flat battery

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Baden87

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hi my starter battery was flat today, although I have an ec700 control panel and 100watt solar panel.
how has this happened
Fiat Ducato x290 2019 model apache 634
any ideas guys
 
Baden87 said:
hi my starter battery was flat today, although I have an ec700 control panel and 100watt solar panel.
how has this happened
Fiat Ducato x290 2019 model apache 634
any ideas guys
Click to expand...
Because it’s not connected to your hab controls or solar panel.
You need a b2b. Battery to battery controller that keeps your starter battery topped up.
 
Its a battery master you need, around£15 off e Bay. Easy to connect. Once your hab batteries are charged it allows a trickle charge to the starter battery. Prevents that drain from alarms etc
 
Is it possible that the the smart solar charging was not set as it should be to enable the solar panel to charge both batteries ? (part of the ec700 system I believe)
 
Last edited:
You need a 'Dual solar charge controller'.
Auto-trail usually pre-wire for a dual controller ready to connect in the loom cluster below the Sargent Unit.
White plug 3 wires.

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Exactly the same thing has happened to me today on my Swift Bolero 612 (2018). I have a 100W solar panel and the starter battery is totally dead after 6 weeks off mains.
Can someone please explain to a numptie what I need (b2b? dual solar charger?)
I've searched ebay for these and its not helped.
 
Twincam Escort said:
Can someone please explain to a numptie what I need (b2b? dual solar charger?)
I've searched ebay for these and its not helped
Click to expand...
Battery master.
It's connected by one wire to your hab battery and one to your engine battery and a common earth. IE... Both batteries must use a common metal part for earth. using the chassis is easiest.
the hab battery will be the main battery and once that is ½ volt higher than the engine battery it connects to the engine battery and shares the solar or hookup charge.
 
Your solar panel should be connected via a solar regulator to the electrical control unit which should already have the smart solar charging control feature which can be set to charge either the habitation or starter battery or both as required.
 
Twincam Escort said:
Exactly the same thing has happened to me today on my Swift Bolero 612 (2018). I have a 100W solar panel and the starter battery is totally dead after 6 weeks off mains.
Can someone please explain to a numptie what I need (b2b? dual solar charger?)
I've searched ebay for these and its not helped.
Click to expand...
Usually when you arrive home or at your destination, the starter battery is fully charged after a long drive. You probably have something that keeps your leisure battery charged (solar panels, ehu and mains charger, etc). Often, however, it isn't wired up to keep the starter battery topped up, and it goes flat after a few weeks. What you need is a Battery Master, which senses when the leisure battery is charging, and diverts a small charge to the starter battery. If the leisure battery isn't being charged, the Battery Master disconnects it from the starter battery. Fit and forget.

An alternative, especially if you are renewing or upgrading your solar setup, is a dual output solar controller, which can connect to the leisure and starter batteries. In the setup you can decide what percentage of charge goes to each battery - popular choices are 90/10% or 80/20%.

A battery-to-battery charger (B2B) is in some ways the opposite to a Battery Master. It charges the leisure battery from the alternator/starter battery while the engine is running. It will boost the charge from an alternator so that the leisure batteries charge much faster and in a more controlled, intelligent manner.
 
Geoff C. said:
Your solar panel should be connected via a solar regulator to the electrical control unit which should already have the smart solar charging control feature which can be set to charge either the habitation or starter battery or both as required.
Click to expand...
Actually the Swift information panel can toggle between hab and vehicle battery info.
Are you saying that it might already be able to charge the vehicle battery if set correctly?

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Yes, with my EC450 system I can set it to charge with the solar either battery or both as they need it.
I am sure your later system still has this feature (unless fitted aftermarket and not wired through the control unit) .If your handbook is not clear on this you can download from the Sargent Electrical website the manual for the control unit you have and its solar control capability
 
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Sorry for the hijack OP.
I've established that I have a Sargent EC620 system and that it should automatically allow the solar panel to charge both cab and hab batteries.
My understanding from the instructions is when the voltage drops below 10.9v on the cab battery it disconnects it from the circuit to try and prevent you being unable to start the vehicle.
However it states that it doesnt prevent cab items draining the battery, so I suspect somethings been left on in the cab and overcome the solar panels capacity.
I may have to replace the battery as it dropped to 2.5v!
I'm trying to resurrect now with my car charger out of circuit.
 
I thought the ec700 took care of all the switching from hab to cab without additional devices (B2B)etc
I’m not sure what the settings on the ec700 for instance smart settings for cab and hab batteries
 
On my Hymer b680 the electroblock trickle charges engine battery when on hook up.
You may need a battery master if your van needs it as has been said .
 
The EC700 should control solar charging but it depends which setting has been selected by the user in the control system it can be either battery or smart for both.

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Badknee said:
Because it’s not connected to your hab controls or solar panel.
You need a b2b. Battery to battery controller that keeps your starter battery topped up.
Click to expand...
Most b2bs take care of alternator charging of the leisure battery but not the engine battery. Some of the Votronic ones do have a setting for trickle charging the engine battery when the leisure one is full.
 
Badknee said:
Because it’s not connected to your hab controls or solar panel.
You need a b2b. Battery to battery controller that keeps your starter battery topped up.
Click to expand...
Are you sure about this, or perhaps just guessing.
 
Baden87 said:
hi my starter battery was flat today, although I have an ec700 control panel and 100watt solar panel.
how has this happened
Fiat Ducato x290 2019 model apache 634
any ideas guys
Click to expand...
Bet you regret asking this question, some members have already spent hundreds of your pounds on solutions that are probably not required. I too have an Autotrail although a bit older than yours I suspect but never the less, my Sargent system looks after both sets of batteries (I also have Solar Panels fitted) and in my case its automatically done. You don't say where you are and I suspect your in the UK and at best pulling just over 1 Amp from the panel which is possibly being fed to the leisure battery. Others have said with your model you have to select which battery is charged from the solar and this may resolve your problem if the wrong batteries have been selected. Also, you possibly have a small drain on your cab battery from a security system ? When I start my engine, my alternator will charge both my leisure batteries and cab batteries. (I only found this out after fitting a battery monitor) and this may well be the same for you. Get a multi-meter on your batteries with your engine running and see if this is the same for you. An option you might want to consider if your vehicle is parked up for a long time over winter is to simply fully charge the cab battery then disconnect the negative cable and your battery will not drain. This link may be helpful.

<Broken link removed>


Solar battery select – the battery highlighted in blue is the battery that the solar charging is being directed too. Pressing the smart battery charging button switches the solar smart charging on and off, the button is lit blue while on.
 
Knackered Battery or you left it too long!

Most engine batteries are at least a year older than the date first registered (Logic dictates that every component was manufactured and assembled on the day you collect your new van)

So as long as the engine battery is in good condition, you left the van too long

About four weeks is tops on average we find

Bear in mind that all European motorhomes are built on delivery vans designed to be stop - started daily by Bobbet the Builder or her Husband Fred the Florist, not parked up for weeks

So use it more, or arrange a trickle charge for the engine battery

Simples
 
An interesting post for sure. For the last 6 years our Rapido has been stood on hard standing when not in use, and has been permanently plugged in to EHU as a default stance. The charger button has always been left pressed in (i.e device on) and our van had always started first turn of the key. We have an 80w solar panel sat on top and I always believed I was doing the right thing to ensure we kept the batteries topped up and healthy.

We used a new service guy last October having needed to get a hab check and various other repair works put in place. Imagine my surprise when he said we should NOT have the charger unit engaged/enabled when the van is sat at rest, on hook-up and with a solar panel to boot.

Taking on board what he told us we then started disengaging the charger whilst we weren't using the van. Roll forward a week or so and when I use the CBE panel to check our battery states, the hab batteries are sitting down in the 8.something voltage and our cab battery was as flat as a witches t*t!

Now, I can understand that our batteries themselves were aged, and indeed the cab battery was 13 years old and so was ripe for replacement (it subsequently was). Our leisure batteries performed woefully over the Xmas fortnight away and so, when we returned I swapped them out for a brand new pair of 100Ah beauties and continued with the charger disconnected routine whilst on hook-up.

The van was sat on our drive for a good ten days without hook-up whilst we waited to get it booked into the garage for an EGR replacement (another story). I checked the hab battery levels one morning to find that my brand new leisure batteries which had been sitting at 12.6v when first connected were now sitting at 11.8v (even with the charger button enabled). This despite there being nothing connected or drawing amps on the hab side over that ten days. Why did this happen I asked myself?? I've got no answer to my question. On one hand, I am disappointed as I had been told that if a 12v battery drops below 12.0v then it gets damaged, but on the other hand I am puzzled as to what is causing the voltage drop. The cab battery appears fine and the engine turns over and catches first time.

So, am I right in not having the charger button disengaged when on hook-up or should I leave it permanently powered on and trust the electronics to do what they are supposed to do? The charger itself is a CB-516.

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Baden87 said:
I thought the ec700 took care of all the switching from hab to cab without additional devices (B2B)etc
I’m not sure what the settings on the ec700 for instance smart settings for cab and hab batteries
Click to expand...
After reading the instructions for my EC620 unit I would bet that your EC700 unit will automatically vary the charge between batteries from the solar panel when not plugged into the mains. I would recommend downloading the instructions from Sargents website if youve mislaid yours.
Did you leave your van unconnected from the mains charger for a long time? Because I suspect Ive got a cab battery drain that the 100W solar panel couldnt keep up with and it disconnects the cab battery completely at 10,9V. Leaving the cab battery to continue being drained.
 
Twincam Escort said:
Exactly the same thing has happened to me today on my Swift Bolero 612 (2018). I have a 100W solar panel and the starter battery is totally dead after 6 weeks off mains.
Can someone please explain to a numptie what I need (b2b? dual solar charger?)
I've searched ebay for these and its not helped.
Click to expand...

Yes, as has been said, battery master is probably the answer unless you have a super clever Sargent panel.
Like you're username by the way! :cool:
 
Sunlovers said:
We used a new service guy last October having needed to get a hab check and various other repair works put in place. Imagine my surprise when he said we should NOT have the charger unit engaged/enabled when the van is sat at rest, on hook-up and with a solar panel to boot.
Click to expand...
Utter Cock ! Get rid of him.
 
I guess I was bedazzled by his unquestionable authority on all things Motorhome related .... when I get home tonight I'll be depressing that CB-516 power button and leaving it firmly engaged forthwith :cool:
 
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Philandmena I think it has something to do with settings on the ec700, I haven’t touched them ( honest guv) and not sure I even understand what the correct settings should be

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