fitting a sterling b to b charger (1 Viewer)

[chrisgreen]

i am fitting a sterling battery to battery charger to my van this week,and it being a brit built van when you run the engine it switches the hab power off,so do i need to disconect the split charge relay?,i know this would also not allow the fridge to work on 12v while travaling but never use my fridge on 12v.but i could confiqure the wireing with a relay to still alowe this.
my thinking is it wont need the split charge relay as the sterling b to b replaces it?? and if i leave it in place,when i need to run the engine to charge the batteries i would have no hab power while the engine is running.
any thoughts?

 

[chrisgreen]

anybody??

 

[Jaws]

i am fitting a sterling battery to battery charger to my van this week,and it being a brit built van when you run the engine it switches the hab power off,so do i need to disconect the split charge relay?,i know this would also not allow the fridge to work on 12v while travaling but never use my fridge on 12v.but i could confiqure the wireing with a relay to still alowe this.
my thinking is it wont need the split charge relay as the sterling b to b replaces it?? and if i leave it in place,when i need to run the engine to charge the batteries i would have no hab power while the engine is running.
any thoughts?

I 'spose it rather depends on how the B 2 B is wired really Chris.. never been involved with one so no idea what is the norm.
Any chance of a quick diagram showing how you will wire it ?

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[Robert Clark]

Vanbitz told me that if I had a split charge relay which effectively charged the leisure batteries using the alternator, that a B2B charger would be of little benefit.

 

[pappajohn]

The fridge should be on its own seperate relay so will still work.
Cant see any point removing the split charge relay as the B to B current will far exceed that of the split charge in the same way you dont disconnect solar when on hookup.

 

[pappajohn]

Did

Vanbitz told me that if I had a split charge relay which effectively charged the leisure batteries using the alternator, that a B2B charger would be of little benefit.

Did he also say disconnect your solar charger as that is also effectively charging the battery while driving ?

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[chrisgreen]

I 'spose it rather depends on how the B 2 B is wired really Chris.. never been involved with one so no idea what is the norm.
Any chance of a quick diagram showing how you will wire it ?

here you go john
https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0658/7343/files/12-12_install_eng_germ.pdf?480

 

[Robert Clark]

Did

Did he also say disconnect your solar charger as that is also effectively charging the battery while driving ?

He did not

I think the point he was making was that there was no point buying a B2B charger as my existing split charge relay was charging the leisure batteries sufficiently well.

On my old van I did have a B2B charger fitted as the split charge relay only powered the fridge and didn't charge the leisure battery.

 

[Jaws]

here you go john
https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0658/7343/files/12-12_install_eng_germ.pdf?480

As all the outputs are going direct to the batteries the switching malarky should have no effect at all Chris.
The outputs remain the same no matter if the hab side is isolated or not.

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[chrisgreen]

Vanbitz told me that if I had a split charge relay which effectively charged the leisure batteries using the alternator, that a B2B charger would be of little benefit.

the problem with just useing an alternator to charge the batteries is once the voltage reaches 13.8 volt the alternator will put out very little charge,the sterling on the otherhand will fool the altanator into thinking that the battery is flat and push out a higher current for longer and will charge a battery faster than a stand alone alternator.up to 5 times faster or in my case @40 amps an hour.

 

[chrisgreen]

As all the outputs are going direct to the batteries the switching malarky should have no effect at all Chris.
The outputs remain the same no matter if the hab side is isolated or not.

but as i stated in my OP the split charge relay switches of the hab power when the engine is running,so i think it will need to disconecting it,and just rely on the BtoB to charge the batteries?

 

[pappajohn]

I think the point he was making was that there was no point buying a B2B charger as my existing split charge relay was charging the leisure batteries sufficiently well

Yes it will, albeit at a far reduced current and over a lot longer time.
Chris explains how it applies above.

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[pappajohn]

but as i stated in my OP the split charge relay switches of the hab power when the engine is running,so i think it will need to disconecting it,and just rely on the BtoB to charge the batteries?

The split charge has nothing to do directly with the hab power being turned off.
There is a seperate relay, sensed by the split charge, to control the hab area.
The B2B connects between batteries so hab power on or off has nothing to do with charging via B2B.....the hab battery pos lead could be completely disconnected but will still charge.

 

[chrisgreen]

The split charge has nothing to do directly with the hab power being turned off.
There is a seperate relay, sensed by the split charge, to control the hab area.
The B2B connects between batteries so hab power on or off has nothing to do with charging via B2B.....the hab battery pos lead could be completely disconnected but will still charge.

i think i aint explained the problem proper like.if i am parked up and need to charge my batteries up, i will as it stands be in the dark with no power to the hab side while the engine is running

 

[keith]

i think i aint explained the problem proper like.if i am parked up and need to charge my batteries up, i will as it stands be in the dark with no power to the hab side while the engine is running

I can run on tickover and the hab side still stays on, it doesn't switch off immediately.
It seems to need movement of the van to switch off.

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[chrisgreen]

I can run on tickover and the hab side still stays on, it doesn't switch off immediately.

mine switches off as soon as the ignition is turned on

 

[TheCaller]

You will have three separate relays.
One will supply 12v to the fridge when the engine is running.
One will put your habitation batteries in parallel with your engine battery to provide a charging current (the split charge relay).
One will sense that the engine is running & open a relay to cut off power from your habitation batteries to the 12v equipment in the back.

It's this last one that you need to find & disconnect to achieve what you want. If you tell us the make & model of the van & ideally the make & model or the 12v control system, someone who has already done it on the same equipment may well be able to advise.

Many people would say that it's a job that needs doing irrespective of whether you are fitting a B2B charger or not.

 

[TheBig1]

as mentioned you need to disable or bypass the shut off relay, which is often found by the 12v distribution board and charger. varies from van to van where to find it

b2b charger, I would pull the charging relay but leave the fridge relay

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[Alistair33]

the problem with just useing an alternator to charge the batteries is once the voltage reaches 13.8 volt the alternator will put out very little charge,the sterling on the otherhand will fool the altanator into thinking that the battery is flat and push out a higher current for longer and will charge a battery faster than a stand alone alternator.up to 5 times faster or in my case @40 amps an hour.

Is that not putting a strain on the alternator?

 

[chrisgreen]

Is that not putting a strain on the alternator?

no my alternator is rated at 85 amp so well within limits

 

[nicholsong]

the problem with just useing an alternator to charge the batteries is once the voltage reaches 13.8 volt the alternator will put out very little charge,the sterling on the otherhand will fool the altanator into thinking that the battery is flat and push out a higher current for longer and will charge a battery faster than a stand alone alternator.up to 5 times faster or in my case @40 amps an hour.

I support Chris's opinion.

We fitted a Sterling B2b 3 years ago. We are never on EHU(except at home). We wildcamp and never stay more than about 3 days, so the B2B does all we want and even a 30 min. drive pumps a lot of amps into the batteries.

Consequently I am surprised anyone at Vanbitz told Robert Clark that there was no point in fitting one. Maybe a 'junior', but I would be surprised if it were Eddie himself.

Geoff

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[Robert Clark]

I support Chris's opinion.

We fitted a Sterling B2b 3 years ago. We are never on EHU(except at home). We wildcamp and never stay more than about 3 days, so the B2B does all we want and even a 30 min. drive pumps a lot of amps into the batteries.

Consequently I am surprised anyone at Vanbitz told Robert Clark that there was no point in fitting one. Maybe a 'junior', but I would be surprised if it were Eddie himself.

Geoff

I guess it's all about cost v benefit

 

[nicholsong]

I guess it's all about cost v benefit

Of course, but I and a friend fitted it and the beefit for our style of MHing is that we do not have to think about battery and electical usage.

Geoff

 

[Robert Clark]

Of course, but I and a friend fitted it and the beefit for our style of MHing is that we do not have to think about battery and electical usage.

Geoff

So it's possible that the advice given to me by Vanbitz was reasonable?

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[JockandRita]

I support Chris's opinion.

We fitted a Sterling B2b 3 years ago. We are never on EHU(except at home). We wildcamp and never stay more than about 3 days, so the B2B does all we want and even a 30 min. drive pumps a lot of amps into the batteries.

Consequently I am surprised anyone at Vanbitz told Robert Clark that there was no point in fitting one. Maybe a 'junior', but I would be surprised if it were Eddie himself.

Geoff

That's exactly the same way we use our MH Geoff, and why I fitted a B2B. It works a treat and serves our needs admirably.

I know of two MH owners, who were wrongly advised not to re-fit their B2B when they replaced their MHs. One had a CAN Bus system, and was told it could not be fitted, and if it was, it would invalidate their warranty, and the other was told that his B2B wouldn't be compatible with the EBL.

I'm no expert, but my homework and research with Sterling, (and Schaudt via Udo Lang) as well as the fitting instructions, did indicate that if fitted directly between the starter and habitation batteries, it didn't have any adverse effect on systems already fitted.

@chrisgreen. If out of warranty Chris, I too would be disconnecting the shut off relay, which appears to be a UK build installation. EU built MHs don't have that installation, and if that's good enough for TUV Approval, it's good enough for me.

The B2B is a great addition, if wishing to be off grid as much as possible.

Good luck.

Jock.

 

[pappajohn]

The shut off relay is a UK National Caravan Council requirement for the converter to get NCC approval for the conversion.
Only reason it isn't found on foreign vans....they don't have the NCC to contend with.
Nothing in law says its a legal requirement.
I disconnected it on my last Kontiki.

 

[pappajohn]

i think i aint explained the problem proper like.if i am parked up and need to charge my batteries up, i will as it stands be in the dark with no power to the hab side while the engine is running

Agreed Chris, but that's the hab cut off relay....not the split charge relay.

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[JockandRita]

The shut off relay is a UK National Caravan Council requirement for the converter to get NCC approval for the conversion.

John, I had a British insurer refuse to insure our Hymer, until we hade been to a NCC Approved workshop, and have the habitation shut off relay installed. Needless to say, they didn't get our business, but kept chasing me for years after.

As I posted above, if it's good enough for TUV, it's good enough for me.

Cheers,

Jock.

 

[Steve and Denise]

We have a 45 amp b2b fitted I fitted a relay to disconnect the factory charger when the engine starts, from memory I used the signal for the fridge, as this can send the false info to the b2b as it is an intelligent 4 stage charger and moniters the battery voltage.
Our hab power stays on whilst engine is running, and when my wife uses her 1600w hair drier we just run the engine and get an extra 45 amps via b2b

 

[Revolvor]

We have a 45 amp b2b fitted I fitted a relay to disconnect the factory charger when the engine starts, from memory I used the signal for the fridge, as this can send the false info to the b2b as it is an intelligent 4 stage charger and monitors the battery voltage.

That's exactly what I did, after speaking to Sargent, when I fitted a CTEK D250S Dual - combined B2B and Solar Controller. I also energised the relay from the fridge signal. You can see the "Normally Closed" relay in the diagram attached. If you ignore the Solar Panel, the diagram is similar to the Sterling arrangement.

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