Fiat 9 speed with 180HP engine gearbox problems.

MichaelT said:
It's 160 and 180. I suspect more 160 out there than 180 but as far as I know Carthago only use the 180 now Lenny HB will know more.
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Missed that post.
Yes, Carthago only supply the 180 with the 9 speed auto or now 8 speed for the UK market.
For the German market you can still have the 140 on some models.
Pausim said:
The ZF HP9 continues in production by ZF Friedrichshafen and Fiat dropping the unit should not cause a supply problem.
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The Fiat ones are made in Fiats Chrysler plant in South Carolina, it's a beefed up version of the box used in the Jeep & Range Rover Evoque which are also made there.
 
gordoledfoot said:
Our ZF- 9 speed auto transmission in our new Nov24 Frankia I-740 plus with 11,000 kms under warranty seized in southern Spain without warning lights although I noticed a general slowing of the vehicle on the motorway over a week or so prior. Fiat assisted with truck towing to their approved dealer repairer, accommodation and flights to our next pre-paid and booked thing in Morocco. Its been 2.5 months and nobody is talking to us. We found out that Fiat Assist is actually Alliance Insurance which explains why theyre not proactive in finding a gearbox.
Also and possibly more critical is the annual service requirement to change the clutch fluid. YES the auto ZF-9HD gearbox needs non-degraded clutch fluid BUT its a buger to get to and many mechanics overlook checking levels and viscosity. This is a serious matter as degradation can lead to / cause gearbox breakdown. We fear the inadvertant conspiracy may be deeper in that Fiat Ducato vans are delivered sometimes years prior to Motorhome manufacturers before they convert them
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Very sorry to hear this. Did your Frankia have the recall done to adjust the torque curve (Service Action 6926)?

You must keep us abreast on progress on getting the motorhome fixed and back on the road.
 
I suppose we want to know how many people have had problems AFTER the software upgrade.
Our 9 speed made a couple of jerky changes from first into second gear when it was brand new last year, but otherwise fine.

It had the software update in January, about 2000 miles ago, with no noticeable difference in performance etc. (it still rarely changes in to 9th gear).
 
GrahamnSue said:
I suppose we want to know how many people have had problems AFTER the software upgrade.
Our 9 speed made a couple of jerky changes from first into second gear when it was brand new last year, but otherwise fine.

It had the software update in January, about 2000 miles ago, with no noticeable difference in performance etc. (it still rarely changes in to 9th gear).
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As said previously mine goes into 9th easily now above 60mph, no issues since the software was installed done 3000 miles. Fingers crossed.
 
GrahamnSue said:
I suppose we want to know how many people have had problems AFTER the software upgrade.
Our 9 speed made a couple of jerky changes from first into second gear when it was brand new last year, but otherwise fine.

It had the software update in January, about 2000 miles ago, with no noticeable difference in performance etc. (it still rarely changes in to 9th gear).
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We went to Spain in January after our update and just returned from Wales with no issues. Ours goes into 9th easily but soon changes down if you come to an incline.
 
Software update done no noticeable difference.
I was monitoring the gear changes on the way to AM & back.

Mine on the flat or slight downward incline will change into 9th at 60 but most of the time it's 65-67 and drops back to 8th around 60 sometimes as low as 55.

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gordoledfoot said:
Our ZF- 9 speed auto transmission in our new Nov24 Frankia I-740 plus with 11,000 kms under warranty seized in southern Spain without warning lights although I noticed a general slowing of the vehicle on the motorway over a week or so prior. Fiat assisted with truck towing to their approved dealer repairer, accommodation and flights to our next pre-paid and booked thing in Morocco. Its been 2.5 months and nobody is talking to us. We found out that Fiat Assist is actually Alliance Insurance which explains why theyre not proactive in finding a gearbox.
Also and possibly more critical is the annual service requirement to change the clutch fluid. YES the auto ZF-9HD gearbox needs non-degraded clutch fluid BUT its a buger to get to and many mechanics overlook checking levels and viscosity. This is a serious matter as degradation can lead to / cause gearbox breakdown. We fear the inadvertant conspiracy may be deeper in that Fiat Ducato vans are delivered sometimes years prior to Motorhome manufacturers before they convert them
Click to expand...
Brize said:
Very sorry to hear this. Did your Frankia have the recall done to adjust the torque curve (Service Action 6926)?

You must keep us abreast on progress on getting the motorhome fixed and back on the road.
Click to expand...
GrahamnSue said:
I suppose we want to know how many people have had problems AFTER the software upgrade.
Our 9 speed made a couple of jerky changes from first into second gear when it was brand new last year, but otherwise fine.
Click to expand...

Bumped.

gordoledfoot , many of us are keen to know whether you had the Service Action (6926) completed prior to the gearbox seizure. Also, would love to know progress getting vehicle back on road and whether Fiat have pulled their finger out!

Thanks.
 
Brize said:
Bumped.

gordoledfoot , many of us are keen to know whether you had the Service Action (6926) completed prior to the gearbox seizure. Also, would love to know progress getting vehicle back on road and whether Fiat have pulled their finger out!

Thanks.
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No we didnt. We are dumb ass Australians who thought they had undertaken sufficient research into the Frankia I-740 to warrant the purchase. We followed the most commonly recommended purchase route for non-Europeans - to buy using shelf company set up in France. This meant the temporary German trade plates were not recognised by Fiat when we registered the purchase and didnt receive/ couldn’t access the gearbox software 6926 advisory update.

We tried to get the vehicle serviced after 5,000 kms as we were using it a fair bit and its the right thing to do when running in a new engine but were repeatedly told by Fiat qualified and other service mechanics including the German dealer it wasn’t needed within the 1 year/24,000 km service interval. Some contended if done it could void the warranty!!! If we managed to get it done, software patch would probably have been installed and possibly none of our problems would have materialised.
But it happened. In Spain.

Fiat Assist were good. They towed vehicle to their approved workshop in Jerez, put us in a hotel and paid for airfares so we could meet our next scheduled paid commitment in Marakech. ( just like an insurance policy would cover) (hang on, Fiat Assist is actually Allianz).
We called and wrote to our dealer who pushed us back to Fiat as he promised to faithfully assist us find a solution. Pigs might fly.

Then Fiat, after promising to return calls, offering to escalate our case to senior management (never happened) and contradictory inconsistent non-traceable advice, someone took pity on us by accidentally wrongly putting us through to MaseratiAssist instead of FiatAssist who then put us through to Fiat Stellantis. We then registered the vehicle, the vin, and the breakdown formally with them as they handle repairer report approval and the supply approval and county-based supply for replacement gearboxes which is where we should have been all along as FiatAssist is just an insurance company.

And here we are, nothing has happened 3.5 months later. The mechanic is nice but holds his Fiat franchise dealership cards close so he wont tell us how long the queue is where were on it, how many gearboxes are being supplied monthly/weekly if at all, its hit and miss whether he even reads our weekly whatsapp communication. We’ve offered bribes and money- obviously not enough, but we’re told we’ll just have wait (after all, we’re just dumb Australian tourists low on the pecking order without a fleet to manage)

But we now have a lawyer conversant with German Consumer Law who will hopefully rip a new exterior opening in one or more of these culprits to get us the GB, or a replacement MH, or our money back with damages…...dreamin.
 
gordoledfoot said:
No we didnt. We are dumb ass Australians who thought they had undertaken sufficient research into the Frankia I-740 to warrant the purchase. We followed the most commonly recommended purchase route for non-Europeans - to buy using shelf company set up in France. This meant the temporary German trade plates were not recognised by Fiat when we registered the purchase and didnt receive/ couldn’t access the gearbox software 6926 advisory update.

We tried to get the vehicle serviced after 5,000 kms as we were using it a fair bit and its the right thing to do when running in a new engine but were repeatedly told by Fiat qualified and other service mechanics including the German dealer it wasn’t needed within the 1 year/24,000 km service interval. Some contended if done it could void the warranty!!! If we managed to get it done, software patch would probably have been installed and possibly none of our problems would have materialised.
But it happened. In Spain.

Fiat Assist were good. They towed vehicle to their approved workshop in Jerez, put us in a hotel and paid for airfares so we could meet our next scheduled paid commitment in Marakech. ( just like an insurance policy would cover) (hang on, Fiat Assist is actually Allianz).
We called and wrote to our dealer who pushed us back to Fiat as he promised to faithfully assist us find a solution. Pigs might fly.

Then Fiat, after promising to return calls, offering to escalate our case to senior management (never happened) and contradictory inconsistent non-traceable advice, someone took pity on us by accidentally wrongly putting us through to MaseratiAssist instead of FiatAssist who then put us through to Fiat Stellantis. We then registered the vehicle, the vin, and the breakdown formally with them as they handle repairer report approval and the supply approval and county-based supply for replacement gearboxes which is where we should have been all along as FiatAssist is just an insurance company.

And here we are, nothing has happened 3.5 months later. The mechanic is nice but holds his Fiat franchise dealership cards close so he wont tell us how long the queue is where were on it, how many gearboxes are being supplied monthly/weekly if at all, its hit and miss whether he even reads our weekly whatsapp communication. We’ve offered bribes and money- obviously not enough, but we’re told we’ll just have wait (after all, we’re just dumb Australian tourists low on the pecking order without a fleet to manage)

But we now have a lawyer conversant with German Consumer Law who will hopefully rip a new exterior opening in one or more of these culprits to get us the GB, or a replacement MH, or our money back with damages…...dreamin.
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Thanks for the update, you've had quite a journey. The 6926 doesn't 'cure' the problem, just makes it less likely to happen, so don't beat yourself up - particularly as you have a heavy vehicle. I would have done the same as you at the 5000 km point (and will still do as I have the 180/9 speed), and get an oil and filter change. I don't think there is any way that would void a warranty and I think you have been fed a line.

Sorry to hear you have had the run-around, and I hope your German lawyer gets the repair speeded up. One thing that intrigues me is that the repair probably means a new 9-speed box for your van, yet isn't that simply asking for the same to happen in 2-4 years time? Pity they don't do the repair with a new 8-speed box that they are now fitting to 180 engines, but I suppose that would mean a lot more changes within the engine compartment.

Good luck, and please continue to keep us informed. (y)
 
Brize said:
informed. (y)
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INCREDIBLE !!!
Gearbox found and to be installed tomorrow Monday 7th !! WOOHOO.
OK so its been 3.5 months which is about 2 weeks over what a German Court could consider unreasonable and therefore award full refund or deduct damages from the purchase cost for the dealer etc to refund that. Thats probably what triggered the sudden supply …. and possibly the amount of posting here on MHF and elsewhere.
Problem now is its the same gearbox trying to pull the same 4.5 ton weight. What could go wrong?

If it happens again we will not hesitate to commence immediate proceedings against the dealer and fiat. It wont be Fix It Again Tony.

Shout out to Keith on one of the Fiat Adria ZF gearbox problem sites for his support.
 
Has anyone had any issues with the 180bhp engine with the 8 speed auto on the series 10 Ducato ?

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Very pleased for you gordoledfoot . Hope all goes well now. Make sure you get 6926 done by the workshop, if not already supplied with it done.

Fingers crossed you won't have the same problem again. 🤞
 
Brize said:
Very pleased for you gordoledfoot . Hope all goes well now. Make sure you get 6926 done by the workshop, if not already supplied with it done.

Fingers crossed you won't have the same problem again. 🤞
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I have the new 8 speed automatic gearbox and it’s at fiat as I speak,it’s noisy in 5 th and 7 th it started at 165 miles and done 1700 miles I will never buy a fiat again
 
nerka said:
I have the new 8 speed automatic gearbox and it’s at fiat as I speak,it’s noisy in 5 th and 7 th it started at 165 miles and done 1700 miles I will never buy a fiat again
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Update on the fiat auto box 2025 it’s having to be stripped down the dealership have had it 3 weeks now
 
nerka said:
I have the new 8 speed automatic gearbox and it’s at fiat as I speak,it’s noisy in 5 th and 7 th it started at 165 miles and done 1700 miles I will never buy a fiat again
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On dear that is not good . Has anyone else had issues with the 8 speed Auto ?

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Lenny HB said:
Unusual they normally just replace them.
I hope they get their finger and get it sorted for you.
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Yes me too . I feel for you Nerka . How old is it ? I too am surprised they are not just replacing it under warranty ?
 
nerka said:
Update on the fiat auto box 2025 it’s having to be stripped down the dealership have had it 3 weeks now
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Sorry to hear of your problem nerka. When you first posted about the problem I thought it would be a quick adjustment. Also thought that the new 8 speed was supposed to be the 'cure' for 180hp engines, so it will be interesting to find out what the fault turns out to be, and also whether this is a one-off.
 
Brize said:
Sorry to hear of your problem nerka. When you first posted about the problem I thought it would be a quick adjustment. Also thought that the new 8 speed was supposed to be the 'cure' for 180hp engines, so it will be interesting to find out what the fault turns out to be, and also whether this is a one-off.
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I don’t think the 180hp engine needed a new gearbox to cure it, it just needed a small software update. The 8 speed looks more like an economic decision by Stellantis to consolidate production on one box of their own. I do agree that it will be interesting to hear what caused the problem and I hope nerka gets back on the road very soon.
 
Pausim said:
I don’t think the 180hp engine needed a new gearbox to cure it, it just needed a small software update. The 8 speed looks more like an economic decision by Stellantis to consolidate production on one box of their own. I do agree that it will be interesting to hear what caused the problem and I hope nerka gets back on the road very soon.
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Update on 8 speed automatic the dealer has changed the gearshift and electronics and said it’s cured it I think I get it back next week so will update on here , so over 4 weeks without my new motorhome if this has not cured it I am rejecting it as this is the main fault but has another 12 to sort out,most are minor but not one as being sorted to date
 
Update on the new 8 speed automatic fiat gearbox it’s had updates new electronics ,gearstick and they still can’t find out what’s up with it , the next step they say is to strip it and look at the bearings, this is on a brand new 25 plate I will be rejecting it ,I would not want to buy a fiat auto that is over 3.5 ton with this gearbox it’s not fit for purpose
 
Why not insist on a new box, if one is available you would be back on the road by the weekend?

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