CBE Control Panel & CBE Distribution Unit/Fuse Box (2 Viewers)

[Abacist]

I delivered my parts to Apuljack on Monday at lunchtime. They hoped to get back to me today with a diagnosis but I've heard nothing yet. There was a big Hymer there receiving attention when I arrived.

I have to go through diagnostic checks first as I've invoked the warranty I got when I bought it. Why should I pay when there's a warranty but I've already paid for an electronic door lock and fridge repairs whilst we were away in Germany personally because everything has to be pre-approved and that doesn't always work when you are on holiday.

To be fair the warranty company have been prompt to respond so far.

Getting on with the gardening and making more room behind the motorhome and in the process of filling a 6 tonne skip with rubble from a wall and earth.

 

[Abacist]

Now had a response from Apuljack which I have sent to the Warranty company - Autoguard. Hopefully they will reply tomorrow so I can authorise Apuljack to proceed with the repairs.

Our engineers have completed their assessment of your units and have given me their findings.
We have tested the control panel and fuseboard together and encountered several issues, most notable the control panel does not switch on. Both units have been visually inspected and appear to be intact.
As luck would have it another customer has sent in exactly the same units as yours, so we have been able to run parallel testing which has been very helpful. Because of this we can confirm that the control panel does not engage due to a fault which currently has not been identified, and the fuseboard does not measure the leisure battery voltage, despite appearing to be fine after a visual check.
Your charging unit has been thoroughly tested and we have found no faults.
The cost for this assessment is £47 (exVAT), as previously discussed. If you wish to go ahead with our quote for repairs (see below) then we can keep hold of the items and get started once we have your confirmation. If you would rather have them back before going ahead with the repairs then we would kindly ask the £47 (exVAT) invoice be paid before collection.
Our repair price for the control panel and fuseboard is £220 (exVAT) which includes all labour and spares to fully repair both items. In the event that this repair is not possible (unobtainable spares or unit is beyond economical repair) we will charge our standard testing fee of £47 (exVAT) and provide a quote for replacement items where possible.

 

[TinaLes]

Hi @Abicist
It would appear that they have done a visual, plugged in someone else's control panel theirs works yours doesn't? Good news on the charger unit as they say that's all OK.
So they are saying the visual check is £47 (ex Vat) and now want you authority to put in the bench, diagnose down to component level, replace all faulty components, test and hand it back to you.
That what I assumed they would do in the first place as they have already quoted you for full repair, or am I missing something?
Strange, unless this is their way of giving you a status update, on what they have done over the last week or so.
Les

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[Abacist]

I got the impression as both units were faulty they were struggling having said that the Control Panels are usually OK. So I'm lucky someone else sent their gear in which helped them out.
If I was not using a warranty company they would just have repaired the 2 faulty units and there would not have been a diagnosis charge which was insisted upon by the warranty company. The warranty company would not accept my word that something was faulty and insisted on the testing being carried out.
It will be interesting to see if I have to pay for the diagnosis or whether the warranty company will pay.
Having said I would probably be informed the next day having taken them in, it has taken them over 1 week to do what they have and they didn't tell me anything until I called in today and they asked if I had had their email. I hadn't so went outside and checked as we went to leave. No email, so prompted them to try again and then it pretty much immediately appeared as a forwarded email.
Not ecstatic with their performance so far and hope that they come back OK!

 

[Pausim]

Thanks for keeping us updated on this. It sounds as if Apuljack thinks the problem started with an electrical surge. Do you have any idea what caused the breaker to trip out in the first place? Perhaps we all need surge protection devices.

Hope you get it all resolved soon.

 

[Abacist]

Thanks for keeping us updated on this. It sounds as if Apuljack thinks the problem started with an electrical surge. Do you have any idea what caused the breaker to trip out in the first place? Perhaps we all need surge protection devices.

Hope you get it all resolved soon.

That was their initial reaction before seeing the devices. As the charger and its 2 internal fuses came through intact and is first inline for any mains surge I have discounted this. They say the control panel is completely dead and the distribution box has faults including the fact that it won't show/record the amps flowing into the battery bank. Frankly I am no wiser as to the cause of the failures at all!

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[Abacist]

Warranty company have now approved repair costs in full plus half the diagnostic fee plus VAT so repair work authorised just now and they say 9/10 days to complete.

 

[Abacist]

Latest email from Apuljack and now it seems that the control panel is actually completely unserviceable and they need the N+B vehicle number to be able to price up and obtain a replacement and of course go back to the warranty company to get more costs approved:-

It seems in all our detailed note-taking and correspondences we never recorded your vehicle chassis number!
Would you be able to let me know please?
Our engineers have done a lot more investigation into the faults and at this stage we are not certain but the control panel is looking very much like it will need to be replaced with a new one. I am awaiting more information on this and I will of course speak to Autoguard about this as well before any decisions are made.
Apuljack Engineering Limited
www.apuljackengineering.co.uk
01278 588 922
Unit 6, Mill Batch Farm, East Brent, Somerset TA9 4JN

 

[Abacist]

Latest email to me and warranty company containing bad news:-

Our engineers have continued their endeavours to repair the control panel and fuseboard, but unfortunately this has uncovered more issues which were not apparent until we had begun to remove and repair components.
These issues are related to the processor on the control panel and the main power and control circuits on the fuseboard, and unfortunately mean that both items are beyond our capacity to repair. This is because the control panel processor has software programmed onto it which we cannot alter or replicate. If the processor becomes damaged and needs to be replaced we can purchase the correct processor but are unable to load the correct software onto it. The fuseboard control circuits include a number of components which normally replace in turn to solve the faults we identified during the inspection. Unfortunately this has not solved the problem, and our engineers have advised that a new fuseboard is required.
The prices for the two new items are as follows:
Fuseboard £438.54
Control Panel £391.92
Total (exVAT) £830.46
Delivery time is 1-2 weeks from date of order.
I appreciate that the situation has changed somewhat from our initial diagnosis, which we understand is certainly unfortunate. The diagnosis revealed several issues which we have seen and remedied many times before, but unfortunately in this instance the usual solutions to these faults have been unsuccessful. We believe the units have failed due to a voltage spike across both units. There is evidence underneath the processor to suggest that it has received an excess of volts.

I am at a loss to understand the voltage spike. The external EHU on the house wall tripped, not the rest of the house or any part of the house. None of the fuses in the motor home have blown and neither of the 2 fuses in the charger which I would imagine would have been first in line for a spike from the mains. Is it possible the van has been struck by lightening? I have yet to get a reaction to the email from Apuljack from the warranty company. Interesting that the prices for the replacements are dearer than when Travelworld quoted me direct!

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[Pausim]

An unfortunately long route to an expensive solution. I believe lightning can cause voltage surges, perhaps without sufficient duration or amps to blow any fuses but enough volts to destroy sensitive components.

 

[Abacist]

I Suppose in this instance Travelworld would have just replaced them and it would have been done quicker but I live in Devon and they are up in Stafford and I needed to get the charger checked out. The warranty company insisted on a professional giving them a report on them before authorising any spend. There is also all my own time in ripping everything out of the motorhome and having to put it all back in due course. I have learnt a lot about how my van ticks which I did not know before and how and where all the electrics are.

I am a firm believer in DIY both in the house, car and in the motorhome and must have saved thousands in 50 years since school.

I have seen relatives play dumb because they are not interested, don't have the skills or the time and I just can't operate like that. I also take after my Dad although he was an engineer and I was an accountant, hence my handle Abacist, who is the operator of the Abacus.

 

[TheBig1]

lightning strikes are extremely hard to predict what damage it can do and guard against.
we had an incoming phone line hit some years ago, it melted the phone and spiked the computer plugged in to the socket and tripped the fuse board. what i remember most was the massive boom of the thunder directly overhead and car alarms being set off. bt took 2 days to rewire the post and all the attached properties

thing is though no vehicles were damaged as the tyres insulated them. had your motorhome not been plugged in, it would not of been damaged

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[jongood]

Lighting does sound a plausible cause, but possibly better not to let on to the warranty company? Do they still have exclusions for 'acts of god'?

 

[Abacist]

The warranty company went very quiet and did not respond so I emailed them again with Apuljack's email asking them to re-evaluate my claim again. Got an odd response that said that I should proceed according to the policy wording which they quoted which requires the use of a VAT registered garage to diagnose the fault blah, blah!

I 'phoned and after a discussion with the claims handler who referred to senior management whilst I was on the phone and eventually agreed to pay for the two new items on condition that they have no further liability. They are worried because I have removed the items, had them diagnosed elsewhere and a VAT registered garage will not be refitting the items in which case they would be responsible for them solving the matter if the new parts fail to solve the problem. I agreed to them having no further liability and hopefully the new parts can be ordered and we can get on with it in due course. They clearly do not understand that the parts are just plug in to the vehicle electrics and screw back to the bulkhead.

Frustrated and a warning to others that you need to follow the policy requirements. They evidently failed to follow their normal policy and allowed me to go off piste and regretted it and then became awkward.

Hopefully now resolved.

 

[Abacist]

Six days have evidently gone by with no progress until yesterday when I asked Apuljack to confirm that they had received the warranty company's approval and ordered the new controller and distribution box. Evidently the warranty company had just been in touch. Anyway the warranty company 'phoned me to confirm they had finally approved to pay for the new controller and distribution box and I got an invoice from Apuljack and paid it so now just waiting for them to arrive.

Its like watching paint dry whilst these companies go through their procedures meanwhile the customer is left with poor service and a disabled vehicle that can't be used!

I'll be glad when its over.

Amazon now report that the surge protection device, recommended by @Lenny HB, will be in stock shortly so I have ordered one of those to fit when I put it all back together.

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[Abacist]

The Sollatek AVS 30 surge protection device arrived over the weekend but still no sign of the new Control Panel & Distribution Board.

 

[TinaLes]

Hi @Abacist sorry to hear this problem is dragging its feet, but hopefully you will get the new CBE units very shortly and be back on the road again.
The question I would like to ask is: bearing in mind Apuljack could not repair the old unit due to a frazzled Microprocessor Chip, also that they could not access the required software needed to make the system work, does that mean that your new CBE units will have to come from N&B and will have been programmed to your specific vehicle?
Thanks & good luck.
Les

 

[Abacist]

I am assuming so as I have had to provide the N+B chassis number.

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[Abacist]

9 days now passed since the parts were ordered by Apuljack and still no sign of them!

Depressed!

 

[TinaLes]

9 days now passed since the parts were ordered by Apuljack and still no sign of them!

Depressed!

I take it the delay is at the German end of the supply chain?
Wishing you some better luck soon, this problem has been dragged out some time now.
Les

 

[jongood]

9 days now passed since the parts were ordered by Apuljack and still no sign of them!

Depressed!

Do you know where they are coming from?

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[Pausim]

I believe CBE are Italian but does N&B hold stocks of their version? Is it very different from the standard unit or would you get 90% of the functions from the standard version?

 

[Abacist]

Do you know where they are coming from?

I assume they are coming from Travelworld but I don't know. I was asked for the N+B vehicle serial number, not the Fiat chassis number so I am assuming that they are proper N+B replacements. They had better be otherwise they will be no good!

 

[funflair]

I assume they are coming from Travelworld but I don't know. I was asked for the N+B vehicle serial number, not the Fiat chassis number so I am assuming that they are proper N+B replacements. They had better be otherwise they will be no good!

I doubt if TW will have them in stock so will have to come from Polch.

Martin

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[Abacist]

Another week gone by and no goods yet!

In the meantime I have bought a Wylex RCD and disconnected the mains input to the CBE RCD so that I can insert the new Wylex RCD to protect the AVS 30 anti surge device which will then be connected back to the CBE RCD. The hab and cab batteries are all charged up and I ready for when the units arrive.

We are due to go to Newbury show in May and a few days in Peterborough before that so hopefully we can get it sorted by then.

 

[Abacist]

Looking here and at the N + B forum and Facebook page there are a worrying number of these failures.

Bought a German van and got Italian electrics - not impressed!

Time they sorted out something more durable!

 

[Robert Clark]

Looking here and at the N + B forum and Facebook page there are a worrying number of these failures.

Bought a German van and got Italian electrics - not impressed!

Time they sorted out something more durable!

CBE is also standard kit on Carthago’s too

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[CazPaul]

Our March 2005 CBE panel,(Concorde) now in its 15th year, still working fine touch wood I wonder if the quality has deteriorated over the years, much the same as everything else.

 

[funflair]

Our March 2005 CBE panel,(Concorde) now in its 15th year, still working fine touch wood I wonder if the quality has deteriorated over the years, much the same as everything else.

There is somebody having similar trouble with a 2005 Flair Paul so can't really go along with that this time.

Martin

 

[jongood]

Looking here and at the N + B forum and Facebook page there are a worrying number of these failures.

Bought a German van and got Italian electrics - not impressed!

Time they sorted out something more durable!

Really sorry you ve not got it sorted yet Robert I would be really annoyed too.

Unless I've missed a bit do you yet know what caused it? Modern elctronics are usually pretty good. Are their any ideas regarding the cause of the other failures? ( I'm useless at facebook sorry)

Jon/Paul/Ringo whatever.......

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