Anyone know anything about this

Discussion in 'Motorhome Chat' started by Gonewiththewind, Dec 16, 2009.

  1. Gonewiththewind


    Sep 13, 2007
    Lifted this from another site and knowing what a well informed lot you are thought I would pass it by you.

    "Has any one heard?
    Or does anyone know
    Of the ruling from the National caravan council with regards to the testing of electrical equipment in your caravan or motor home

    There has been a briefing given out to service centers and affiliated workshops telling them that there will need to be a certificate of compliance of electrical safety issued to caravans and motor homes at the point of service

    This issue is rather confused at the moment with many of the service centers not knowing what and when this ruling will come into force

    But there have been reports of a few sites on the south coast refusing to allow people to use the EHU's unless they have the certificate

    I have today asked for clarification of this issue via E Mail from the NCC
    I did offer to go and visit their offices and speak to someone (They are based in Aldershot 1/2 a mile form my house)
    But this was not accepted due to the fact that there was no one from the technical or publicity departments available

    This issue needs to be highlighted to all caravaners and motor homers
    Just in case they find out the site they have booked and paid for will not let them use the site electrics and thus ruin their holidays

    I believe that the NCC have proposed these measures but some sites have rather jumped the gun by invoking the ban for units with out a certificates a tad too soon

    I have looked on the Health and Safety web site and I cannot find any law or directive concerned with testing of electrical equipment in a private touring unit
    And if the H and S department does not think there is a risk then Who do the NCC think they are to try and impose this rule on the rest of us

    I do believe that safety is a vitally important issue but I object to being forced to pay someone to do what I do IE press the trip button on the rcd to ensure that it switches off and do a visual inspection of the wiring

    Is there any one on this forum from the caravan industry or a service workshop that can maybe shed some light on this issue? "
  2. Fatalhud


    Nov 26, 2009
    Does this mean service centres will have to employ qualified electricians

    Alan H
  3. ourcampersbeentrashed

    ourcampersbeentrashed Funster

    Apr 19, 2008
    East London
    As the NCC is a "trade association" I cannot see what powers they have to propose such measures nationwide
  4. Geo

    Geo Trader - Funster

    Jul 29, 2007
    Quote--"I do believe that safety is a vitally important issue but I object to being forced to pay someone to do what I do IE press the trip button on the rcd to ensure that it switches off and do a visual inspection of the wiring"

    I can tell you that my eldest son has currently set up and invested the time and money reqd to carry out such testing and certification I can assure you the testing is far more involved than just pressing the trip button
    The whole electrical instalation will have to comply fully and pass thorough tests or no Certificate
    It may be carried out here at my garage or a mobile service can be arranged
    obviously travelling and mileage will be chargeable
    We too are awaiting the full details
    Last edited: Dec 16, 2009
  5. Simannjo


    Apr 18, 2009
    Hi all, Merry Christmas!

    There are several statutory considerations with regard use of electrical installations -

    Electrical Safety, Quality and Continuity Regulations 2002

    The Building Regulations 2000

    The Electricity at Work Act 1989

    Conditions of licence under The Local Government (Miscellaneous provisions Act 1982)

    As well as The Health and Safety at Work Act and indeed others.

    And NON Statutory considerations –

    Requirements for Electrical Installations IEE Wiring Regulations 17th Edition (2008).

    From a caravan parks perspective, they would have to consider statutory requirements as we all do and there is probably an insurance consideration.
    As they supply electricity from a licensed building where people work along side members of the public it’s not difficult to see where the requirements are that the park would have to meet the ‘wiring regs’ standards.

    Part of these standards cover caravans, motor caravans and caravan parks specifically in sections 708 and 721 of Part 7 (Special Installations or Locations).
    The caravan park has a duty of care to ensure your installation does not electrocute me as a passer by, and it can ‘reasonably’ do this if your installation has been certificated. The same certificate could be used to prove to your insurers the safe condition of the installation at the time your fridge burns down the unit!

    I’m sure everyone’s seen the attached sticker in their (UK made) caravan at some stage?
    This is the example the wiring regs give and it was just copied by the caravan manufacturers and installed as a requirement of an electrical installation in a caravan.

    The service centres will not have the capacity or know-how to properly inspect an electrical installation to the degree required by the wiring regs. The requirements talk of a ‘suitably competent person’ and the electrical industry accepts this as being someone experienced AND qualified to C&G 2391 – Inspection and Testing of Electrical Installations. A significant number of fully qualified electricians (I'd estimate 70%) do not have this qualification or its newer equivalent, so it’ll be interesting to see how the caravanning industry copes.

    As usual it’ll probably be by waiting for you turn up on site and them asking for the certificate you know nothing about…:thumb:

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Dec 17, 2009
  6. camper69


    Nov 22, 2007
    North Bucks
    Surely not. They need to get some of the wiring at campsites up to scratch first. Cannot believe some of the standards I have come across on CS sites.

    Are they going to have one standard for all caravans and motorhomes. What about those that were built 20 years ago ?

    More regulation for the sake of it.

  7. hilldweller

    hilldweller Funster Life Member

    Dec 5, 2008
    Valuable safety idea or just jobs for the boys and more of our passion for regulations.

    What about vans from abroad ?

    Isn't the NCC the bunch of idiots who make Brit MH wiring the laughing stock of EU with it's
    no power when moving wiring ?
  8. Jim

    Jim Ringleader

    Jul 19, 2007
    Sutton on Sea
    elf and safety at it again. :RollEyes:

    That said, I belong to a news clipping service, I give them key words or phrases and they scour the worlds press looking for that word or term in the news, Once a day I get an email with links to all the news. One word I search for is "Motorhome" and it appears in the news everyday, normally accompanied by the word "Fire"

    Mostly these news reports are from the US but the are plenty from Europe as well. Motorhomes and caravans are always going up in flames and electricity problems are, often the cause. It's not just an insurance claim, many people die in these accidents.

    I hate regulations so whether I would make them compulsory is another matter, but I would encourage everyone to get a check once a year. Annual gas and electricity checks make sense.:thumb:
  9. Johns_Cross_Motorhomes

    Johns_Cross_Motorhomes Trader - Motorhome & Accessory Sales

    Jan 5, 2008
    East Sussex 01-580-881288
    It is part of the conditions of being a NCC aproved workshop facility but not a legal requirement as of yet.......................

    (It is a standard part of our habitation service to check the seviceability of all electrical appiances (current drain, operation etc) although we do not issue a Cerificate.
    Our lads regularly attend training courses, )

  10. andyman

    andyman Funster

    Sep 23, 2007
    Was'nt there something about this in the last Caravan Club mag.

  11. pappajohn

    pappajohn Funster Life Member

    Aug 26, 2007
    YO11 2BD
    has anyone pointed this out to 'The Dirty Duck' at Grantham.....

    they'll have to get their own house in order first. :roflmto:
  12. Frankia


    Sep 24, 2007
    Sure there are more than enough caravan and motorhome fires but I would suspect most of 'em are caused by 12 volt system faults than with 230v.

    For many years motorhomes / caravans were designed and built by people who didn't have an auto electrician any where near the place but at least had the 240v side signed off by a qualified sparks.

    Some of the 12v wiring I have seen in vehicles built by both small and volume producers have given me the shivers. And if you want to get a fire going 12v rather than 230v is the way to go as most of the gear connected to it is operating at much higher amperage so more likely to cause overheated wiring and or sparks.

    12v may not electrocute someone who is not directly connected to your 'van but the fire that it could cause could directly affect a lot of it's neighbours.
  13. Jaws

    Jaws Funster Life Member

    Sep 26, 2008
    The words 'stick it where the sun does not shine' spring to mind.

    Sick and tired of being told what is good for me and what aint.
    Not blowing my own trumpet ( much ! LOL !) but I am more qualified than 99% of the duffnuts that work on our vans, yet because I will not pay these people money I cannot ( according to them ! ) work on a van.

    Every govt in the UK for the past 300 years has poked its nose into every niche it can.. Nowadays you have all these pathetic poo for brain, do gooding ,tree hugging, grab a buck from the muppet public organisations that THINK they too can tell folk what to do..

    jeez !! This rubbish makes me SO ruddy angry !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
  14. scotjimland

    scotjimland Funster Life Member

    Jul 25, 2007
    Suffolk Coastal
    From the Caravan Club

    extract from:Mains Electrical Installations.
    if you want to read, the full pdf
  15. robinmclaren


    Feb 23, 2009
    coventry , warwickshire

    when the electrical regs changed to the 17th edition section 721 included electrical installations in caravans and motorcaravans
    and although not stat regs the same as they are not stat regs for houses it is a requirement for periodic inspection at defined length of time or change of owner , the final say as always will be the insurance company if there is a claim
    not quite sure which periodic form to fill out for these but will check into it

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