Calor gas charges extortionate? (1 Viewer)

[SandJ]

How can Calor justify their high price of a 6kg Propane gas bottle? It is £20.75 for 6kg yet only £27.25 for a 13kg if the majority of Motor-homers/caravaners used 6kg then would they be protesting about it? Or do you just accept it?

When you compare the Calor 6k lite which costs even more then

What about competitors? Let's have a look:

6kg Propane
Calor = £20.75 Broken Link Removed
Flogas =16.28 Link Removed
Gas cylinders uk = £16.00 http://gascylindersuk.co.uk/shop/index.php?search[keywords]=6kg&_a=category

There is no justification for this, is there? Your thoughts :thumb:

 

[mentaliss]

How can Calor justify their high price of a 6kg Propane gas bottle? It is £20.75 for 6kg yet only £27.25 for a 13kg if the majority of Motor-homers/caravaners used 6kg then would they be protesting about it? Or do you just accept it?

When you compare the Calor 6k lite which costs even more then

What about competitors? Let's have a look:

6kg Propane
Calor = £20.75 Broken Link Removed
Flogas =16.28 Link Removed
Gas cylinders uk = £16.00 http://gascylindersuk.co.uk/shop/index.php?search[keywords]=6kg&_a=category

There is no justification for this, is there? Your thoughts :thumb:

___________________________________________________________________


Forget Calor...go for refill , Gaslow, Gaslit, AutoGas,...Dont be held to Calor gas ransom:thumb:

 

[GJH]

When we had our previous van there was little we could do but put up with Calor as there was no there supplier near us. One of the first jobs we had done on the Burstner was Alugas installation.

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[scotjimland]

I recently bought a 15kg butane bottle for the BBQ, it is now £34.99 , about £1.16 lt .. so the bigger the bottle the lower the unit cost ..

Once upon a time Calor was a British company.. it's now owned by the Dutch .. so blame them..

Calor Gas Ltd is part of a global group of LPG companies owned by the Dutch company SHV Energy – the largest dedicated global LPG distributor.

SHV Energy employs 13,500 people, has a turnover of over €5 billion and provides LPG to tens of millions of customers in 27 countries. The group owns, or is a majority shareholder in, LPG companies throughout the world; in addition to Calor Gas, well known brand names include Primagaz in France and Liquigas in Italy.

SHV Energy is proud to lead the way in developing existing and new global markets for LPG through effective innovation, education and promotion.

 

[Daedalus]

Calor high prices

As has already been said - forget Calor, have a refillable system fitted, makes a lot of sense as can be topped up (almost) everywhere So I for one am not bothered what Calor wants to charge as I'd never go back to using Calor bottles.

Daedalus

 

[karl c]

Have a fixed tank on the RV so just have to top up when filling up at garage, last top up was £4.50 not hard job.

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[scotjimland]

In defense of Calor's prices you can buy a bottle in just about every corner of the UK..including the most far flung Scottish Islands.. and it will be the same price as the mainland .. places where you won't find Autogas or Flogas..

Distributing to all these remote areas must be very expensive.. Do Flogas service these remote areas or just stick to profitable outlets.. ?

An LPG bottle, irrespective of size, costs the same to fill (not including contents) , test and maintain.. so the smaller the bottle the higher the unit cost of the gas.

The question was does that justify Calor charging more than Flogas.. ?

If you are camping on Mull, run out of gas and there is only a Calor outlet.. no Flogas, do you pay or go cold..? You pay and are very grateful you can find a any gas at all.

The poll doesn't have a 'don't know' .. so can't vote.

 

[DavidG58]

tough call, answering against the flow, but Calor stand against their competition, great points put above already, the cost to collect, check cylinder, refill time, check valve, redeliver, allow profit for retailer, plus the cost of the gas, I actually do not see how they do it, before you even consider the remote locations

As for comparison to size, this really is the same across all commodities, I often wonder who buys the half size tins of Heinz baked beans for a couple of pennies less than a full size tin

and we all have a choice to move on to fixed tanks, the only real debates for / against fixed tanks I see on here are convenience first then payback, I guess the price of bottles is not that high yet or we would all have changed

 

[catspyjamas]

As 6kg lasts me for the best part of a year I am not too bothered by the prices

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[SandJ]

In defense of Calor's prices you can buy a bottle in just about every corner of the UK..including the most far flung Scottish Islands.. and it will be the same price as the mainland .. places where you won't find Autogas or Flogas..

Distributing to all these remote areas must be very expensive.. Do Flogas service these remote areas or just stick to profitable outlets.. ?

An LPG bottle, irrespective of size, costs the same to fill (not including contents) , test and maintain.. so the smaller the bottle the higher the unit cost of the gas.

The question was does that justify Calor charging more than Flogas.. ?

If you are camping on Mull, run out of gas and there is only a Calor outlet.. no Flogas, do you pay or go cold..? You pay and are very grateful you can find a any gas at all.

The poll doesn't have a 'don't know' .. so can't vote.

Jim you do raise some good points but if you compare being delivered to far away places then if postage costs to them places are higher then one could argue that would justify Calor charging more. I would presume many items cost more in them locations due to supply and demand. If there is one major supermarket there then would all prices be the same as a supermarket that had 3 other local supermarkets close by? You could say the same for fuel, is the fuel cost the same in a petrol station miles from anywhere as it is in a busy town? I am not saying it should be higher just the fact that if other things are higher then!


It costs the same to fill and deliver a small or a large bottle excluding gas cost is correct except for the extra weight effecting delivery cost, yes I know only a little for a delivery, but add many bottles and many deliveries and it does add up. So does that point justify Calor charging the more for a Calor lite? It costs the same to fill and it is cheaper to deliver but costs on average £2 more As Calor do not have the price for the lite then how do you know what you should be paying? It is nearly 50% lighter All others except large bottles are priced so why not lite?

Broken Link Removed


Thanks all for your comments so far, I am well aware of the self fill tanks or bottles it is related to costs for bottle empty for full exchange cost. I will when the time is right probably get self fill. :thumb:

 

[makems]

Calor aren't the biggest bandits around.
Consider the cost of a camping Gaz 907 cylinder refill. £30 at halfrauds, 80p in Morocco YES, EIGHTY PENCE!
Of course it's not Camping Gaz but it's butane in the same size, same colour cylinder. And you can get those cylinders in even the smallest village in the middle of the mountains or the middle of the desert at the same price.
You can buy the cylinder itself for £4 in Morocco versus £40 plus in the UK
So a new cylinder full of gas in UK £70 ish Morocco £4.80
Some difference!

 

[DuxDeluxe]

We'll it is a free market and people are at liberty to vote with their feet. Calor's pricing model must work as they are still in business and still distributing. Clearly they have considered their pricing , distribution and network against the competition and decided to go with what they have. If it was not the right model, then they would soon change it but it seems that they are doing OK with it. They are certainly aware of their relative pricing but either through apathy or lack of choice they are selling.

Same in my business - we have a global service and where the competition aren't strong we price accordingly, or with a fixed price global contract, the remote areas like Nakhodka and far flung Chinese ports are taken into account and that is reflected in the overall pricing.

There is plenty of competition out there - I use a fixed tank (previously had Gaslow) mainly for convenience and can fill up cheaply but will never get my money back on the investment.......

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[2657]

We'll it is a free market and people are at liberty to vote with their feet. Calor's pricing model must work as they are still in business and still distributing. Clearly they have considered their pricing , distribution and network against the competition and decided to go with what they have. If it was not the right model, then they would soon change it but it seems that they are doing OK with it. They are certainly aware of their relative pricing but either through apathy or lack of choice they are selling.

Same in my business - we have a global service and where the competition aren't strong we price accordingly, or with a fixed price global contract, the remote areas like Nakhodka and far flung Chinese ports are taken into account and that is reflected in the overall pricing.

[HI]There is plenty of competition out there - I use a fixed tank (previously had Gaslow) mainly for convenience and can fill up cheaply but will never get my money back on the investment.....[/HI]..

Good point......

Dual 11kg Gaslow system with auto changeover and euro adaptors almost £600 plus fitting.

Autogas around 70p/L

Calor 13kg/26.37L.....104p/L

Calor 6kg/12.17L......170p/L


So save 34p/l.......need to buy around 1765L/870kg to break even or 67 x 13 kg bottles.

The 6kg refillable seems to offer better value at around £140 so would break even after 12 bottles.

I know that there are other reasons for using these systems but the financial aspect does not add up for me especially as there are alternative , cheaper suppliers.

Depends very much on usage and possible bottle size of course.

My figures based on propane density of 0.493kg/L

Figures open to correction !!

 

[JJ]

Flog me... slag me off... take me off your Christmas card list... put me on your ignore list but...


I (or the attendant) fill my own Calor Lite bottle for around €9 a time at the local petrol station using an adaptor thingy...

I HATE Calor Gas and Camping Gas.


JJ :Cool:

 

[grumps147]

My primary reason for a change to Autogas was a weight reduction, its an added bonus that I now top up once a year for what I regard as a stupidly low sum. I was also fed up of the higher charges by Calor. I will never make my money back though.

I take Jims point seriously, its the same argument or Royal Mail pricing or BT telecoms, they have to go everywhere, and you can always seem to get Calor everywhere in the UK. Virgin would not come to us less than 100 meters off the main road where there main fibre is, even if I paid extra.

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[1_man_and_his_dob(lo)]

Calor aren't the biggest bandits around.
Consider the cost of a camping Gaz 907 cylinder refill. £30 at halfrauds, 80p in Morocco YES, EIGHTY PENCE!

I've got to replace my 907 this week :Sad:

 

[mentaliss]

Good point......

Dual 11kg Gaslow system with auto changeover and euro adaptors almost £600 plus fitting.

Autogas around 70p/L

Calor 13kg/26.37L.....104p/L

Calor 6kg/12.17L......170p/L


So save 34p/l.......need to buy around 1765L/870kg to break even or 67 x 13 kg bottles.

The 6kg refillable seems to offer better value at around £140 so would break even after 12 bottles.

I know that there are other reasons for using these systems but the financial aspect does not add up for me especially as there are alternative , cheaper suppliers.

Depends very much on usage and possible bottle size of course.

My figures based on propane density of 0.493kg/L

Figures open to correction !!

___________________________________________________
I fitted my GasLow R67 bottle system, (latest safety design) too meet the French new requirements of their safety standards for under £350 were touring in Spain right now..no sign of Calor Gas anywhere!!

 

[2657]

Just going off Gaslow's website and I appreciate that I did use the most expensive system as an example but you would still have to buy over a 1000 litres or aprox 40 bottles to break even.

I do not have any experience of gas usage when staying mostly off hookup but even 40 bottles seems a lot,presumably you have the system for convenience when touring abroad.

I obtained a Spanish bottle a few years ago and propane is currently around €17.50 for 11 kg or around 80c(67p)/L.

We stay on site and the last bottle has lasted over 12 months.

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[sedge]

It's all about what is convenient for you personally - if you want to stay off hook up for unlimited periods, mainly not in the UK, then refillable bottles make sense. If you are UK based whether on EHU or off, Calor is dead easy to get - so you probably wouldn't bother investing in the refillable kit.

What's Calor work out at per Kw/hr ? How does it compare to domestic Gas & Elec prices? (No idea if you can work that out)

 

[wingman]

Can you swap an empty 6kg Calor propane cylinder for a Flogas one then?
(I trust the fittings are the same screw type).

 

[scotjimland]

Can you swap an empty 6kg Calor propane cylinder for a Flogas one then?
(I trust the fittings are the same screw type).

no, you can't exchange Calor for Flogas or visa versa

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[TheBig1]

Can you swap an empty 6kg Calor propane cylinder for a Flogas one then?
(I trust the fittings are the same screw type).

the propane fitting is the same but calor charge a hefty deposit for their cylinders and will only exchange for one of their own. flogas used to be no deposit, not sure if they still are

 

[JockandRita]

The last time we paid for Calor propane refills, it was about £9/£10 for the 6kg, and £13/£14 for the 13kg.
Thankfully, when we bought our MH, we inherited a bulk gas system, which we fill/top up as and when. In my opinion Calor (in cahoots with Shell) are still the bandits, as their Autogas is always the dearest.

Esso and Jet (supplied by Flogas) are slightly cheaper, and filling at the Flogas depot (currently £0.64ppl) is cheaper again. The winners for us on price, (but restricted locations) is Countrywide Stores, as they are the only Autogas suppliers we've come across, to supply at the domestic VAT rate of 5%.

Calor refuse to on the grounds that "it is too much hassle, for the amount of Autogas we sell at our depots". Flogas did the domestic VAT rate until recently. Their excuse was, "we got into bother with HMRC over irregular recordings and monitoring of our VAT charges, so now everyone pays the Road Duty Rate of 20%". :Sad:

We are so glad that we are no longer reliant on Calor/Flogas cylinder refills.

Cheers,

Jock.

 

[2657]

It's all about what is convenient for you personally - if you want to stay off hook up for unlimited periods, mainly not in the UK, then refillable bottles make sense. If you are UK based whether on EHU or off, Calor is dead easy to get - so you probably wouldn't bother investing in the refillable kit.

[HI] What's Calor work out at per Kw/hr ? How does it compare to domestic Gas & Elec prices? (No idea if you can work that out)[/HI]

Probably but have had a drink now.......maybe tomorrow

Try and keep the dementia at bay

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[wingman]

Thanks for replies lads. (See 'can I swap' above). Is it worth buying a full Flogas cylinder and just storing my spare Calor? At the rates locally here, a refill would be 10 quid cheaper. I guess however that the cost of the cylinder on top wouldn't make it worth my while?

 

[TheBig1]

Thanks for replies lads. (See 'can I swap' above). Is it worth buying a full Flogas cylinder and just storing my spare Calor? At the rates locally here, a refill would be 10 quid cheaper. I guess however that the cost of the cylinder on top wouldn't make it worth my while?

absolutely...if your local supplier is that much cheaper, it would be kind of daft not to

if you use a lot of gas, a refillable system from gasit would make the price of gas far cheaper. just refill at any petrol station that does autogas. there are plenty, plus you dont have to wait till you run out before topping up. plus no more lifting heavy cylinders too. single bottle kits about £160 so good value

 

[aba]

Don't forget about the refill agreement charge that you have to enter to get a cylinder in the first place I think calor currently charge £35.00 for the privelige plus your £20 odd for the cylinder.

So your first 6kg calor bottle costs you around £55.00 then £20 per exchange.
Gaslow 6kg direct fill bottle is around £135.00 then around £9 per refill

Savings of around £11 per refill / exchange pays the additional £80 in under 8 refills.


The other thing that confuses me a little is why do we need 2 refillable bottles????
I can see the need for 2 calor bottles so you don't run out however If you are touring with a refillable one just top it up every couple of days or so as you pass filling stations so you don't run out.

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[wasp]

Thing is with Calor it`s national so you are paying for the brand first and gas second it`s like Worcester boilers they advertise on the telly very expensive but again it`s brand you pay for:thumb::thumb::thumb::thumb::thumb:

 

[Sidney]

Thing is with Calor it`s national so you are paying for the brand first and gas second it`s like Worcester boilers they advertise on the telly very expensive but again it`s brand you pay for:thumb::thumb::thumb::thumb::thumb:

Worcester boilers are owned by Bosch. My Worcester oil boiler is 98.4% efficient - my previous was 82% :Blush:

A better analogy is to compare Highland Spring with a supermarket mineral water.

When I bought my first MH it had two full Calor bottles in the locker. So I didn't pay the £70 hire for the two. This made it easier to stump up the cost of a refillable cylinder.

I choose a single 11kg to free up some space in the locker. I would have rather bought a chassis mounted LPG tank than two 11kg tanks. I just didn't want to have to buy French or A.N.Other bottle if Calor ran out while I was away.

 

[Rapide561]

Calor

Hi

I'm very happy with Calor. 13kg for £25.49, so roughly £1 per litre (26 litres). Not a great deal more than LPG at petrol stations etc and no cost of getting Gaslow or similar. Calor is very widely available too, more so than "others".

I feel however that those using 6kg variants are probably not of the same view, but could you use 1 x 13kg and 1 x 3.9kg instead of 2 x sixes? Use the 13kg all the time, when it runs out, switch over to the little one, and immediate replace the 13 kiloer asap, disconnecting the 3.9 - ie the 3.9 (expensive) is for emergency use.

Russell

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