Air pressure for tube in tyre? (1 Viewer)

[Badboo]

So this may be a dumb question but I want to ensure that I'm doing the right thing...
We had to put a tube into one the tyres on the MH. Does this change the air pressure that you would maintain in the tyre

 

[Lenny HB]

I don't belive it is advisable to fit tubes in tubless tyres. @Brian and Jo should be able to advise.

 

[Badboo]

I don't belive it is advisable to fit tubes in tubless tyres. @Brian and Jo should be able to advise.

Oh....That was recommended by the tyre workshop as the best long term solution..

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[tonyidle]

It isn't recommended because of increased heat build-up and the fact the modern tubeless tyres are a bit rough inside. However I've done it on a car without problems. If you choose to put a tube in the pressure is the same as when tubeless.

 

[pappajohn]

Oh....That was recommended by the tyre workshop as the best long term solution..

I certainly wouldn't be going back there then. They are putting your safety at risk.
Tubeless tyres are not suitable for tubes on road going vehicles.
Too much frictional heat is produced between tube and inside of the tyre as radial tyres have small diagonal rubber ribs whereas old tubes tyres were smooth.
Chances are, when it does fail it will be with a bang, not a slow deflation.

 

[Richard n Ann]

Would the tube even inflate properly inside an air tight tyre? I suppose the tyre air would escape slowly round the valve neck.

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[tacr2man]

Sorry totally wrong , the only thing you need to do is buff off the inspection QC stickers inside the tyre , it is not sufficient to just peel them off , the reason is the glue causes the tube to perish and leads to a leak , which can end in the tyre being destroyed due to run flat.
The air inside the casing will leak to atmosphere when tube is inflated , also the fitter if he knows his job will inflate in stages to ensure that the tube seats correctly and does not trap any air pockets , and end up creasing , another cause of premature failure .
The air pressure should be rechecked as normal after fitting a tube , or any tyre come to that . A tubed tyre will be more likely to run warmer than a tubeless tyre , but not sufficiently to cause a problem , as long as it is inflated to the correct pressure to suit the load . Certain tyres are not suitable to have tubes fitted as this may
affect their compliance with speed rating . But this is the same reason that a tyre of that range may not be repaired .
Fitting a tube will allow a tyre to have pressure dropped to a lower level for flotation in soft terrain as long as speed is kept very low .
The above is based on operating a tyre dealership in Australia for 15 years , and being a Govt approved supplier for Police pursuit cars.

 

[Brian and Jo]

Tubes in tyres on modern road going vehicles beit motorhomes cars or motorcycles is a big no no . If you get a nail,screw,or other such like object in a T/L tyres it will usually deflate slowly ,if a tube was fitted then almost certainly the deflation would be instant.Also the design of the inside of a T/L tyre would rub on the inner tube and also cause deflation.It frightens me that a tyre dealer would even suggest fitting a tube let alone actually do it If there is a nail or screw in a tyre then as long as it is far enough away from the shoulder of the tyre then it can be plugged from the inside with a mushroom plug.If the object is not in a position to plug then it can still be repaired with what we call a major repair which is a form of vulcanising done under heat in an autoclave.If it is not possible to carry out either of those procedures then the tyre must be rendered not fit for service and a new tyre fitted.Under no circumstances should a tube be fitted.The Department for Transport are trying to get it made law that the fitting of tubes to road going tyres should be made illegal.I don’t think it will be too long before that is made law.
Brian & Jo

 

[Badboo]

If there is a nail or screw in a tyre then as long as it is far enough away from the shoulder of the tyre then it can be plugged from the inside with a mushroom plug.If the object is not in a position to plug then it can still be repaired with what we call a major repair which is a form of vulcanising done under heat in an autoclave.

Thanks everyone for your responses!

The leak ended up being identified as being in the rim close to the valve. They considered getting a welder to repair the rim but thought that the tube was a better option. The reason that I posted the question was the concern of something going wrong when we were out somewhere remote.

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[tacr2man]

Tubes in tyres on modern road going vehicles beit motorhomes cars or motorcycles is a big no no . If you get a nail,screw,or other such like object in a T/L tyres it will usually deflate slowly ,if a tube was fitted then almost certainly the deflation would be instant.Also the design of the inside of a T/L tyre would rub on the inner tube and also cause deflation.It frightens me that a tyre dealer would even suggest fitting a tube let alone actually do it If there is a nail or screw in a tyre then as long as it is far enough away from the shoulder of the tyre then it can be plugged from the inside with a mushroom plug.If the object is not in a position to plug then it can still be repaired with what we call a major repair which is a form of vulcanising done under heat in an autoclave.If it is not possible to carry out either of those procedures then the tyre must be rendered not fit for service and a new tyre fitted.Under no circumstances should a tube be fitted.The DOT are trying to get it made law that the fitting of tubes to road going tyres should be made illegal.I don’t think it will be too long before that is made law.
Brian & Jo

What has the USA law intentions to do with what is going on in UK ?
I stand by what I have posted , if you wish to disagree thats up to you . With regard to sudden deflation's its just a matter of scale
tubed or tubeless . Tubeless tyres have been fitted to cars since about 1955 , and millions have had tubes fitted in them I havent noticed a world epidemic of catastrophic deflations . I would suggest that Australia must rank as one of if not the most harsh environment for tyres anywhere in the world , and it was common practice out there , I have run tubed tubeless tyres on 4wd vehicles for years , and also done the same when needed with a taxi fleet in UK . Nobody died or was even scratched . Thats my opinion

 

[Brian and Jo]

What has the USA law intentions to do with what is going on in UK ?
I stand by what I have posted , if you wish to disagree thats up to you . With regard to sudden deflation's its just a matter of scale
tubed or tubeless . Tubeless tyres have been fitted to cars since about 1955 , and millions have had tubes fitted in them I havent noticed a world epidemic of catastrophic deflations . I would suggest that Australia must rank as one of if not the most harsh environment for tyres anywhere in the world , and it was common practice out there , I have run tubed tubeless tyres on 4wd vehicles for years , and also done the same when needed with a taxi fleet in UK . Nobody died or was even scratched . Thats my opinion

What are you going on about ,I’m not quoting anything to do with your post ,I never mentioned anything about the USA,I’m just stating facts,someone asked me last week why I don’t get involved with the tyre threads ,my god is it any wonder,that’s me finished I have enough agro at work without getting it on here as well.
Brian & Jo

 

[tacr2man]

I wasn't wishing to cause you aggravation I was just responding to what I perceived as a direct contradiction of what I had posted , seeing as it was directly below it . The USA was in view you posted
DOT (Department of transport USA entity) maybe you meant DFT
so just a typo Apologies if I have misunderstood and caused you any distress, as you are as I posted fully entitled to your opinion just as I am .

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[Badboo]

OK....I really didn't want to cause an argument! tacr2man it sounds like you've had a lot of experience with this as does Brian and Jo. We on the other hand do not and our understanding of this issue is probably not what it should be since we're driving around Europe in a motorhome, a lot of the time out I the middle of no where.
Would having a welder repair the hole in the rime be considered a better option?

 

[Boringfrog]

Steel or aluminum?

 

[tacr2man]

AFAIK there are no regulations governing such welding (i take you mean aluminium) in UK ,there are in some other countries ,eg Canada . But i think you would have great difficulty finding anyone who is suitably skilled , willing to do it for liability reasons , as it is technically far more difficult than doing same with steel wheel. However it does happen in UK and probably googling may find a specialist

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[Badboo]

Steel or aluminum?

Will have to confirm tomorrow.

 

[Badboo]

. However it does happen in UK and probably googling may find a specialist

We're in Portugal..

 

[tacr2man]

We're in Portugal..

http://www.brasefilho.com/unidade-recuperacao-jantes
they seem to have three outlets

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[Badboo]

Will have to confirm tomorrow.

There made of steel

 

[Jaws]

Weld it up.. No probs at all..

 

[daveandsan]

What are you going on about ,I’m not quoting anything to do with your post ,I never mentioned anything about the USA,I’m just stating facts,someone asked me last week why I don’t get involved with the tyre threads ,my god is it any wonder,that’s me finished I have enough agro at work without getting it on here as well.
Brian & Jo

Brian don’t take it to heart, if I was to take anyone’s advice on tyres it would be yours. Someone who owns a tyre fitting garage and knows what they are talking about.

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[pappajohn]

There made of steel

How do you get a HOLE in a steel rim.
The only thing I can think is a split after a previous, badly undertaken, kerb damage repair....or severe rust.
Either way, I'd replace the wheel.

 

[Badboo]

So this may be a dumb question but I want to ensure that I'm doing the right thing...
We had to put a tube into one the tyres on the MH. Does this change the air pressure that you would maintain in the tyre

Merry Christmas everybody!

As a follow up to my previous message I decided to have the tube removed and the steel rim repaired. The repair shop told me to return in a few hours. When I did they advised that in fact the rim wasn't damaged but that it was the valve which they had replaced.

All good.....not quite!

We took off two days ago for Spain. Along the way I checked the tire and it was a little deflated so I filled it up.

The next morning both the repaired tyre and its opposite on the rear were completely flat. Being Sunday in Spain, and Christmas Eve we thought that we were in trouble.. but we managed to inflate the tyre and found a Feu Vert that was open.

At the Feu Vert they advised that there was a leak in both steel rims. You could actually hear the air escaping. They filled both tyres with instant repair kits which has slowed the leak to the point that we just have to top up the tyres every 8-10 hours. Now we're sitting it out in the middle of Spain until everything opens tomorrow.

My question is (after a pretty long winded intro!) is it unusual to have a leak in two steel rims and what causes this type of problem? The MH is less than two years old, we've only done 30000k's and we definitely don't take it anywhere off road...

 

[tacr2man]

@Badboo Its very rare and i would be concerned that the rims are suffering fatigue from the load, or possibly a manufacturing defect . I have come across this before on a customers trailer that was triaxle and used 10inch mini wheels to give a low deck height .
two were leaking at the centre to rim weld , one was showing fatigue cracks at the stud holes. I would get them off and put in bath of water to see where the bubbles are coming from

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[jonandshell]

I had a van wheel crack at a weld where the dish meets the rim.
Resulted in a slow puncture which took Kwik Fit (fleet management choice, not mine!) four attempts and a new tyre to find.

 

[peterc10]

If less than 2 years old your moho should be under warranty. If it is a Fiat I suggest you phone Fiat European Assist. Phone number should be in your Fiat pack. I have always found them very helpful when contacting them.

 

[Badboo]

@Badboo Its very rare and i would be concerned that the rims are suffering fatigue from the load, or possibly a manufacturing defect . I have come across this before on a customers trailer that was triaxle and used 10inch mini wheels to give a low deck height .
two were leaking at the centre to rim weld , one was showing fatigue cracks at the stud holes. I would get them off and put in bath of water to see where the bubbles are coming from

You may be right. We went to a tyre workshop and they've told us (in Spanish via Google Translate!?!) that both the rear rims have failed due to weight and need to be replaced. Given that it's just us two and a dog this surprises me after twenty months of road driving.
Fiat have advised that there are no spares in Spain. They're looking for second hand replacements.

We asked about replacing all four with alluminiums but they said that they don't make them for motorhomes Can anyone recommend a good make of alluminiums for heavy vehicles?

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[Minxy]

@Badboo ... before you do anything else you need to get to a weighbridge and check your axle weights ... if you are overloaded changing the wheels isn't gonna solve the problem, you need to jettison some stuff first!

 

[Badboo]

@Badboo ... before you do anything else you need to get to a weighbridge and check your axle weights ... if you are overloaded changing the wheels isn't gonna solve the problem, you need to jettison some stuff first!

Point taken. But if we are overloaded than we have a problem. It's just two adults, a dog, some clothes and stuff for thfor kitchen...

 

[Minxy]

Point taken. But if we are overloaded than we have a problem. It's just two adults, a dog, some clothes and stuff for thfor kitchen...

That's not the only thing to take into account though, what kit is fitted to the MH can make a difference, how much water and fuel you carry etc ... the ONLY sure way to know is to weigh it in full trim including you both otherwise just fitting new wheels could be an expensive exercise if you end up having to replacement again in a year or so not to mention the safety aspect of them possibly failing at speed.

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