DUI curved ball (1 Viewer)

Jul 7, 2016
238
125
Powys, UK
Funster No
43,969
MH
hymer b584
Exp
Im a newgie
If I leave my ignition keys with family and use the habitation key to get to bed in the street. Am I liable if I've had over the legal limit although I don't have the key to the engine.
Steph
 

MC 55 FUN

Free Member
Feb 18, 2016
3,432
6,347
Rural South West Wales.
Funster No
41,707
MH
2015 Majestic 195
Exp
Since 20th Feb' 2016
If I leave my ignition keys with family and use the habitation key to get to bed in the street. Am I liable if I've had over the legal limit although I don't have the key to the engine.
Steph

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Driving_under_the_influence

Britain
In British law it is a criminal offence to be drunk in charge of a motor vehicle. The definition depends on such things as being in or near the vehicle, and having access to a means of starting the vehicle's engine and driving it away (i.e., the keys to a vehicle). A passenger in the vehicle can also be prosecuted if the police can prove that they were driving under the influence at some point.

The UK's drug driving laws were updated in 2015. The changes included: a new roadside testing kit, which could detect the presence of cocaine and cannabis in a suspect's saliva; zero tolerance limits for a number of illegal drugs, Limits were also set for certain prescription medications. The laws also ended the use of the subjective field impairment test.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0
May 8, 2016
1,685
78,504
silver coast, portugal
Funster No
42,972
MH
C Class: Low profile
Exp
Boatie for 20 years
The relevant offence is being drunk in charge of a motor vehicle. This is not America, where it is driving under the influence

Technically, anyone who has access to the handbrake can be in charge of the vehicle. You don't need an ignition key and a running engine

Excellent article here on the subject

Subscribers  do not see these advertisements

 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: GJH
Upvote 0

fraefreuchie

Free Member
Sep 24, 2014
13
6
United Kingdom
Funster No
33,495
MH
Hymer Starline 510
Exp
since 2014
Where are the mythical enforcers appearing from? If you have chosen a quiet place to park, and you have no intentions of driving, who cares??
 
  • Like
Reactions: DBK
Upvote 0

Abacist

LIFE MEMBER
Oct 15, 2013
3,648
10,041
Devon
Funster No
28,581
MH
N & B Tag Axle
Exp
since 2013
We've had threads on this before! I thought the police had to have evidence of an intention to drive so knocking someone up in the middle of the night who is in bed in pyjamas or whatever without an ignition key is not likely to get far trying to prove the drunk in charge case.

Subscribers  do not see these advertisements

 
Upvote 0
May 8, 2016
1,685
78,504
silver coast, portugal
Funster No
42,972
MH
C Class: Low profile
Exp
Boatie for 20 years
There have been a number of prosecutions where a drunk has been charged for being in charge of the vehicle without keys. There have been cases where handbrakes have been released and injuries caused by a vehicle subsequently rolling out of control.

The OP specified "in the street", suggesting a public place. It would be down to the discretion of the officer as to whether to charge. How lucky do you feel?

The article here gives all the detail, and it is authoritative:
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

Welsh girl

LIFE MEMBER
Nov 7, 2009
3,658
3,036
Funster No
9,222
MH
Globecar
Exp
Since 2004
I thought if you didn't have the keys the intention to drive is not there so couldn't be prosecuted.
 
Upvote 0

sdc77

Free Member
Jan 28, 2013
3,244
4,550
Weardale, Co Durham
Funster No
24,456
MH
Coachbuilt
Exp
since 2011
It's all been covered before on numerous threads . . there is the write up by Jim but it's obviously not black and white. The house of Lords has previously ruled there must be an intention to drive and that's always going to be down to the opinion of an officer at the time. In reality if you're sleeping in a motorhome overnight regardless if wether the keys are in the van or not then you're going to be fine. if you're going to be drinking heavily then you're going to have more problems if you drive off in the morning. but that's a different offence

Subscribers  do not see these advertisements

 
Upvote 0
May 8, 2016
1,685
78,504
silver coast, portugal
Funster No
42,972
MH
C Class: Low profile
Exp
Boatie for 20 years
I thought if you didn't have the keys the intention to drive is not there so couldn't be prosecuted.
But the offence is drunk in charge, driving is a different offence, but same outcome

Link Removed

Being in charge of a vehicle with excess alcohol


Being in charge of a vehicle whilst unfit by reason of excess alcohol is defined as driving or attempting to drive a motor vehicle on the public highway or a public place whilst under the influence of alcohol exceeding the prescribed limit. Even if you are not driving the vehicle, but are in the vehicle on the public highway/public place, you can be deemed to be "incharge" of the vehicle.

The maximum penalties are:

• 10 penalty points; and
• discretionary disqualification; and
• a fine of up to £2,500; and/or
• 3 months imprisonment.

It's all been covered before on numerous threads . . there is the write up by Jim but it's obviously not black and white. The house of Lords has previously ruled there must be an intention to drive and that's always going to be down to the opinion of an officer at the time. In reality if you're sleeping in a motorhome overnight regardless if wether the keys are in the van or not then you're going to be fine. if you're going to be drinking heavily then you're going to have more problems if you drive off in the morning. but that's a different offence

Perfectly correct
 
Upvote 0

Jaws

LIFE MEMBER
Sep 26, 2008
23,821
71,972
Thetford Norfolk
Funster No
4,189
MH
C class, Chieftain
Exp
since 2006 ( I think ! )
But the offence is drunk in charge, driving is a different offence, but same outcome

Link Removed

Being in charge of a vehicle with excess alcohol


Being in charge of a vehicle whilst unfit by reason of excess alcohol is defined as driving or attempting to drive a motor vehicle on the public highway or a public place whilst under the influence of alcohol exceeding the prescribed limit. Even if you are not driving the vehicle, but are in the vehicle on the public highway/public place, you can be deemed to be "incharge" of the vehicle.

The maximum penalties are:

• 10 penalty points; and
• discretionary disqualification; and
• a fine of up to £2,500; and/or
• 3 months imprisonment.



Perfectly correct

Completely and wildly off topic, Just noticed something .. @pyro
RAE ..... 1980 or 1981 ?
 
Upvote 0

hilldweller

LIFE MEMBER
Dec 5, 2008
605
36,108
Macclesfield
Funster No
5,089
MH
Zilch Mk1
Exp
From Aug 2007
If I leave my ignition keys with family and use the habitation key to get to bed in the street. Am I liable if I've had over the legal limit although I don't have the key to the engine.
Steph

Do a search on here. 100+ posts will say yes. 100+ posts will say no. 100+ posts will say you are totally anti-social going near a motor vehicle after consuming alcohol. 100+ will say "no chance of being caught".

So choose the answer that pleases you.

Subscribers  do not see these advertisements

 
Upvote 0

Forestboy

LIFE MEMBER
Jul 31, 2007
5,023
8,338
Forest of Dean
Funster No
46
MH
A Class Hymer B694 tag
Exp
9
Do a search on here. 100+ posts will say yes. 100+ posts will say no. 100+ posts will say you are totally anti-social going near a motor vehicle after consuming alcohol. 100+ will say "no chance of being caught".

So choose the answer that pleases you.

@stephsol
And that's the best answer you're gonna get because as usual with all forums, answers to most questions are opinions rather than fact.:)(y)

Subscribers  do not see these advertisements

 
Upvote 0
May 8, 2016
1,685
78,504
silver coast, portugal
Funster No
42,972
MH
C Class: Low profile
Exp
Boatie for 20 years
RAE.. Radio Amateurs Exam G6F .. I passed in '81 and got G6HML.. Got the G4 about 2 years later
Ahhhh! Got Ya! Saw some of your kit in that post, impressive, then read another post of yours re CNB - you'd said it all, We do have common ground then, brilliant deduction:D
 
Upvote 0
OP
OP
stephsol
Jul 7, 2016
238
125
Powys, UK
Funster No
43,969
MH
hymer b584
Exp
Im a newgie
Well thanks everybody, that's pretty comprehensive, ummm......very cautionary....I stand balanced, will leave a drink out untill im in a park! thanks again, great input.
Steph
 
Upvote 0

KeithMak

Free Member
Nov 10, 2016
50
32
South West
Funster No
46,020
MH
none
Exp
0000
Do a search on here. 100+ posts will say yes. 100+ posts will say no. 100+ posts will say you are totally anti-social going near a motor vehicle after consuming alcohol. 100+ will say "no chance of being caught".

So choose the answer that pleases you.

or
E-mail the chief constable of the area and ask him, then you will know for definite or perhaps you won't. ;)

Subscribers  do not see these advertisements

 
Upvote 0

hilldweller

LIFE MEMBER
Dec 5, 2008
605
36,108
Macclesfield
Funster No
5,089
MH
Zilch Mk1
Exp
From Aug 2007
or
E-mail the chief constable of the area and ask him, then you will know for definite or perhaps you won't. ;)

You'll not get a definitive reply. This has been done to death since 1872 on motorhome forums and there is no simple answer. Much depends on the cop you encounter, his/her attitude to you and your attitude to the cop. So all the chief would say, to cover his back/pension is don't drink. And basically that is the only 100% safe advice.
 
Upvote 0

glenn2926

Free Member
Sep 11, 2012
3,326
13,619
Gods country
Funster No
22,848
MH
Chausson
Exp
newbie hired 3
Surely you are in charge of all your vehicles all the time. I know I am in charge of my motorhome, motorbike and both cars right now. They are on the drive, in the garage and again on the drive respectively. Nobody else can use them unless I say so. So I am always in charge of them. When can I have a few drinks and stay within the letter of the law re drunk in charge?
 
Upvote 0

sdc77

Free Member
Jan 28, 2013
3,244
4,550
Weardale, Co Durham
Funster No
24,456
MH
Coachbuilt
Exp
since 2011
Surely you are in charge of all your vehicles all the time. I know I am in charge of my motorhome, motorbike and both cars right now. They are on the drive, in the garage and again on the drive respectively. Nobody else can use them unless I say so. So I am always in charge of them. When can I have a few drinks and stay within the letter of the law re drunk in charge?
It's been explained quite clearly above. you are confusing ownership and sections of the law regarding drink drive.
 
Upvote 0

Tootles

Funster
Deceased RIP
Sep 14, 2013
9,511
34,799
Lancaster
Funster No
28,093
MH
Coachbuilt
Exp
Was a newbie, now a Middie.
The changes included: a new roadside testing kit, which could detect the presence of cocaine
Well, their goes me Christmas snort then.......:(:(:(:(

Subscribers  do not see these advertisements

 
Upvote 0

DuxDeluxe

LIFE MEMBER
Jul 10, 2008
14,627
72,223
Planet Zog
Funster No
3,243
MH
A woosh bang van
Exp
since 2008
Well, their goes me Christmas snort then.......:(:(:(:(
Toots.......so sorry to disappoint you, but that white stuff you were sniffing that made your nose go all cold and numb, was in fact snow. :xdoh:


And the snowman was very upset that you also ate his nose:xwink:
 
Upvote 0

Tootles

Funster
Deceased RIP
Sep 14, 2013
9,511
34,799
Lancaster
Funster No
28,093
MH
Coachbuilt
Exp
Was a newbie, now a Middie.
Toots.......so sorry to disappoint you, but that white stuff you were sniffing that made your nose go all cold and numb, was in fact snow. :xdoh:


And the snowman was very upset that you also ate his nose:xwink:
The powder was WHITE. The snow I eat is always YELLOW. My God man, do you think I cant tell the difference between coke and dog p**s??
 
Upvote 0

jessthedog

Free Member
Aug 24, 2016
979
8,670
south east
Funster No
44,777
MH
A
Statistics have shown that 25% of road collisions are drink related.
So that means the other 75% haven't had a drink.

So Statistically Im safer having a drink aren't I? Hic.:xsurprised:

But then again, its also been found that 85% of statistics are misleading.:xsmile:

Subscribers  do not see these advertisements

 
Upvote 0

EX51SSS

LIFE MEMBER
Jul 18, 2015
6,073
28,561
North Manchester
Funster No
37,198
MH
Hymer Exsis A Class
Exp
since 2007
Statistics have shown that 25% of road collisions are drink related.
So that means the other 75% haven't had a drink.

So Statistically Im safer having a drink aren't I? Hic.:xsurprised:

But then again, its also been found that 85% of statistics are misleading.:xsmile:
So does that mean the other 22% are accurate? :rofl::rofl::rofl:
 
Upvote 0
Nov 3, 2016
881
1,679
Derbyshire, UK
Funster No
45,901
MH
Bailey Autograph
Exp
Since 2016
As above poster says.

I personally Lock the doors to the drivers cab. I place my full circle style steering lock on the steering wheel and I pile a load of cloths and empty packing bags etc on the drivers seat to build a wall if you will so I can't reach the handbreak (by the drivers door in our van)
I then have the keys in the kitchen cupboard.

For me that's enough to argue my case should it be needed. All laws are still how they are interpreted and I would argue that's interpreted as not likely to be in charge of a vehicle under the influcence.
Would be a miserable sod to try and argue that any other way in court.

No black & white argument in this case and I plan to spend no extra effort worrying about it and am just going to enjoy my hobbie.
 
Upvote 0

Join us or log in to post a reply.

To join in you must be a member of MotorhomeFun

Join MotorhomeFun

Join us, it quick and easy!

Log in

Already a member? Log in here.

Latest journal entries

Funsters who are viewing this thread

Back
Top