24v LED on 12v system? Possible? (1 Viewer)

rolandsaven

Free Member
Mar 19, 2018
22
5
Funster No
52,904
I have a 12v system in my motorhome and planning on installing 24v LED strips, however, I'm unsure whether I would need an isolated or a non-isolated boost converter.

I'll be using roughly 5 meters of LED (24W per meter).

I would go for a non-isolated converter as this is not a critical application and we're only talking about direct current. However, I'd like somebody to confirm my thinking.

So my questions.

  1. Isolated or Non-Isolated 12v to 24v Boost Converter? (Victron Orion)
  2. I might add a PWM Dimmer in the 24v circuit. Does that change anything?
  3. I do have 230V AC in my motorhome (from an inverter). Would it be a better choice of using a simple LED Driver that converts AC to DC?
Thank you in advance
 

eddie

LIFE MEMBER
Oct 4, 2007
8,104
40,884
Taunton Somerset
Funster No
540
MH
RV
Exp
since 1989
Cheapest would be to buy some 12 volt LED strips? both financially and from a power efficiency point of view.

Loads available for not a lot of money on line(y)
 

tonka

LIFE MEMBER
Jul 2, 2008
10,776
21,396
Cannock, Staffs
Funster No
3,141
MH
A class Burstner 800
Exp
Since 2000
WHY ???
Just buy 12v LED strip it's not expensive.

Any other way not only adds to the cost and complication but also increases the power consumption. (y)

Subscribers  do not see these advertisements

 
Mar 23, 2012
9,427
31,454
sleights
Funster No
20,245
MH
c class
Exp
1
I'm just thinking why 24v too there must be a reason what is it? and why do you need 120w of led light about the same as 800w of old fashioned light bulbs are you taking on Blackpool as an attraction!!!!
 

eddie

LIFE MEMBER
Oct 4, 2007
8,104
40,884
Taunton Somerset
Funster No
540
MH
RV
Exp
since 1989
I'm just thinking why 24v too there must be a reason what is it? and why do you need 120w of led light about the same as 800w of old fashioned light bulbs are you taking on Blackpool as an attraction!!!!
I though the same, then thought that perhaps the OP had "acquired" them and wanted to try to use them.
 
OP
OP
rolandsaven

rolandsaven

Free Member
Mar 19, 2018
22
5
Funster No
52,904
I'd like to use a led strip that is "no-spotting" or "seamless". So that there are no "black spots" when I look at it. There is not much distance between the LED and the actual plastic diffuser in the aluminum profile. (couple of mm) So an average LED strip reminds me of a Christmas tree... Therefore, I need something that comes with a very short distance between the LEDs and I'm guessing at least 240LEDs per meter. I could not find one that is 12V unfortunately.... Others ideas are welcomed.

Subscribers  do not see these advertisements

 
Mar 23, 2012
9,427
31,454
sleights
Funster No
20,245
MH
c class
Exp
1
I'd like to use a led strip that is "no-spotting" or "seamless". So that there are no "black spots" when I look at it. There is not much distance between the LED and the actual plastic diffuser in the aluminum profile. (couple of mm) So an average LED strip reminds me of a Christmas tree... Therefore, I need something that comes with a very short distance between the LEDs and I'm guessing at least 240LEDs per meter. I could not find one that is 12V unfortunately.... Others ideas are welcomed.
Is it dimmable if not you could need sunglasses all the time!!!
 
Sep 16, 2013
2,217
7,874
Horncastle, UK
Funster No
28,132
MH
Van Conversion
Exp
Since 2006
I'd use something simple like this:


It will take the varying voltage from your van and output a steady voltage you've set. I used one to power a 19.5v monitor for 5 years.

The one linked is a 2A max model, but larger ones are available.
 
OP
OP
rolandsaven

rolandsaven

Free Member
Mar 19, 2018
22
5
Funster No
52,904
Is it dimmable if not you could need sunglasses all the time!!!
I know it'll be bright but do you think it will be that bright? It is sooo difficult to choose such thing from the web...

Subscribers  do not see these advertisements

 
OP
OP
rolandsaven

rolandsaven

Free Member
Mar 19, 2018
22
5
Funster No
52,904
Have a look at what these guys have got to offer. looking at the LED spacing on there images of the LED strips I would think it is not physically possible to fit 240 LED's per metre.

https://www.ledkia.com/uk/24-buy-led-strips

Thanks for the site, I'll look at their products.

Well, there are not many around for sure. This is the one that I was looking at. (see link below) It is pretty much spotless but it might be too much as you guys are saying. Can't decide though...
 
OP
OP
rolandsaven

rolandsaven

Free Member
Mar 19, 2018
22
5
Funster No
52,904
No problem. Cheapest non isolated one that fits the bill.

I'd use something simple like this:


It will take the varying voltage from your van and output a steady voltage you've set. I used one to power a 19.5v monitor for 5 years.

The one linked is a 2A max model, but larger ones are available.

Thanks, that is great to hear that I don't have to go with the expensive ones. I was afraid that they might just blow up/overheat/catch fire. Definitely not something I'd like in the van.

Other than the Victron Orions, I was also looking at this model but I don't really know what case I would make for it. Something might better fit the purpose.

Also, do you think guys should I go stepping up 12v DC to 24 DC or stepping down 230v AC to 24v DC?

Subscribers  do not see these advertisements

 
Mar 23, 2012
9,427
31,454
sleights
Funster No
20,245
MH
c class
Exp
1
I know it'll be bright but do you think it will be that bright? It is sooo difficult to choose such thing from the web...
Im no lighting engineer but know a bit. As a general rule 10w of LED are equivalent to 100w of ordinary old fashioned bulbs so yours at 120w total will be the same as 12 100w bulbs in a motorhome!!!!!. I think each meter of the ones you are looking at are the equivalent of a 5' fluorescent like a lot of people used to have in their kitchen.
 
Sep 16, 2013
2,217
7,874
Horncastle, UK
Funster No
28,132
MH
Van Conversion
Exp
Since 2006
Agree with @hilldweller - looks ideal.

It has a variable input of 9v-20v and delivers 24v, plus rated at 10A.

I'd order that if looking to do the same.

Subscribers  do not see these advertisements

 

hilldweller

LIFE MEMBER
Dec 5, 2008
605
36,106
Macclesfield
Funster No
5,089
MH
Zilch Mk1
Exp
From Aug 2007
Agree with @hilldweller - looks ideal.

When I wrote " don't go 240V" I nearly added "unless your name is Wissel". Though even you probably stick to 12V for lighting.

Now Mr Wino has thrown a spanner in the works, so much light he will get a tan. Question is, are 24V dimmers readily available.

I have to say, going 24V is adding potential problems to a very simple system. 12V available easily, I doubt 24V are.

PS: I see that ToT has posted 24V dimmers, I stand corrected. They are very neat too.
 
Sep 16, 2013
2,217
7,874
Horncastle, UK
Funster No
28,132
MH
Van Conversion
Exp
Since 2006
When I wrote " don't go 240V" I nearly added "unless your name is Wissel". Though even you probably stick to 12V for lighting.

:) Yep, still 12v lighting and most other things.

240v is just the fridge, PC, monitors, Type C chargers, router, printer, Tassimo - actually quite a bit :)

It's really not as mad as it sounds. Think once more adopt LiFePO4 it will become more normal. Especially with full timers who use a lot of electrical gear for work etc.
 
Mar 23, 2012
9,427
31,454
sleights
Funster No
20,245
MH
c class
Exp
1
When I wrote " don't go 240V" I nearly added "unless your name is Wissel". Though even you probably stick to 12V for lighting.

Now Mr Wino has thrown a spanner in the works, so much light he will get a tan. Question is, are 24V dimmers readily available.

I have to say, going 24V is adding potential problems to a very simple system. 12V available easily, I doubt 24V are.

PS: I see that ToT has posted 24V dimmers, I stand corrected. They are very neat too.
First thing to do is check the 24 strip is dimmable (I think some are only on or off) then I would just phone aten to get an idea of what total wattage of LED's are advisable in a m/h of your size I think it would be daft to fit them if they are constantly going to be dimmed right down or how this would affect the life of them and the dimmer/the power used/any risk of overheating/the cable size needed at 12v to the converter etc. I recon I must sound a right eyore but when I do a project its sometimes useful to have any drawbacks considered at the start so good luck with it all.

David

Subscribers  do not see these advertisements

 
OP
OP
rolandsaven

rolandsaven

Free Member
Mar 19, 2018
22
5
Funster No
52,904
That looks "proper job" and easy to mount.

No way do you want to start at 240V, you don't have 240V a lot of the time. You certainly don't want to be running an inverter continuously for lighting.
True on that.
 
OP
OP
rolandsaven

rolandsaven

Free Member
Mar 19, 2018
22
5
Funster No
52,904
:) Yep, still 12v lighting and most other things.

240v is just the fridge, PC, monitors, Type C chargers, router, printer, Tassimo - actually quite a bit :)

It's really not as mad as it sounds. Think once more adopt LiFePO4 it will become more normal. Especially with full timers who use a lot of electrical gear for work etc.

I have similar system, spoken to @Wissel on another forum, but I do have a thread here about my system. I went with LiFePO4 too as I’m a full timer, it is definitely recommended.

Subscribers  do not see these advertisements

 

hilldweller

LIFE MEMBER
Dec 5, 2008
605
36,106
Macclesfield
Funster No
5,089
MH
Zilch Mk1
Exp
From Aug 2007
First thing to do is check the 24 strip is dimmable
David

Yes. Ironically it's the better ones with switch mode control that probably won't be. You can feed them 10-24V and the light will be constant but the current decreases as the voltage rises, which comes as a shock to see it for the first time. This mainly applies to the bog standard bulb replacement modules.
 
OP
OP
rolandsaven

rolandsaven

Free Member
Mar 19, 2018
22
5
Funster No
52,904
i find leds are best mounted facing away from your eyes so the light is reflected

The aluminium LED cases in mine are installed in the ceiling but I could only use ones that have roughly 8mm depth. So that is why I’m having a problem. It’s not directly facing towards my eyes but I could slightly see the spots and it’s pretty annoying. I was wondering if there is any diffuser material that I can put in between the LED strip and the plastic cover that would help and does not catch fire?
 
Aug 6, 2013
11,931
16,514
Kendal, Cumbria
Funster No
27,352
MH
Le-Voyageur RX958 Pl
Exp
since 1999
I'd like to use a led strip that is "no-spotting" or "seamless". So that there are no "black spots" when I look at it. There is not much distance between the LED and the actual plastic diffuser in the aluminum profile. (couple of mm) So an average LED strip reminds me of a Christmas tree... Therefore, I need something that comes with a very short distance between the LEDs and I'm guessing at least 240LEDs per meter. I could not find one that is 12V unfortunately.... Others ideas are welcomed.
How long is the strip you need?

Subscribers  do not see these advertisements

 

Join us or log in to post a reply.

To join in you must be a member of MotorhomeFun

Join MotorhomeFun

Join us, it quick and easy!

Log in

Already a member? Log in here.

Latest journal entries

Funsters who are viewing this thread

Back
Top