Charlotte's Twelve Volt Titivation!

[CandC]

When I bought Charlotte, our 1986 Renault trafic autosleeper, I knew that she needed a fair bit of TLC. I've been trying to do things in order of priority as time and money allowed. My first job, a year ago was to sort out a couple of leaks which I managed with some hints from members here, the plastic cover from an old outside light and a tube of sikaflex (great stuff!)

Next on the agenda was to service the engine. I treated her to all new filters, new oil and tweaked her carburettor and she ran a lot better.

Last year, Charlotte was used mainly as a day van, but this year we have quite a few trips planned. As she passed the dreaded MOT with no advisories, I've decided to rework the habitation electrics completely and to share that rework with others in the hope it may help some and interest others.

More to follow as soon as I've opened a well deserved beer

 

[ianhyslop]

Well done , keep up the good work .in fact have two beers .

 

[CandC]

Because this is quite a big project for me, I want to get it right so have done a shed load of research on 12v electrics in motorhomes. As others have said before, the £10 spent on membership here is the best tenner I've ever spent!

Our main trip this year will be two weeks in the highlands of Scotland, mostly wilding, so no hookup. When we are away, we will only be staying in the same place for one or two nights at a time. There's only a little bit of flat space on the roof so I've opted to go for the biggest panel which would fit at 60W alongside a split charge system and two leisure batteries: again the biggest that space would allow.

After much deliberation I bought a 75AH and a 110AH battery from go outdoors, a 60W solar kit from www.sunstore.co.uk and a split charge relay and all the gubbins to wire it together from www.altecautomotive.co.uk as none of the kits fully met my needs. More to follow after beer number 2 (yet another useful suggestion from a funster!)

 

[rosalan]

I think you have made a good start by dealing with the most important matter first. Damp and rust are perhaps the nearest thing to death for a motorhome.
Sorting out electrics may be an 'interesting' challenge, for I guess that previous owners may have added their own bits and pieces without recording any changes. Good luck and keep posting so we can all see and I hope learn from your experiences.
Alan

 

[John.]

Keep up the good work
Oh think you deserve a third beer as well

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[scotzsue]

Sounds like a plan, should be plenty of power for a pvc.

 

[CandC]

I think you have made a good start by dealing with the most important matter first. Damp and rust are perhaps the nearest thing to death for a motorhome.
Sorting out electrics may be an 'interesting' challenge, for I guess that previous owners may have added their own bits and pieces without recording any changes. Good luck and keep posting so we can all see and I hope learn from your experiences.
Alan

Yes, one of the most daunting aspects was trying to figure out what the previous owners had done.... I gave up trying to figure out why they had done some things when I saw that they had moved the leisure battery to under the same seat as the gas bottle!!! After a useful post from @Jaws , I decided to isolate everything previous owners had done battery side of the thankfully still standard autosleeper electrics. and start over.

 

[CandC]

Keep up the good work
Oh think you deserve a third beer as well

I apologise in advance for my deteriorating typing!!

 

[John.]

I apologise in advance for my deteriorating typing!!

Don't worry.
Mine is always this bad

 

[CandC]

I'll try to cover each aspect of the job and the components used in order, but if I miss anything or you want more details, please just ask. Because of the space and layout constraints, I decided to leave the gas bottle where it was under the rear near side seat. That would appear to be the original location as that compartment has a floor vent and the copper gas pipe starts there.

The 75ah battery is already under the bonnet and, as you'll see from the photo was the biggest I could shoehorn in there! Oh and yes, the starter battery terminals need cleaning. All in due course


The 110 AH battery will go under the rear offside passenger seat and be vented to the outside by tubing.

Because of the fairly long cable runs, I'm using 110A cable throughout to minimise voltage drop and all will be protected by 100A fuses next to and both sides of each battery.

The split charge stuff was supposed to arrive yesterday, but thanks to the courier messing up arrived today instead but it was still nice to see my shiny new toys


I had other plans made for today so couldn't spend as long as I wanted on it. I did, however, manage to make up the lead which will go between the starter battery, through the relay, to the first leisure battery.


The relay I chose is a 140A bi-directional voltage sensing relay which will charge the leisure batteries from the alternator when the engine is running and will also charge the starter battery from the solar or on hookup.



Well, that's it so far... Now I'm off to bed before someone tells me I deserve ANOTHER beer !

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[irnbru]

Looking forward to reading your posts and hopefully picking up some knowledge along the way.

 

[CandC]

Sounds like a plan, should be plenty of power for a pvc

Sounds like a plan, should be plenty of power for a pvc.

Thank you Sue, we're not too demanding for power I think. We don't use an investor or TV so the biggest draw on the power is probably going to be the fan for the blown air heating. At some stage, I will be replacing all the lights with LED, which will be a help too.

 

[Chockswahay]

It's the fan on the heater that uses most of the energy (around 24 to 30 amps per day if heating on ALL the time!). In summer should not really be an issue however

And if you are 'vanning in the summer you won't be using the light bulbs much either!

 

[CandC]

Looking forward to reading your posts and hopefully picking up some knowledge along the way.

Thank you, I'm glad you're enjoying it so far.

I have learned so much from reading about different aspects of the project on here! So, like I said, if anyone wants any more info about anything I've done and why, please feel free to ask

 

[DanielFord]

Thank you Sue, we're not too demanding for power I think. We don't use an investor or TV so the biggest draw on the power is probably going to be the fan for the blown air heating. At some stage, I will be replacing all the lights with LED, which will be a help too.

Auto correct?

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[CandC]

It's the fan on the heater that uses most of the energy (around 24 to 30 amps per day if heating on ALL the time!). In summer should not really be an issue however

And if you are 'vanning in the summer you won't be using the light bulbs much either!

Auto correct?

Haha, yes.... that and no coffee yet after those three beers last night

 

[CandC]

Thank you @chockswahay : although I was sure it would be our biggest draw, it's good to have it quantified, even if only roughly. So, with an absolute worst case scenario of the heating on all the time and drawing 30AH per day, no solar because it's winter and the panel's covered in snow and I don't move the van, I would still get 3 days before the batteries were down to 50% discharge.... NICE!

 

[Chockswahay]

Whoa! steady there tiger The total useable amps you have are the difference between 85% and 50% of your domestic batteries.

Assuming you have 2 x 110 leisure batteries (?) then this would equate to 77 amps max useable (half this if only 1 leisure battery).

My knowledge is limited on these matters but I think it is more or less along those lines.

 

[rosalan]

All going well I see. My only offering at this point would be to encourage the addition of LED lights. For years we would economise on the lights we had on, now even with a whole cluster switched on, they barely equal a single quartz halogens use of energy. LED's can be expensive and choosing the right colour matters, basically white for reading and warm for social. I only plug this point as it may allow you greater time to work inside the van, otherwise it could wait until later.
Alan

 

[CandC]

Whoa! steady there tiger The total useable amps you have are the difference between 85% and 50% of your domestic batteries.

Assuming you have 2 x 110 leisure batteries (?) then this would equate to 77 amps max useable (half this if only 1 leisure battery).

My knowledge is limited on these matters but I think it is more or less along those lines.

Oh, I thought it would be 50% total... I guess the 85% is to give you a "safety buffer" type thingummybob for the batteries? Anyway... I should be out there, not in here typing. Hope to be giving you all an update later

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[CandC]

All going well I see. My only offering at this point would be to encourage the addition of LED lights. For years we would economise on the lights we had on, now even with a whole cluster switched on, they barely equal a single quartz halogens use of energy. LED's can be expensive and choosing the right colour matters, basically white for reading and warm for social. I only plug this point as it may allow you greater time to work inside the van, otherwise it could wait until later.
Alan

Thank you, Alan, for your interest and the info about power consumption and colour choice. LED lighting is on the cards, but will need to be at a later date... Back to work on Monday. I've given some thought to it already though and will be leaving a free slot on my soon to be installed 12v distribution board for a separate LED mood lighting circuit. That way, hopefully, I won't have too many problems when I get round to that install! OK, gotta run, cables to make and fit, people to see

 

[Mikey RV]

Haha, yes.... that and no coffee yet after those three beers last night

Right I can see the problem.....you only had three beers and everyone knows you should have a balanced diet so you should have had four.

 

[CandC]

Right I can see the problem.....you only had three beers and everyone knows you should have a balanced diet so you should have had four.

I'll take care of that immediately.... by having the other one, not four Been a long day and I feel an early night coming on. Update to follow soonish.

 

[CandC]

Well, today ended up being pretty full on. It was pouring with rain here a fair bit of the day so much of my time was spent keeping my 6 year old daughter occupied when it was raining and helping her on her new bike when it wasn't. I still managed to get a fair bit done though. All the live cables are made up and in the right places, all ready to be bolted to the batteries and connected to the habitation electrics.

That involved drilling three 16mm holes through Charlotte's floor and painting the hole edges with hammerite to help keep the dreaded rust at bay. I then fitted a cable gland to each hole with a bead of sikaflex between the outside flange of the gland and the underside of the van. Two of the holes were under the offside rear passenger seat, home to the 110AH battery: one for the cable from the 75AH in the engine compartment and one to take the feed (now from both batteries in parallel) out and under the van to come up through the third hole int0 the electrics cupboard. Next, I wrapped the cable with some split conduit to protect the outside run, starting about 18" from one end. I threaded that unwrapped end up through the first hole, double checked that I had left enough to get to the battery and then tightened the gland and crimped a battery connector onto the end. The cable was routed along to the engine bay and cable tied in place. Next, I cut off the surplus cable and conduit and built the fuse assembly and connector to join it to the 75AH battery.

After a spot of light lunch....

I ran the cable from the rear battery compartment under and across the van, taking advantage of a cross member to keep the cable away from the exhaust and fitted fuses and connectors to the battery compartment cables.

Handy hint... Make sure you put the cables through all the glands, tight spaces etc before you do any crimping ends on

So uhmm yeah... I ran the cables and got them all secured in place and have hooked it up to the distribution board in the leccy cupboard and connected the habitation electrics through a 15A blade fuse on the board. The old system used a 15A fuse so I've stuck with that.

Tomorrow morning, I just need to make up the earth lead for the 110AH battery, bolt it all together and cross my fingers for the big switch on!

Because of trying to cram all that in between the rain, keeping my daughter amused and my quick snack lunch I didn't manage to get any pictures of today's work, but they will follow tomorrow.

Right, after all that slithering about on the wet ground, I think it's hot bath time!

And for everyone who has taken an interest and for those who have offered advice and encouragement...

(been wanting to use that one for ages )

Colin.

 

[CandC]

Well, yesterday was a lovely sunny day here and we're busy today so instead of working on Charlotte we went for a bike ride on the camel trail and had a picnic lunch.

I did manage to fit one very important accessory though.....

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[CandC]

Apologies to everyone that was watching this thread for the lack of updates... Unfortunately a week off work led to this last week being totally manic for me

I do have some good news though.... I managed to get away a bit early on Wednesday and grabbed the chance to finish wiring in the split charge relay system

Even better news... My design for the revamp was planned to make installing the solar setup as pain free as possible. The weather forecast looked good for today and I had a rare commitment free Saturday so at 9am I got busy!

By the end of the afternoon, I was rewarded with a very pleasant sight...



I did promise a step by step guide to my install and that will follow in the next couple of days... No, really!

I didn't have time to take photos as I was going, but I'll take a load tomorrow and hopefully fill in the missing pieces

 

[CandC]

Sorry, a little later than planned, but here are the rest of the photos from the split charger install and a bit about the final stages.

With all the leads made up, I was ready to bolt everything together. As you are always supposed to reconnect battery earth leads last, I started by screwing the relay to the inner wall of the engine bay and connecting it to the positives on the starter and front leisure battery. The relay was earthed courtesy of one of the mounting screws.

Next, I connected up the positive between the two leisure batteries and then from the back leisure battery to the distribution fuse board in the cupboard under the fridge. At this stage, I connected the habitation electrics to the board through a 15A fuse as this would help in testing it all worked.

To test, I fitted the earth wire for the back leisure battery and tried one of the lights.... Woohoo, it worked! next, I disconnected the earth and did the same test on the front leisure battery. Success again

To test the split charge relay, I made sure all the earth's were wired up, before starting the engine. The relay I used has got a small led to show when the batteries are connected and that was confirmed by using an led type battery voltage and charging meter thingy just after the engine is switched off, there's a definite clunk from the relay as it disconnects, protecting the starter battery from being run down.

All good!

So, a couple of pictures.... I still need to tidy some wires up and secure the leisure battery, but.... Front leisure battery, starter battery and the relay:


Back leisure battery :


And the distribution board with live in from the leisure batteries and the solar panel (which I'll try to tell you about tomorrow lol)