Dartford Crossing

May 25, 2014
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East Sussex
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So are all Mh's class B ?.....and what about a Toad behind a Mh / a trailer I guess but ??

Will sort out an account very soon, like some other Funsters I don't tend to use tunnel much during the pay period, (getting through as much as poss before 6am and back after 10pm) but for those odd times it looks very slightly cheaper.................and if there are specific acc holders lanes...........
 

Shovelheadrob

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Jul 13, 2014
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On & off for 20 years
All m/hs are classB, trailers, toads & caravans even 5th wheels are free.
 
Sep 6, 2014
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See Here. If you receive a charge notice because you had to follow an official diversion you can get the charge cancelled.
There are Several large notices, for a fair distance going towards the Dartford crossing from the north side, Warning that the OFFICIAL DIVERSION in case of closure, is to leave the M25 at the A12 and A13 and return to the M25 and take the NORTHERN ROUTE back around the motorway. I saw these many times when in my car and never knew what they were, I now know.
 
Aug 18, 2014
11,960
26,910
Spain
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32,898
MH
Granduca 49
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just restarted after 30 year break
We have 2 UK registered vehicles (works van and camper) and 1 French registered vehicle (car). We use each of them at least once each year on a return crossing. Can we register a French vehicle alongside a UK registered vehicle for a TAG and can we mix and match different classes of vehicle on the same TAG?
As we are from SE Essex we only use the Dartford Crossing to go south.

Thanks
So where are you a 'resident' ? If the UK you cannot legally drive the French vehicle in the UK. & Vice-versa; if a French resident you can't drive the UK vehicles over their although you can legally drive each in there respective countries.
 
Jul 4, 2010
1,193
2,025
Essex / central France
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12,437
MH
Hymer Star Line 680
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9 years
Not sure what you mean Gus.
We have a holiday home in France and a French car registered and insured to that address. We have French insurance to drive anywhere in the EU and the insurance company and French vehicle registration authorities understand that we are UK residents with a holiday home in France.
Being UK residents we can drive our UK vehicles in the EU too.

Have I misunderstood you or am I missing something as the above practice appears to be commonplace?
 

Snowbird

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Apr 24, 2009
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So what happens with vehicles that are registered as disabled. They used to travel free on the Dartford crossing. The booth operator checked the vehicle tax disc and that was it. If there are no booth operators do disabled drivers now pay or will the vehicle plate recognition recognise this.
 
Aug 18, 2014
11,960
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Granduca 49
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just restarted after 30 year break
Not sure what you mean Gus.
We have a holiday home in France and a French car registered and insured to that address. We have French insurance to drive anywhere in the EU and the insurance company and French vehicle registration authorities understand that we are UK residents with a holiday home in France.
Being UK residents we can drive our UK vehicles in the EU too.

Have I misunderstood you or am I missing something as the above practice appears to be commonplace?
Yes , as UK residents you can legally drive your UK vehicles anywhere . Your French vehicles you can drive in France & anywhere else in the EU ,BUT you cannot drive them legally in the UK as UK residents.
The EU law, which actually dates from 1983, states that no resident of an EU state can legally drive a vehicle in his home country that is not registered there.
I had all this out with both the DVLA (utterly useless shower, Took 10 emails before they told me what I wanted to know ) & the EU . The EU explained it concisely in one reply.

Here is link from a Scottish gov,site.

"
UK residents driving non-UK cars in the UK
UK residents are not allowed to use non-UK registered vehicles on UK roads. The only exceptions are:

  • if you work in another EU member state and use an EU-registered company car temporarily in the UK for business and private purposes
  • if you lease an EU-registered car and use this temporarily in the UK

from here;

http://www.directscot.org/article/driving-in-the-uk-with-non-uk-number-plates#

Here is the reply, to me, from the DVLA


"Dear Mr López

Thank you for your email received on 7/10/13. Your email reference number is 1570140.

The Vehicle Excise and Registration Act 1994 stipulates that UK residents are not permitted to use a non-UK-registered vehicle on UK roads. In the circumstances that you have explained, your daughters or your daughter’s partners will not be permitted to use a non-UK registered vehicle as they are residents within the UK."
 
Last edited:

SandT

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Oct 15, 2012
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Not sure what you mean Gus.
We have a holiday home in France and a French car registered and insured to that address. We have French insurance to drive anywhere in the EU and the insurance company and French vehicle registration authorities understand that we are UK residents with a holiday home in France.
Being UK residents we can drive our UK vehicles in the EU too.

Have I misunderstood you or am I missing something as the above practice appears to be commonplace?

You have asked whether a vehicle belonging to a UK keeper, who has a French holiday home (temporary residence) may register the vehicle in France, and use the vehicle to return to the UK for occasional short visits.
The International Circulation Order that governs where an individual must register a vehicle makes it clear that each person should only register in the Member State of the person’s normal place of residence (country of permanent residency). Article 7 of Directive 83/182/EEC and Article 6 of Directive 83/183/EEC set out rules for determine normal residence, in situations where the person concerned are temporarily or permanently living and driving in a Member state other than their own.
The European Court of Justice has also set out a criterion that permanent residence is taken to be the place where a person lives 185 days per year.
This means that as an UK resident a person cannot drive a foreign registered vehicle in the UK. If the normal residence for the individual is the UK - the keeper is legally required to register in the UK (not in the country of temporary residence, in this case France)
The direct.gov website makes it clear that UK residents cannot use a foreign registered vehicle on UK roads. The only exception is where a UK resident is employed or self-employed in another EU member state and needs to drive a foreign vehicle on a temporary basis.
If a UK resident is stopped driving a foreign vehicle in the UK, it would be for them to demonstrate they are legally allowed to do so.

Terry

ps
We lived in France for 7 years and know that French insurance companies will give you insurance, however Its doubtful that they will pay out in the event of a claim!
 
Jul 4, 2010
1,193
2,025
Essex / central France
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12,437
MH
Hymer Star Line 680
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9 years
Thank you both very much for your comprehensive replies, food for thought indeed.
We have literally just registered our previously UK registered car in France to simplify things...

We travel to and from the UK - France quite frequently and the cost difference in travel costs between a van and a car is about £100. Once or maybe twice a year we use a car to 'pop to the UK ' (elderly parents) while we are on a longer stay in France instead of using a van, it's faster a cheaper if we are only back in the UK for a couple of days or so.

I nearly understand the reasoning behind this ruling but it does feel quite stupid to know we can travel to every EU country with our French car without the mention of a Green Card or having to inform our French insurers we are going out of the country, except to the country where we live, were born and pay our taxes. Ah well, if only we had more practical laws...
 
Aug 18, 2014
11,960
26,910
Spain
Funster No
32,898
MH
Granduca 49
Exp
just restarted after 30 year break
I see in the paper this morning that they reckon after the toll is changed that 14% won't pay/won't know they've got to pay etc.
Now we've got a 'consultation' on an "ultra-low emission zone". W hich will be same area as the congestion charge.It is proposed that it will be 24/7 & apply to every vehicle .
Here is part of Boris's letter.
" Dear Customer,

We would like your views on the proposed Ultra Low Emission Zone which will operate 24 hours a day, 7 days a week in the same area as the Congestion Charging zone. The zone would be introduced in 2020 and aims to encourage the use of newer, cleaner vehicles, reducing vehicle pollution by half.

All cars, motorcycles, vans, minibuses, and heavy vehicles (including lorries, coaches and large vans) would need to meet a new emission standard or pay a daily charge to travel within the zone.

The proposed emission standards are tighter than those for the current Low Emission Zone (which operates across Greater London). The proposed daily Ultra Low Emission Zone charge will be in addition to the existing Low Emission Zone charge and the Congestion Charge. "

So the standard will be lower than existing & most vehicle manufacturers state, off the record, that there is no further room for improvement with diesels.+ have a bad day & you'll be caught for the LEZ , congestion charge then the new Ultra LEZ !:eek: :LOL::LOL:
 
Apr 12, 2010
1,606
10,881
West Suffolk
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11,027
MH
Adria twin van conversion
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since 2007
I just went online and registered my 3 vehicles on the new dart tag system. It was easy peasy ! Job done.
Phil
 

Snowbird

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Apr 24, 2009
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I see in the paper this morning that they reckon after the toll is changed that 14% won't pay/won't know they've got to pay etc.
Now we've got a 'consultation' on an "ultra-low emission zone". W hich will be same area as the congestion charge.It is proposed that it will be 24/7 & apply to every vehicle .
Here is part of Boris's letter.
" Dear Customer,

We would like your views on the proposed Ultra Low Emission Zone which will operate 24 hours a day, 7 days a week in the same area as the Congestion Charging zone. The zone would be introduced in 2020 and aims to encourage the use of newer, cleaner vehicles, reducing vehicle pollution by half.

All cars, motorcycles, vans, minibuses, and heavy vehicles (including lorries, coaches and large vans) would need to meet a new emission standard or pay a daily charge to travel within the zone.

The proposed emission standards are tighter than those for the current Low Emission Zone (which operates across Greater London). The proposed daily Ultra Low Emission Zone charge will be in addition to the existing Low Emission Zone charge and the Congestion Charge. "

So the standard will be lower than existing & most vehicle manufacturers state, off the record, that there is no further room for improvement with diesels.+ have a bad day & you'll be caught for the LEZ , congestion charge then the new Ultra LEZ !:eek: :LOL::LOL:
I have a bright idea for Boris...Why not make the whole of London a pedestrianised zone :cool:.
 
Sep 6, 2014
3,821
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I do not know what LAW that these regulations actually apply to I thought the LAW was made by Parliament (for what use they are.). Transport for London is a created Quango that seems to have no actual legal basis in English Law. There was no voting by the people of London as to whether or not there vehicle were suddenly declared scrap. This idea will not go down well if it applies to ALL vehicles.. Are there any other places that I should avoid like the Plague for similar reasons to this in this Country. I know the Germans are doing sort of the same but they haven't got the same scale of charges and penalties as does Ken/Boris.. I would like to know how much the thieving bastards get in £500-£1000 fines, plus extra for slow payment of from unknowing mugs that go into the Zone.
I am willing to say It is probably many millions of pounds. So there will be no slowing the greed once it has got going. Keep the stinking hole, but other organisations will like what they see and follow.
 

Thefirstbritsbrother

Free Member
Nov 17, 2013
18
13
Durham
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29,063
MH
Coachbuilt
Exp
Since 2005
I registered my car and Motorhome this afternoon, I had to phone to get the Motorhome put in a class B as it was put in class C. It was easy enough once I explained that the Motorhome was neither a four door nor did it have a hatchback.
 
Apr 12, 2010
1,606
10,881
West Suffolk
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11,027
MH
Adria twin van conversion
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since 2007
Had an email update today:

The new payment arrangements at the Dartford Crossing will come into effect on 30 November 2014:

  • from 6am on Sunday 30 November you’ll no longer pay at the barriers
  • the current payment arrangements will continue until Dart Charge goes live
  • we’ll start the main roadworks to remove the booths and introduce a new road layout in late November; due for completion spring 2015
We’ll be in touch shortly with further information about how you can transfer your existing DART-Tag account or set up a new account to get ready for Dart Charge.

Visit our Dart Charge web page for more information.
https://www.gov.uk/government/collections/dart-charge
I
Did it put your motorhome in the right class it put ours in class D
I checked and we were in the class C, so I phoned up and got it changed to group B. They were very helpful.
Phil
 
Apr 12, 2010
1,606
10,881
West Suffolk
Funster No
11,027
MH
Adria twin van conversion
Exp
since 2007
If you register, check the groupings. They seem to put you in the class for the chassis. "Motorhomes" are group 2 along with cars. I phoned and they changed it without any problem.
Phil
 

Jaws

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Sep 26, 2008
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Question..
I might use the crossing maybe 4 times a year.
Should I register on line for a dart tag ?

Reason for asking, if we just use the crossing and it charges me other than group B, I could have all manner of grief trying to sort it out after the event ( so to speak )
 
Jan 20, 2011
1,234
863
Rural Nottinghamshire and Spain
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15,031
MH
A Class
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Since 1996
Question..
I might use the crossing maybe 4 times a year.
Should I register on line for a dart tag ?

Reason for asking, if we just use the crossing and it charges me other than group B, I could have all manner of grief trying to sort it out after the event ( so to speak )
I am in the same position regarding number of crossings but decided to register to save having to bother with payment each time. Glad that I did because, like others, I was registered as a goods vehicle in class 3. Not a lot of difference in cost but it would appear that you would have been charged on the wrong basis as they go from the base chassis. Would register if I were you but ring up after the account is opened and tell them that you are a motorhome and they will put you in group B.

Mike
 
Nov 6, 2013
1,150
1,999
S. Ayrshire
Funster No
28,914
MH
The usual
Exp
Since the beginning
Question..
I might use the crossing maybe 4 times a year.
Should I register on line for a dart tag ?

Reason for asking, if we just use the crossing and it charges me other than group B, I could have all manner of grief trying to sort it out after the event ( so to speak )
You have to use the Tag at least once per year. If you don't they'll disable the Tag.
It doesn't cost anything to register an account, and you get cheaper crossings - nothing to lose :)
 

dryad

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Apr 25, 2010
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citroen relay pvc
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quite a few years now, and loving every minute..
So what happens with vehicles that are registered as disabled. They used to travel free on the Dartford crossing. The booth operator checked the vehicle tax disc and that was it. If there are no booth operators do disabled drivers now pay or will the vehicle plate recognition recognise this.


copied this from the gov.uk site..
Exemptions
Vehicles currently legally exempt from paying the crossing charge will continue to be exempt. This includes vehicles exempt from paying Vehicle Excise Duty because they are used by or for disabled person(s). The full list of exemptions is described in legislation.

The Highways Agency is working with the DVLA to identify vehicles registered as exempt from Vehicle Excise Duty automatically.
 

Jaws

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Sep 26, 2008
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You have to use the Tag at least once per year. If you don't they'll disable the Tag.
It doesn't cost anything to register an account, and you get cheaper crossings - nothing to lose :)
And indeed I have now done it.. Just got to wait for the paper work to come through so I can add a vehicle to it ...
 
Jan 28, 2008
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7 years campers before that
JUST REGISTERED MINE AND IT HAS COME UP AS A COMERCIAL TRIED TO SEND THEM A NOTE ON THE CONTACT FORM FIRSTLY IT WILL NOT ALLOW YOU TO TYPE IN NUMBERS THEN WHEN I PRESSED SEND IT DISAPEARED SO I WILLL HAVE TO RING IN THE MORNING
 

Shovelheadrob

Free Member
Jul 13, 2014
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On & off for 20 years
JUST REGISTERED MINE AND IT HAS COME UP AS A COMERCIAL TRIED TO SEND THEM A NOTE ON THE CONTACT FORM FIRSTLY IT WILL NOT ALLOW YOU TO TYPE IN NUMBERS THEN WHEN I PRESSED SEND IT DISAPEARED SO I WILLL HAVE TO RING IN THE MORNING
How did you get on? I got my Dart Tag migration notice on Thursday, registered my American pick up no problem class B, but my Transit which is a crew van & has been since new, put it in class C as I had expected, so phoned up, spent nearly 45 minutes to be told they can only go on what the DVLA computer says, I explained what had been done, by whom & when, offered to send in photos/invoices etc but told that after speaking to a supervisor they couldn't do anything & I'd have to take it up with the DVLA, I asked to speak with the supervisor & was told that's not possible. The contact form is a joke, as you said it doesn't work, I used google to get an email address but that is incorrect so I have written a letter to be posted tomorrow, 1 step forward several back.
 

Jaws

LIFE MEMBER
Sep 26, 2008
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Narrfoook
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since 2006 ( I think ! )
What a total cods ear they are making of this.
Last week I went and signed up for a dart tag
When I got it there was no mention of my vehicle at all.
Called them and they said they are not dealing with it any more as the new organisation is now in charge and I should fone them
So called them and they say there is no record of my account anywhere and I SHOULD CALL DART TAG people !!!!!!!!!
alled Dart Tag back and they said I do not exist on their data base either..
I gave them the tag number... not issued
I gave them my account number as stated on top of the invoice .. not enough digits
I gave them the invoice number.. cannot trace it

I think I might as well have chucked the lolly down the loo..
It has cost me more in fone calls than I will save in a couple of years.
useless bunch of incompetent numptys..
Nice folk I agree, but still useless
 

Shovelheadrob

Free Member
Jul 13, 2014
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It made me laugh, there was a box on the application form online for customer feedback, I filled it out then realised that there was no button/icon to click on to send it. Just another government body that won't be fit for purpose.
 
Sep 6, 2014
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I have a bright idea for Boris...Why not make the whole of London a pedestrianised zone :cool:.
Apart from a TOTALLY electric vehicle there are NO current vehicles on the UK roads which would meet the currently proposed standard. I mean nothing!
The people that live within the M25 ought to look very carefully at whom they vote in for Mayor and if they find that this goes ahead then Tough,they should pay more attention to what the Bastards get up to behind the populations back,, Something about turkeys voting for Xmas.
 
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