as there is in the UK, there are still laws and rules about where you can and cannot 'free camp' in NZ

Freedom camping or 'free' camping
It is a widespread misconception that you can ‘free camp’ anywhere you want to in New Zealand.

Much of the great paddocks, fields, reserves and farmland you see are privately owned and cannot, therefore, be camped on without permission from the land owner.

In addition, many of the public spots that appear good for camping have been treated poorly by campers in the past, prompting local councils to make such spaces ‘No Camping’ zones.

However, there are some areas where you can pull over, park your motorhome or set up your tent and camp for the night, free of charge.

more https://www.newzealand.com/uk/article/where-you-can-camp-in-new-zealand/

and

https://www.freedomcamping.org/home/what-is-freedom-camping/

and you still need water and black dumping facilities..

the same misconception is still being posted about Scotland..

I think everyone who wild camps would know that it doesn't mean you can park 'anywhere'. They also realise they need water and somewhere to discharge waste.

Granted it might not be easily done in the overpopulated UK but elsewhere it is very easy to do without harming anyone or the environment.

 

[Clarky]

I've sat down this morning and read all 9 pages of this thread.
What I have wasted my time reading is a load of hot air about very little.
The term FLT was started a while ago and while its literal meaning might not be that pleasant or friendly when did meanings start being taken in a literal sense on here.
The clue is all in the name - FUN.
Very, very many threads end up with insults, wind ups and FUN being poked at other members - its all done in FUN. (well, mostly )
FLT is no different, just a bit of FUN and I often refer to myself as an FLT, although I would never want to be one of those who park for months in one place and empty my cassette in the beach. We all like a freebie when we can get one so a free aire is always welcome.
@JJ has the right attitude IMHO and like him I will be a proud FLT except when I am tempted by the luxury of a campsite with its 16a hook-up.

Richard.

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[Rob and Val]

I’ve often seen the term FLT used but always assumed that it was being used not in a derogatory manner but more in a jokey manner. There is a lot of banter on this forum and many subscribers know each other well enough to trade ‘insults’ without causing offence, just as you would if you were down the pub with your mates. However, if you are new to the forum I can understand that you may consider it offensive.

We’ve used sites in the UK and abroad (most in the UK are quiet after 11pm) but we’ve also used aires abroad (some free and some not) and we have occasionally wild-camped. So, I’m not sure what category we come under but, to be honest, I don’t really care what others think of me.

 

[iandsm]

I've had a good think about this and to be perfectly honest if taken literally I don't like the phrase Free Loading as it implies selfishness and Tosser because we all know what the original meaning was, eg someone who is an idiot, pillock etc .. twat (I assume that's the 4-letter word referred to many posts earlier as I can't think of anything else other than twit?).

The issue is really how it is 'read' by others ... some will read it as lighthearted teasing, others as a very derogatory term ... and that's the problem ... there is no 'standard' meaning so perhaps, to save confusion, another term could be invented which everyone understands with different letters.

FUN - Freedom Unlimited Nomad!

I like you thinking, I don't like the term FLT, even if some recognise it a lighthearted phrase, others will not. I prefer "Independent campers" or "Independent Motorhomes". Which is more a more accurate description.

While we are at it there is another one I done care for and that is "Oh Please!" I really don't see why people use this in posts, everyone one knows what it means and I hope people don't use those words as a matter of course in everyday conversations. We can all rant and rave and on occasions swear but it isn't really needed on an open forum and I think does nothing to engender respect for the content of the posters opinion or the forum in general. The opposite in fact.

 

[scotjimland]

I think everyone who wild camps would know that it doesn't mean you can park 'anywhere'.

if only that were true..

call it what you like, but illegal camping is the reason that LAs are taking action and banning motorhomes..

and also responsible for having height barriers erected.. to the detriment of the law abiding motorhomer looking for parking for the day..

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[Minxy]

The 'f' word, in any form, is offensive and I too don't understand people wanting to use the Oh Please! phrase ... I know it's a way of inferring their frustration but surely there must be another way to do that?

I do 'swear' on the forum but not with really offensive words (well I don't think they are anyway!) in order to get across how madly/badly something has affected me as sometimes its difficult to get the true meaning across otherwise.

Oh, and I don't like the French Connection UK either ...

 

[MattR]

Isn't the issue that most FLTs take far more than they give? If you park up in a location and leave litter, dump your black waste, block views and contribute very little to the community (eg. having bought all of your food and drink from the supermarket miles away), you would be free-loading. If you turn up at the same location, remove all litter, find a sanitary place to dispose of black waste, don't block the views of others who live or have paid to stay there and spend your money in the local shops, bars and restaurants, you are paying your way.

 

[BreweryDave]

Aaaaaaand breathe.

.........anyone want some toast and a cuppa ?

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[scotjimland]

If you park up in a location and leave litter, dump your black waste, block views and contribute very little to the community (eg. having bought all of your food and drink from the supermarket miles away), you would be free-loading.

this is now the complaint from many locals and small businesses on the NC500 route..

what do we call them ?

https://www.pressandjournal.co.uk/fp/news/highlands/1579376/nc500-main/

 

[Jasz]

I think you generalise to much.

Amongst the FLT (Free Loading Traveller, thanks @Sundowners) some move on everyday, some don't, some sit outside their vans all day, some explore on bikes or walking, some visit sights and tourist attractions and some don't.

You being a SLT, (Site Loving Traveller) there you have a lable now too - can do all of the above as well, or not.

You said in your OP that you didn't want to hear about 'My way is best ' but continue to argue that your way is best.

Call me a site loving traveller if you like but although I do use them at times I prefer CL's in this country and like most of the people on here I use a mixture in France.
In the first 3 weeks of our trip, we spent more on 2 canoe trips and visits to 2 gardens (Giverney and one in the Dordogne) than we did on all the nights stays.
I know most people here are flexible in where they stay, I just wondered if some people completely avoided areas if it was hard to find somewhere free to stop. One reply @JackieP did say that they couldn't afford to pay for overnight stops and good on them for not letting it stop them from continuing with their travels.

 

[dabhand]

How did you get your username dab? Lololol xxx

Jack of all Trades Master of non, might have to revisit that!

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[MR. FUSION]

this is now the complaint from many locals and small businesses on the NC500 route..

what do we call them ?

https://www.pressandjournal.co.uk/fp/news/highlands/1579376/nc500-main/

This route is not a 'victim of its own sucess' it should have been planned and upgraded properly in the first place and proper facilities put in place for campers and the roads upgraded where needed.

• NC 500 managing director Tom Campbell clearly wears a big red nose, spotty trousers and big shoes and rides a comedy bike with wheels that fall off on the NC500.

 

[Northernraider]

Aaaaaaand breathe.

.........anyone want some toast and a cuppa ?

2 sugar and a nice bit of raspberry.jam ta

 

[Top Hat]

When I first read the term FLT and started guessing what it ment, the free loading bit was quite easy and concluded the T was travellers, and can understand that people for one reson or another choose other options than sites feeling aggrieved at the term "Tossers" it's 10 years since my last experience of wild camping and a lot must have changed in that time so can't comment.
What I do understand are those who choose not to use sites, my best analogy is I am In Mallorca at the present and within 5 minutes of us are 6 lovely beaches with all facilities, one of these beaches voted one of the best in Europe all free but, l choose to travel 15 minutes away to this spot (pic) with no facility's, it's the same with sites I will use them but prefer something else if possible.

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[Teuchter]

I can't afford to pay. There's no way I could afford campsite fees and have enough left over to feed myself and my dog and put fuel in my tank. Does this mean I should sell my van and give up travelling @PhilG? I do no harm. I stay on aires and designated free camping spots. Occasionally I stay on unofficial spots. I never stay more than two days, I clean up my own and everyone else's rubbish and I leave the place better than when I left.

There's a horrible atmosphere of 'them and us' developing on this site. It makes me feel quite uncomfortable at times. The judgement that goes on and that seems to be increasing in venom is not an atmosphere I'm happy to be around. This must be the third or fourth thread that I've seen on here recently. All saying the same thing, over and over. All causing division between members. It's not particularly nice to read to be honest.

And I resent being called a 'Free Loading Tosser'. I'm comparatively poor but I do my best. I share food with others and I help where I can. If I had a friend in my life who was prepared to call me that to my face I'd dump them. So yes, I find it extremely insulting and judgemental and not representative of the site that i thought I once knew and felt supported by.

An excellent post Jackie!!

I fully agree with the you particularly about the "them & us" atmosphere

We use a mixture of campsites, aires and occasional wilding but mostly campsites so when I am frequently informed (on this site) that:-

1. Campsites are for caravans not motorhomes therefore I should not use them with my MoHo and have a caravan instead

or

2. If I park overnight in a free Aire or wild spot I am automatically labelled as a FLT!!

We're a MoHo Funsters site FHS! (Oh Please! deleted & replaced by FHS by popular demand) - sure we will all have differing needs, preferences and circumstances but in reality we are (or should be) a "happy band of brothers & sisters" who all share the joys of motorhoming/camping be it wild or on sites!!

To be fair to the term FLT on this site I have found it to be less of a derogatory term than the actual words imply!!

 

[Northernraider]

An excellent post Jackie!!

I fully agree with the you particularly about the "them & us" atmosphere

We use a mixture of campsites, aires and occasional wilding but mostly campsites so when I am frequently informed (on this site) that:-

1. Campsites are for caravans not motorhomes therefore I should not use them with my MoHo and have a caravan instead

or

2. If I park overnight in a free Aire or wild spot I am automatically labelled as a FLT!!

We are a MoHo Funsters site Oh Please! - sure we will all have differing needs, preferences and circumstances but in reality we are (or should be) a "happy band of brothers & sisters" who all share the joys of motorhoming/camping be it wild or on sites!!

Oooohhhh you said Oh Please!

 

[Red Dragon]

Me I guess I call myself a FLT( FUN LOVING TOURER) anything else I just don't understand comprendi !!

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[Minxy]

Agree Teuchter except for Oh Please! ...

 

[Southdowners]

if only that were true..

call it what you like, but illegal camping is the reason that LAs are taking action and banning motorhomes..

and also responsible for having height barriers erected.. to the detriment of the law abiding motorhomer looking for parking for the day..

Since you mention Local Authorities I assume you're talking about the UK. I did say that it isn't easy to free camp in the overpopulated UK and that's why we only travel there as far as the tunnel.

 

[jumartoo]

We're parked here at the moment. Martin's out fishing and I'm resting my feet after my injuries walking a "Camino". It's a tolerated motorhome parking area.

My view from the window of my "sick bed"

Now (to my mind) the real "T's" are the ones parked nearer the town (by 200 metres) in a car park clearly signed NO MOTORHOMES. People like them are the ones who spoil things for everyone as much as the ones who stay put for weeks/months on end in one place.

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[Northernraider]

I thought if you drop the marshmallow you have to neck a pint of Guinness and custard?

That was just for you

 

[Southdowners]

this is now the complaint from many locals and small businesses on the NC500 route..

what do we call them ?

https://www.pressandjournal.co.uk/fp/news/highlands/1579376/nc500-main/

Its a victim of its own success. It has given the tourism industry a shot in the arm though. You can't have it both ways.

I see that one of the quotes in the article stated that some people didn't know how to drive a motorhome. I think it would be down to the large number of rental motorhomes on the road. A Norwegian couple we spoke with recently said the same thing. The roads in Norway are 'challenging' even when you're used to driving a large vehicle - let alone getting in one for the first time and attempting them.

Interestingly, in Norway, you are required to pull over and let traffic by if you are going slower than the speed limit and more than 2 vehicles are behind you. I wonder if something similar could be adopted in Scotland or wherever there are issues of roadblocking?

 

[Northernraider]

We're parked here at the moment. Martin's out fishing and I'm resting my feet after my injuries walking a "Camino". It's a tolerated motorhome parking area.

View attachment 261475
My view from the window of my "sick bed"
View attachment 261477
View attachment 261476

Now (to my mind) the real "T's" are the ones parked nearer the town (by 200 metres) in a car park clearly signed NO MOTORHOMES. People like them are the ones who spoil things for everyone as much as the ones who stay put for weeks/months on end in one place.

That's a nice looking van is that a tramp?

And who's the person in pyjamas looking ooer the dyke?

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[Northernraider]

As Jim says, it's not that offensive.

I've been called worse ..


But I can't tell you cause I'd get sent to Coventry again

 

[Southdowners]

I know most people here are flexible in where they stay, I just wondered if some people completely avoided areas if it was hard to find somewhere free to stop.

I don't have any issues with paying for an aire, stellplatz or rastplass, etc as long as its not choc a block with other vehicles.

Paying has never been the issue in avoiding sites - we simply don't like them or wish to stay on them.

 

[jumartoo]

That's a nice looking van is that a tramp?

And who's the person in pyjamas looking ooer the dyke?

It is a Tramp on a Renault 3 Ltr engine. Goes well!

The person looking at the sea is a "Pilgrim" walking the Camino del Norte. If she spends so long looking at the sea all along the coast it'll take her years.

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[barsteward]

2 sugar and a nice bit of raspberry.jam ta

after 10 pages and over an hr of trying to make sense of it all, I think I'll have a Fray Bentos pie and a lay down.

 

[PhilandMena]

I thought the term FLT was created on here as an affectionate pee take of JJ, not meant as an insult! That's how I remember it anyhow.

What amuses me is that people have to label someone, if you haven't got a label do you exist?

We stop on sites, we stop in the middle of nowhere, we also stop with the hordes on beach fronts, we stop on aires and camperstops, restaurant carparks or anywhere else that seems safe and suitable.

What label should we be given?

Fancy breaking away and forming our own group ???? How about the PFJ ? I'll call Colin Reg and he can call me Loretta !! Others would no doubt call us splitters but true Funsters would flock to our group just for the benefits.

 

[Teuchter]

I’ll throw some questions back at you.

Why would anyone spend a lot of money on a self contained vehicle and the restrict themselves to campsites?

If you want to voluntarily restrict yourself in that manner surely a car and caravan outfit would be a far more sensible choice?


We never use campsites and I’d suggest we see and stay at many far nicer places than you do.

I'll throw some questions back at you

1. If you liked staying on campsites with all their facilities but chose only to stay 2 or 3 days on each one which is more convenient MoHo or caravan?

2. If your self contained vehicle is a PVC with no shower or a true "campervan" - VW etc. why would you not stay on sites sometimes if only to shower?

3. We stay on a mixture of sites, Aire & occasionally wild - never staying anywhere more than 4 days (usually 2 or 3) what form of vehicle would you recommend for that type of travel?

We had caravans for 35 years initially staying on sites for 1 or 2 weeks at a time as work allowed but after we retired we preferred to "tour" around a bit more and felt a MoHo was a better bet!!

As to seeing nicer places than we do - that may or may not be true you do not know where we go and we go not know where you go - suffice to say that in the approximately 120 days we spend a year in our MoHo in Scotland, Wales, England, France, Spain & Portugal we see enough to suit us

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