Can we sleep in our motorhome in our own drive? (1 Viewer)

[pappajohn]

Where do you get that from John? The 1960 Act only talks of "human habitation" not different acts such as sleeping, cooking or using the facilities.

Thinking about it Graham, it would imply that the caravan is indeed a self contained dwelling if the onboard facilities were used instead of those in the main house which would then need planning permission according to the 1960s act.
To sleep only in it would be a temporary extension of the property,not a seperate self contained unit.

 

[Puddleduck]

Its a bit like the old wives tale of a swan being able to break your arm or leg, when you ask about it, no-one has ever heard of it happening.

I've seen a swan break someone's arm with it's wing.

 

[mikebeaches]

I can see no problem whatsoever - as Graham said - provided it is 'incidental' (ie occasional) it does not conflict with any regulations as far as I know. And that includes cooking,using the bathroom etc. You can even set your table and chairs outside if you want - provided it is occasional and not being used as a permanent dwelling or accommodation.

Good luck with the new van!

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[Peter JohnsCross MH]

As far as I am aware you can park a caravan, motor home on your own land and live in it if you wish without planning permission

Peter

Definition of a Caravan
The law defines a caravan as any kind of structure built for human habitation which is capable of being moved from one place to another. This definition was derived from Section 29 of the Caravan Sites and Control Development Act 1960.

A supplementary definition of a caravan said it must be capable of being moved whether by being towed or being transported on a motor vehicle or trailer.

Another law, known as The Mobile Homes Act 1968, further adds a ‘twin unit mobile home’ as part of this classification which the law mandates to conform to certain requirements on structure and dimension.

The Need a Planning Permission
Essentially, you do not need a planning permission to keep a caravan in your garden. The laws are not stringent about parking a caravan in your own garden provided that the nature of its parking is only temporary.

You do not need a planning permission if the caravan is considered an annex of your home either. You need to establish this fact though. You have to prove that the caravan maintains a moveable status. But if it becomes the main part or your only dwelling, you would need a planning permission for the same.

A caravan in your garden enjoys a ‘mobile’ status if it is considered as incidental to the enjoyment of your home; which means it is an addition to your home and not a separate unit.

But a planning permission is necessary if you plan to make the caravan in your garden as a separate dwelling place for you.

You should also ensure that your caravan is not obstructing any footway or road.

However, you need to check your property deed if the terms limit or forbid the parking of a caravan in your own garden or backyard. This limitation is most common in urban housing estates.

It would also help if you check Article 4 Directions issued by the Council. This is more in line with property which is considered part of conservation areas.

 

[Allanm]

It's your motorhome, it's your driveway, do what you like in it, as long as you're not doing anything illegal and you don't disturb anyone.

 

[maison]

We are due to move house in less than two weeks and will live in our M/H on the drive of our new house for about two weeks while we make it habitable.

Anyone that complains will be invited to live in the house until it is made ready!

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[pigginchilli]

It's your motorhome, it's your driveway, do what you like in it, as long as you're not doing anything illegal and you don't disturb anyone.

Jealously though that's why mines in f in storage.

 

[etap]

In short you can sleep in your motorhome or caravan on your property but you cannot use it for living in, unless you obtain permission from your local council.
Another bit of info if interested. According to our council you can have six families living in your house as long as you share bathrooms and kitchen, but you cannot divide your house into separate flats unless you get planning permission , I didn't know this until lately and I bet not many others know it either.

 

[wanderer]

We keep ours in storage but when we bring it home to get ready for a trip I usually sleep in it for extra security

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[Glandwr]

Maybe hubby just doesn't want to sleep in it in front of the neighbours. ​

Dick

 

[2bob]

It was from a recent post on here Graham.
The post contained a quote regarding this if memory serves correctly.

save me puting this pappajohn right ( right as usual )

 

[Puddleduck]

And as we all know by now you can't put gates across your drive if the gates are in front of the main elevation of the house, or the gates adjoin a road, unless you get planning permission for said gates.

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[markh]

I've seen a swan break someone's arm with it's wing.

I really don't think you have, a swans wing weighs ounces, and would not be capable of such, I have two nesting pairs, one on each of my lochs, and I've watched foxes taking the juveniles, they aren't as fierce as you townies think

 

[GJH]

It was from a recent post on here Graham.
The post contained a quote regarding this if memory serves correctly.

Thinking about it Graham, it would imply that the caravan is indeed a self contained dwelling if the onboard facilities were used instead of those in the main house which would then need planning permission according to the 1960s act.
To sleep only in it would be a temporary extension of the property,not a seperate self contained unit.

Thanks John. That is the essential difference. In the circumstances described by the OP the use would be incidental so legal.

 

[Puddleduck]

I really don't think you have, a swans wing weighs ounces, and would not be capable of such, I have two nesting pairs, one on each of my lochs, and I've watched foxes taking the juveniles, they aren't as fierce as you townies think

Out kayaking and the swan hit one of our young kayakers as it took off. I went with the young lady to hospital as "the responsible adult". She was in plaster for quite a while. Unfortunately the swan was also injured.

It wasn't the swan that was aggressive just mis-judgement of speed and distance by both swan and kayaker. Adult swans are big, powerful birds.

PS I live in the back of beyond and not a town.

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[MitchandJenny]

Maybe hubby just doesn't want to sleep in it in front of the neighbours.

Make sure he doesn't get any sleep then !!

 

[Larrynwin]

Of course its ok provided you leave your grey valve open

 

[mpdcymru]

Local coven


Local covenants are fine fine but has anyone on here ever hear of one being enforced? Its a bit like the old wives tale of a swan being able to break your arm or leg, when you ask about it, no-one has ever heard of it happening.

We had a local covenant enforced when w lived in Peterborough where we were served a notice requiring us to remove some shrubs from the front garden (definitely our land) by the local council. Only time this has ever happened to us though and we have been about a bit.

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[GJH]

We had a local covenant enforced when w lived in Peterborough where we were served a notice requiring us to remove some shrubs from the front garden (definitely our land) by the local council. Only time this has ever happened to us though and we have been about a bit.

If a covenant is put in place by a local authority, rather than the builder of the estate, it is more likely to be enforced in the long term. Many builders lose interest once they have sold all the properties and moved on.

 

[pappajohn]

In short you can sleep in your motorhome or caravan on your property but you cannot use it for living in, unless you obtain permission from your local council.
Another bit of info if interested. According to our council you can have six families living in your house as long as you share bathrooms and kitchen, but you cannot divide your house into separate flats unless you get planning permission , I didn't know this until lately and I bet not many others know it either.

Thats what i was trying to put across...thank you.

 

[pappajohn]

Out kayaking and the swan hit one of our young kayakers as it took off. I went with the young lady to hospital as "the responsible adult". She was in plaster for quite a while. Unfortunately the swan was also injured.

It wasn't the swan that was aggressive just mis-judgement of speed and distance by both swan and kayaker. Adult swans are big, powerful birds.

PS I live in the back of beyond and not a town.

I think that is the difference to what was being said.
An adult swan weighs, what, 20lbs.....running and flapping at 15mph trying to get airborn.
Thats a lot of inertial weight to get hit by.
A swan coming up to you on foot and sideswiping you with a wing or biting you wouldnt have the power to break bones

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[Puddleduck]

I think that is the difference to what was being said.
An adult swan weighs, what, 20lbs.....running and flapping at 15mph trying to get airborn.
Thats a lot of inertial weight to get hit by.

It was!!!

A swan coming up to you on foot and sideswiping you with a wing or biting you wouldnt have the power to break bones

Agreed, they do hiss a lot and warn people off their territory when they have eggs / cygnets. I have been goosed by a gander which was funny, again a big bird but not powerful enough to do a lot of damage when on foot. I like geese and waste time at my friends house as I join her flock - yes a duck in a gaggle.

 

[PeteH]

We LIVED in our 32ft R-V for almost 2 Years, whilst doing a "Self build". In that time I had so many "officials" on the land for one purpose or another, NOT ONE was interested in where we lived, despite the fact that many where invited "indoors" for tea and Biccies by SWMBO!!. That included the "nice man" who came to sign off the Property for the (then) "poll tax"!. Ditto, when we moved to the current House we lived in the R-V for over 9 months whilst I gutted it and refurbed the interior!. At one point the ONLY toilet facilities where in the R-V!. It regularly got used by the Grandson(s) who regarded it as Their "Den"! and slept, bathed (but not cooked, `cos Granny is too good at that!!) Watched T-V, (And the older 2 Teens I suspect watched one or two, How does one put it? "Dodgy" DVD`s!) Played X-Box in it. and (tried hard to) keep Granddaughter out!!.

Pete

 

[John & Joan]

Incidental means secondary in time or importance. When something is incidental, it is never the main thing.

So in the paragraph
CASES WHERE A SITE LICENCE IS NOT REQUIRED
Use within curtilage of a dwelling house

1. A site licence shall not be required for the use of land as a caravan site if the use is incidental to the enjoyment as such of a dwelling house within the curtilage of which the land is situated.

The dwelling house is the main thing and a Caravan/Motorhome stationed within the property in secondary to that. There is no requirement or prohibition imposed on the use of the secondary part of the dwelling, or the period of time the carvan can be there.

The Caravan/Motorhome can not be an entirely separate dwelling in its own right. So letting someone live in a Caravan/Motorhome on your drive with no shared use of the main dwelling is not permitted. This throws the overnight stops on a driveway type scheme into dispute, although they may be covered under the next paragraph.

Use by a person travelling with a caravan for one or two nights

2. Subject to the provisions of paragraph 13 of this Schedule, a site licence shall not be required for the use of land as a caravan site by a person travelling with a caravan who brings the caravan on to the land for a period which includes not more than two nights—

(a) during that period no other caravan is stationed for the purposes of human habitation on that land or any adjoining land in the same occupation, and

(b) if, in the period of twelve months ending with the day on which the caravan is brought on to the land, the number of days on which a caravan was stationed anywhere on that land or the said adjoining land for the purposes of human habitation did not exceed twenty-eight.

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[GJH]

Incidental means secondary in time or importance. When something is incidental, it is never the main thing.

So in the paragraph
CASES WHERE A SITE LICENCE IS NOT REQUIRED
Use within curtilage of a dwelling house

1. A site licence shall not be required for the use of land as a caravan site if the use is incidental to the enjoyment as such of a dwelling house within the curtilage of which the land is situated.

The dwelling house is the main thing and a Caravan/Motorhome stationed within the property in secondary to that. There is no requirement or prohibition imposed on the use of the secondary part of the dwelling, or the period of time the carvan can be there.

The Caravan/Motorhome can not be an entirely separate dwelling in its own right. So letting someone live in a Caravan/Motorhome on your drive with no shared use of the main dwelling is not permitted. This throws the overnight stops on a driveway type scheme into dispute, although they may be covered under the next paragraph.

Use by a person travelling with a caravan for one or two nights

2. Subject to the provisions of paragraph 13 of this Schedule, a site licence shall not be required for the use of land as a caravan site by a person travelling with a caravan who brings the caravan on to the land for a period which includes not more than two nights—

(a) during that period no other caravan is stationed for the purposes of human habitation on that land or any adjoining land in the same occupation, and

(b) if, in the period of twelve months ending with the day on which the caravan is brought on to the land, the number of days on which a caravan was stationed anywhere on that land or the said adjoining land for the purposes of human habitation did not exceed twenty-eight.

The way I interpret it, John, is that if the use is by family or friend visiting the householder then it comes within Paragraph 1.
I agree with you that Paragraph 2 would have a bearing on the overnight stops on a driveway type scheme if the visitor were merely a fellow club member.

 

[Puddleduck]

We LIVED in our 32ft R-V for almost 2 Years, whilst doing a "Self build". In that time I had so many "officials" on the land for one purpose or another, NOT ONE was interested in where we lived, despite the fact that many where invited "indoors" for tea and Biccies by SWMBO!!. That included the "nice man" who came to sign off the Property for the (then) "poll tax"!. Ditto, when we moved to the current House we lived in the R-V for over 9 months whilst I gutted it and refurbed the interior!. At one point the ONLY toilet facilities where in the R-V!. It regularly got used by the Grandson(s) who regarded it as Their "Den"! and slept, bathed (but not cooked, `cos Granny is too good at that!!) Watched T-V, (And the older 2 Teens I suspect watched one or two, How does one put it? "Dodgy" DVD`s!) Played X-Box in it. and (tried hard to) keep Granddaughter out!!.

Pete

We self built as well. Officially you do need planning permission for the use of a motorhome / caravan etc as human habitation on the land whist you are building. We didn't live on site but the planning officer did say that unless someone objected he would not investigate a site office placed there on a temporary basis. Nods and winks I assume.

 

[ambulancekidd]

We had a local covenant enforced when w lived in Peterborough where we were served a notice requiring us to remove some shrubs from the front garden (definitely our land) by the local council. Only time this has ever happened to us though and we have been about a bit.

Well my gob is well & truly smacked. I've never heard of one being enforced in my area but I suppose it doesn't pay to fly in the face of the authorities lol.

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[chaser]

Only whizzed through this thread, but how does this compare to wild camping, wouldn't have thought there was any difference.
If it was left to me , I would never of thought of asking the question .

 

[PeteH]

We self built as well. Officially you do need planning permission for the use of a motorhome / caravan etc as human habitation on the land whist you are building. We didn't live on site but the planning officer did say that unless someone objected he would not investigate a site office placed there on a temporary basis. Nods and winks I assume.

I would say that, you are likely right. Just that It never occurred to anyone to query it!.
To be fair we also went off to Spain in winter for a few weeks when we got "Fed up".

I think what gets to me on all these (type of) subjects is WHY?. If no one is getting hurt, what`s the problem?. I mean, At least I am not occupying, someone else's Field, and when moved on Leaving behind so much Cr&&p it cost a fortune to remove and the field is unusable for (real) animals (once the "animals") have left.

Pete