Auto-Trail Switching from Underslung LPG to Bottles (1 Viewer)

[ianthelawyer]

I have a new Expedition 67 on order from Auto-Trail. However, dealership has just been notified that due to a shortage of underslung LPG tanks they are fitting a gas locker for two 4.5kg bottles (butane) instead. Dealer says that space in locker would not be enough for a Gaslow system (34cm). Any suggestions anyone as intend to travel to Europe and therefore Calor not going to work and will be expensive?

 

[Jim]

Basically anyone who buys one of these with teeny weeny replacement bottles instead of an underslung tank is being taken for a mug.

The way forecourt LPG is fast disappearing AT are probably doing them a favour buy pushing them back to bottles.

 

[Langtoftlad]

The way forecourt LPG is fast disappearing AT are probably doing them a favour buy pushing them back to bottles.

3.9kg bottles... I don't think so.
I disagree LPG is disappearing...

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[Jim]

3.9kg bottles... I don't think so.

Yes those bottles are far too small.

However, where we are headed with LPG I think anyone who fits an underslung tank and doesn't leave a setup for an internal bottle is making a mistake.

 

[Langtoftlad]

Yes those bottles are far too small.

However, where we are headed with LPG I think anyone who fits an underslung tank and doesn't leave a setup for an internal bottle is making a mistake.

I think it's been mentioned that if supplies really do dry up, you can use an external cylinder.
This would be far preferable IMO, to losing storage space permanently, having small bottles, just in case you can't fill up.
If there's a demand, there'll be a supplier.
I'd much rather have the option of bulk fill, then resort to bottles if necessary

 

[Lenny HB]

The way forecourt LPG is fast disappearing AT are probably doing them a favour buy pushing them back to bottles.

No sign of it disappearing in the South East and more & more gas stations have LPG pumps in Spain.

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[Jim]

If there's a demand, there'll be a supplier.

A few thousand motorhomes spread all over the UK is not a demand. Shell axed their tanks because of a lack of demand.

There will always be places to fill up, but they are thinner and thinner on the ground.

 

[Dave46049]

I was trying to work out how big a deal this is for me.
2 x 3.9kg bottles is 7.8kg or 15.2l
That should give me 108kwh.

Which would give me 24 hours continual heating and hot water ( the whale is 4.5kwh )
That doesn't factor in cooking or the fridge ( but I would guess the fridge is minimal.

That should give me about 2/3 days wild camping possibly more in the summer - which is all I'm after at the moment.

Yes the underslung tank would give me 25l so a few more days at most.

Ok so it’s not as good – but the nearest van that has the underslung as standard is still about £10k more, so in terms of "cancel and go somewhere else" I don't think thats viable.

And I can always get the underslung retro-fitted if I want to at a later date.

 

[kazlog]

We are actually in a worse predicament. Our van has arrived and is with the dealer being fitted with awning, sat nav, rear parking and tv and went down today for a wee look. We were thrilled with it. However this evening we noticed from a pic of me standing in the van that something had changed with the under bunk storage left hand side. We were so looking forward to the underslung gas purely because there would be a level visible in the van of where we are with our gas. This is terrible that such a big change can be made. Storage lost, gas capacity dramatically reduced in a van that runs heat, water, cooking and fridge off gas. We didn’t notice today and have ordered all the extras to be fitted.

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[Machbuster]

Sounds like a major change, which has not been approved by you. They should comply with what you had bought otherwise some compensation should be provided. Unfortunately some dealers believe they can treat customers as pure money providers.

 

[Basildog]

Sounds like a major change, which has not been approved by you. They should comply with what you had bought otherwise some compensation should be provided. Unfortunately some dealers believe they can treat customers as pure money providers.

I didn’t think the dealers got a lot of choice in this instance .
My understanding is that the manufacturers couldn’t get a sustainable supply of tanks so have had no other choice but to change their product .

 

[tonyidle]

I didn’t think the dealers got a lot of choice in this instance .
My understanding is that the manufacturers couldn’t get a sustainable supply of tanks so have had no other choice but to change their product .

As always your contract is with the seller not the manufacturer. That would be enough for me to cancel.

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[Stonemags76]

I would also cancel, as the size of gas bottles makes it almost unusable, to say nothing of the difficulty in Europe, & the loss of storage space. It’s made it a van that most would not consider. If underslung tanks are not available, the customer should be asked if they want to cancel, not just have the change thrust upon them! I feel for all those who are being messed about like this.

 

[Basildog]

As always your contract is with the seller not the manufacturer. That would be enough for me to cancel.

I would probably cancel too but the chances of getting any other vans at short notice now are pretty slim .
At the moment most suppliers are putting prices up almost monthly so I hate to think what a new van will cost next year

 

[bigwood]

We had two 3.9 bottles in our first PVC. Off grid in the winter using gas for heating and the fridge seemed to deplete the bottles quickly.
If it has to be bottles rather than tank it should be a minimum of two 6 kg bottles in my opinion.

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[tonyidle]

I would probably cancel too but the chances of getting any other vans at short notice now are pretty slim .
At the moment most suppliers are putting prices up almost monthly so I hate to think what a new van will cost next year

You might be correct but I'd still cancel. I can't stand being shafted. I have admit though I've never bought new. I tend to decide how much I have to spend then try to get the most for my money. That invariably means 2 or 3 years old when all the hassle is long gone.

 

[Bill Cullen]

I have a new Expedition 67 on order from Auto-Trail. However, dealership has just been notified that due to a shortage of underslung LPG tanks they are fitting a gas locker for two 4.5kg bottles (butane) instead. Dealer says that space in locker would not be enough for a Gaslow system (34cm). Any suggestions anyone as intend to travel to Europe and therefore Calor not going to work and will be expensive?

There might be another disappointment for you (and for me because I'm in a similar position as you). As well as no underslung tank I have a feeling that we will be asked to pay the 2022 price which is about 4.5% more than the 2021 price. I hope not.
I ordered in March and the latest news from the dealer is that deivery date will be middle of October.
I'm reconciled to having an underslung tank fitted later.

 

[skyetripper]

There might be another disappointment for you (and for me because I'm in a similar position as you). As well as no underslung tank I have a feeling that we will be asked to pay the 2022 price which is about 4.5% more than the 2021 price. I hope not.
I ordered in March and the latest news from the dealer is that deivery date will be middle of October.
I'm reconciled to having an underslung tank fitted later.

I’m pretty sure the base price for the van will be as ordered. We ordered ours in January and it is finally (hopefully) being collected in October. I rang the dealer to discuss the change in the lpg storage. After some apologies for not informing us of the change, and some haggling over costs of extras versus discount for change to gas bottles, the balance that remains is still based on the 2021 list price.

I’m not sure they can legally increase the basic price despite the late delivery and spec change.

Just as an aside and to add to the confusion, our van is a 2021 model, but will be in expedition grey (the 2022 standard colour) rather than the default 2021 model colour of black… Apparently there weren’t any black base vans left when we ordered.

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[ianthelawyer]

There might be another disappointment for you (and for me because I'm in a similar position as you). As well as no underslung tank I have a feeling that we will be asked to pay the 2022 price which is about 4.5% more than the 2021 price. I hope not.
I ordered in March and the latest news from the dealer is that deivery date will be middle of October.
I'm reconciled to having an underslung tank fitted later

Let's hope there's no price increase - as that would be a further breach. We too are looking at mid October. Good luck.

 

[ianthelawyer]

I’m pretty sure the base price for the van will be as ordered. We ordered ours in January and it is finally (hopefully) being collected in October. I rang the dealer to discuss the change in the lpg storage. After some apologies for not informing us of the change, and some haggling over costs of extras versus discount for change to gas bottles, the balance that remains is still based on the 2021 list price.

I’m not sure they can legally increase the basic price despite the late delivery and spec change.

Just as an aside and to add to the confusion, our van is a 2021 model, but will be in expedition grey (the 2022 standard colour) rather than the default 2021 model colour of black… Apparently there weren’t any black base vans left when we ordered.

Ours too is grey and we knew this back at the beginning of December when we ordered it. Let's hope we have a nice autumn!

 

[pandas]

A few thousand motorhomes spread all over the UK is not a demand. Shell axed their tanks because of a lack of demand.

There will always be places to fill up, but they are thinner and thinner on the ground.

The Motorhome filling up with LPG at a Shell garage in Fontwell Near Chichester and going up in flames a couple of years ago may have been another factor.

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[Bill Cullen]

Re the above.
The latest from my dealer is that the global shortage of microchips has seriously affected the production of semicinductors and I have read on the net that one factory that assembles the Ducato chassis has shut down production and laid off staff some of whom wont be re-recruited if and when things are back to normal. Someone I know who placed their order for an Expedition 67 just after me has been told by Autotrail to expect the vehicle in February rather than November.

 

[Blue Knight]

Someone I know who placed their order for an Expedition 67 just after me has been told by Autotrail to expect the vehicle in February rather than November.

The situation is getting worse so the likes of a February delivery time could move to the right by a few months yet.

 

[skyetripper]

Just to update, we now have a date to collect our Expedition 67 on 3rd November. So all being well, that will be 9 months since ordering. Not as bad as some are quoting but a lot longer than expected.

Just waiting now to see how much of the original spec has changed due to parts chain supply problems….

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[ianthelawyer]

We have a delivery date of 25 November, 356 days after ordering. Apart from the underslung tank missing nothing else has been mentioned. We should have it just in time to winterise it!

 

[skyetripper]

Yes, wondering about winterising myself. First van so not really sure what’s involved

 

[Molly A]

It sounds like the gas locker size won't be fit for purpose. Really does need to be able to accommodate proper sized bottles rather than piddly little things.

But, if there is to be a gas locker, is there actually space in the PVC for that without taking up too much storage. After all with the Expedition they were supposed to be an underslung gas tank, and even the chassis mounted whale heater "creating valuable storage and living space" according to the Autotrail blurb. A gas locker defeats the benefits.

On the other side, LPG Autogas refills may still be common in parts of Europe. We have many threads on MHF moaning of the increased difficulty finding garages and working pumps in parts of the UK. Although with the rise of outdoor pursuits, obtaining bottled gas has also been a challenge from some suppliers, and it is vastly more costly, bottled gas may also be the future for the UK camper.

Autogas freely available throughout France, Italy and Greece , where we mainly travel. Have noticed that the price has risen a fair amount in Greece compared to last year, but still much more economical than camping gas.

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[Molly A]

I actually own Autogas 2000 , there is a massive shortage of most products at the moment and no amount of jumping up and down at dealers or manufacturers is going to change the shortage of raw materials needed for production of cylinders etc .
We are just about managing to keep stocks up but massive price increases on everything is making things pretty difficult for everyone .

What is causing the price increases?

 

[Basildog]

What is causing the price increases?

A perfect storm really !
Rising Global commodity prices, increased transportation costs, shortage of raw materials, increasing labour costs .
We have just been informed of another LPG tank price increase .
Our metal fabricator for our bracketry / metal supply now only hold quotations open for 1 working day !

 

[Molly A]

A perfect storm really !
Rising Global commodity prices, increased transportation costs, shortage of raw materials, increasing labour costs .
We have just been informed of another LPG tank price increase .
Our metal fabricator for our bracketry / metal supply now only hold quotations open for 1 working day !

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[Molly A]

Where are the tanks made?