Are so called wild campers spoiling it for everyone ? (1 Viewer)

bobandjanie

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We all moan in the UK about not being able to park anywhere when out and about in the motorhome. :Sad:
And anyone that travels in France Germany Spain Portugal in their motorhome know that its never a problem, you can park anywhere and makes life so much easier, they provide aires etc and say welcome to our village / town / city, and make you feel welcome. :Smile:

But looking at all the motorhome parking places opening up in Portugal such as Pedro's its looking like ' so called wild camping ' will be stopped in time.

But how do you stop them, here in Javea they have always been good, come round and you must leave the following day, they went off and came back after a couple of days .:Doh:

So they fenced off the waste ground they all parked on, but they then moved on to a parking area for some apartments, so they came and moved them on.

They have now moved onto another piece of waste ground ( well we call it waste ground but all land belongs to someone ) they even have a fifthwheel trailer dropped on there with its slides out legs down and no truck to be seen, so more than just parked, and has to called camping . :RollEyes:

Are these people going to spoil it for everyone, is it going to end up like the UK, go out in the camper and not be able to park anywhere, :winky: which concerns us because its our only vehicle. :whatthe:
If like us they only parked for one night, then moved on they would not have a problem, but some don't seem to understand when they are not wanted, until its too late.

In Germany we know a Stellplatz ( just like Aires in France ) where some parked on this piece of ground next to it to save paying, so they just put a sign up there too. :Smile:

I think if they did it Spain, they would rip it down or just park somewhere else, so what would you do to stop them, because I think its costing more trying to stop them, than they spend while they are here. :Doh:

After all Spain is full of people paying to camp, that dine out and spend money in the bars. :roflmto:
What's your view on it, because I think that motorhomes are for touring, and that becomes difficult when you have a job stopping anywhere. :Eeek: Bob.
 

TheBig1

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i personally dont see the fun of camping in a supermarket carpark or on waste ground amongst rubble weeds and rubbish. with no facilities wildcampers are often prone to dumping their waste inappropriately. this then leads to areas being fenced off and all motorhomes banned from even using a spot to park for the day

my way of looking at it is that the selfish and dirty few have spoilt it for the great many others that travel in their motorhome. as you quite rightly say, all land belongs to somebody, so what about the rights of the people on whos land they are illegally trespassing and squatting?

i am sure we have all seen vans inappropriately camping out and not just parking. maybe if the various authorities started fining transgressors on the spot we would soon see an end to the issue. once it starts costing people to camp rough in carparks or waste ground, then they will see the need for small cheap sites

to me freeloading tossers have got away with it for far too long, and it needs stopping to improve the opinion of the wider motorhoming community. we're not all Itinerants trying to get something for nothing whilst contaminating the environment.
 

Snowbird

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When I started motorhoming in Europe it was never a problem to park almost anywhere. I spent months up and down the Spanish coast wilding mainly on beaches. There were nowhere near the amount of motorhomes in those days that there are now. People are retiring earlier and living longer with more disposable money. Its not many years ago you never saw a Spanish registered motorhome, now there are loads of them. There is just to many of us now.

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ShiftZZ

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I saw a number and Snowbird will back me on this one, all lined up, grey water pouring out...

I agree with TB1 "freeloading tossers have got away with it for far too long," what's worse they brag about it... even some Funster's..
 

Trikimiki

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Coming from an area where you can wild camp just about anywhere. Before I bought a MH. I used to drive up the side of lomond almost daily, folk who go in tents should be moved on immediately, the experiment has been a failure. The loch side was covered in all types of debris, but mostly paper and plastic, and could only have come from one source. Motorhomes use the loch side constantly as do caravans and they seem to leave no mess on departing
 

Snowbird

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Firstly let me try to explain that I do not consider wilding to be parked on supermarket carparks, garage forecourts, industrial estates, demolition sites, village greens, or anywhere near private property.
What I do consider to be wilding is well away from anyone else, and always ask myself the question before setting up camp, would I mind if someone parked up there. If I had bought a house next to the beach with a sea view and 20 motorhomes turned up in the middle of the night and parked between me and the view I would not be well pleased.
If they all started dumping there grey waste and cassettes where I walk my dog and grandchildren I would be even less pleased, even if they told me it was only water with a little soap in it.
Below a few photos of what I do consider to be wildings.

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Forestboy

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Firstly let me try to explain that I do not consider wilding to be parked on supermarket carparks, garage forecourts, industrial estates, demolition sites, village greens, or anywhere near private property.
What I do consider to be wilding is well away from anyone else, and always ask myself the question before setting up camp, would I mind if someone parked up there. If I had bought a house next to the beach with a sea view and 20 motorhomes turned up in the middle of the night and parked between me and the view I would not be well pleased.
If they all started dumping there grey waste and cassettes where I walk my dog and grandchildren I would be even less pleased, even if they told me it was only water with a little soap in it.
Below a few photos of what I do consider to be wildings.

Totally agree, for us wildcamping (and we've done it on 4 continents) is about being in a beautiful spot where we don't bother anyone and certainly never stay too long and never leave a mess.

Camping in some grotty car park or bit of old scrub land or behind a supermarket just because its free is not my idea of wildcamping. Especially when the m/homes they're doing it in cost thousands and they only do it because its free, you can see why locals get annoyed I would if they parked outside my house.
 

UK Pete

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I am looking forward to my fiirst bit of wild camping this year, i will certainly not be dumping any type of waste, and will be sensible, i would not be to pleased to be talked about as harshly as some of the previous posts do about wild campers, there must be plenty of us funsters that are out there doing it responsibly
pete
 

Snowbird

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I am looking forward to my fiirst bit of wild camping this year, i will certainly not be dumping any type of waste, and will be sensible, i would not be to pleased to be talked about as harshly as some of the previous posts do about wild campers, there must be plenty of us funsters that are out there doing it responsibly
pete

Far more doing it responsibly than you would be led to believe :thumb:. Not all motorhomers dump waste or camp inconsiderately. The problem is that like most things in life, the majority suffer for the minority.

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bobandjanie

bobandjanie

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I must point out this is about ' so called wild campers ' that spend the winter here and have no intention of spending anything, not proper wild campers that only leave tyre tracks, and I know JJ is always going on about free loading to$$ers and being a ruffty tuffty, :roflmto: but I can assure you he is a softy and you will not see him parked with loads of ' so called wild campers ' he likes being on his own and we have had the privilege of off site parking with him :winky:.........................but deep down he would preferred it on his own. :ROFLMAO:
Bob.
 

jumar

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There are wildcampers (one night and away) and there are freeloaders, who want as much as they can for nothing. Unfortunately the latter will spoil it for themselves, and the wildcampers, by staying in one place for months and in large numbers.

We are presently "wild camping" at Quaios in Portugal, us and another Brit van only. Tomorrow we are moving on. We will leave no trace of our stay.
 
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We went to France for the first time this year with our motorhome it was a revelation. We stayed mainly on aires but 2 nights on a clay pigeon shooting ground (with the permission of the village and not in use:Smile:) cost us 10 euros for the week nowhere free in Le Toquet. I think there's a balance we did stay on a car park in Beaune next to the aire.Probably shouldn't have but the aire was full and got chatting to the French motorhome owners and stayed where they were out of the way at the end of the coach park (empty) very near the town centre. I don't think it's right or wrong to stay on a full facilities park, a caravan club site (but can't understand the fun of sitting there all day and not moving on to explore) a c/l an aire or wild camping provided no litter or nuisance.I bought a motorhome to explore different places it's just a pity we seem to live in the most motorhome unfriendly country in europe.

David

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TheBig1

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given my rant earlier I wish to make it clear that I don't see the sensible good mannered folk who park beside a Scottish loch or in the wilds of where ever leaving nothing but footprints and taking nothing but memories as the big problem. common decency prevents them from fouling the land and water courses with their waste. if you want to park in a farmers field, good luck to you, just ask

my rant and anger is directed to the masses of people who see it as their absolute right to park en masse wherever they go and put little if anything into the community they are abusing. I live in Dorset and in a few weeks certain areas will be over run by vans parking up for as long as they can get away with on roads, carparks and rough ground. the locals hate it because of the constant litter and smell of sewage near the vans and the occupants total lack of respect for the area. all the visitors are there for is to enjoy what everyone else comes to the area to enjoy but they want to do it without paying. Im not talking about parking up and cycling into town or a beach, i am talking about setting up camp and stopping day visitors from benefitting

whats wrong with the multitude of cheap but basic campsites and cls? £5 or £10 a night is far too much for some despite sitting in a van costing a small fortune. freeloading is a disgrace within our community and we need to see the back of it if we want to be made welcome
 
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We have a few places that we go and every time we go we take away a bin liners full of crap left by others it only takes a few minutes to put it in the bin when you find one.
most of the crap left is the locals
We don't stay long maybe one or two nights and I would not consider my shelf a free loader/
 

hilldweller

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If people did not (semi) wild camp in Morocco they'd have to drive all night, the sites are complet.

But in their wonderful way, the Moroccans charge a little and it all seems to work.

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bobandjanie

bobandjanie

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No Bill your not a free loader, to be honest we have found it a job to wild camp, you find a lovely little spot, wake up in the morning and more often than not find a couple more there. :Doh:
We normally like to park on aires in France but could not find anywhere to park and ask a frenchman, to be told park there........................right where we was. :thumb: Bob.
 
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bobandjanie

bobandjanie

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If people did not (semi) wild camp in Morocco they'd have to drive all night, the sites are complet.

But in their wonderful way, the Moroccans charge a little and it all seems to work.

That might work Brain, they need a guardian because most are frightened to leave their vans. :ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO:
How about free parking say up until 2100hrs, but if you stay all night and the police catch you its € 5 then people might be a bit more discreet about where they park. ::bigsmile:
At leased they collect something for their trouble. :roflmto: Bob.
 

TheBig1

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We have a few places that we go and every time we go we take away a bin liners full of crap left by others it only takes a few minutes to put it in the bin when you find one.
most of the crap left is the locals
We don't stay long maybe one or two nights and I would not consider my shelf a free loader/
Bill I dont want to fall out with you over this subject and recognise we have opposing views.

I realise that, without being rude or disparaging because ive been there, that some people are genuinely on a very tight budget. the van may be their only way to get a break from life. they may not be able to afford the small fortune paid by some for their van. but why do people find a piece of dirty waste ground appealling? i have direct links with the farming community and know for a fact that most farmers would say yes if asked if a van can park at the edge of a field or in an orchard for the night. when folks dont ask though its a different matter, they are down there with the tractor waiting for the rest of the "travellers" to arrive.

there are always options and places to suit all budgets available without breaking the bank. once a community get an opinion of what they see motorhomers are like, it takes a lot to change it. Graham went to great lengths to contact all the councils in the uk and from what i understand many are anti motorhomes for these very reasons. its not about parking in a carpark for 4 or more hours and needing to pay and display 2 or more bays. its about people having no respect for where they camp and not contributing to the local economy. you cant just keep taking without giving back

i respect that some people do clean up after themselves like bill, but the majority from my experience dont. our local council spends a small fortune clearing litter and all manner of discarded items left by people that park up for a week or 2. then add to that the teams they have to send in to clear sewage from storm drains and off carparks. it may be different in other areas that are not tourist hotspots but anywhere that people want to be you find these people.

take this mindset abroad and the problem grows bigger. for years people have rough camped for months on end at the same spots. just what do they do about their waste when the wheels don't turn for months and there's no proper facility to dispose of it. is it any surprise that we are seen as freeloaders and Itinerants? The Spanish are now cracking down on it, so the end is coming. some will be very disappointed that they've lost the facility others will just go do it elsewhere and move the problem with them.

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mariner

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I think that is where the difference lies, Free camping and Wild Camping are not even close to being the same thing.

Free Campers are just trying to get something for nothing and Wild campers are trying to get at one with their environment.



:Cool:
 

Snowbird

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Below are a few photos of what I call wild camping. They were all taken around Europe and North Africa in some of the many campers I have owned. They were all taken within 6 feet of where the van was parked and not less than 2 miles from the nearest building. Would the anti wilders consider this to be freeloading or anti social, or wild camping as I know it.

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TheBig1

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Below are a few photos of what I call wild camping. They were all taken around Europe and North Africa in some of the many campers I have owned. They were all taken within 6 feet of where the van was parked and not less than 2 miles from the nearest building. Would the anti wilders consider this to be freeloading or anti social, or wild camping as I know it.
what you are doing in those photos is far away from the anti social behaviour i'm talking about. i am specifically on about the masses that camp out on wasteground and carparks round towns. plenty of it to be seen round the costas at the moment from what i've seen and heard. hardly discrete and harmless
 

Forestboy

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I think that is where the difference lies, Free camping and Wild Camping are not even close to being the same thing.

Free Campers are just trying to get something for nothing and Wild campers are trying to get at one with their environment.



:Cool:

Perfect description :thumb:
 

GJH

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We went to France for the first time this year with our motorhome it was a revelation. We stayed mainly on aires but 2 nights on a clay pigeon shooting ground (with the permission of the village and not in use:Smile:) cost us 10 euros for the week nowhere free in Le Toquet. I think there's a balance we did stay on a car park in Beaune next to the aire.Probably shouldn't have but the aire was full and got chatting to the French motorhome owners and stayed where they were out of the way at the end of the coach park (empty) very near the town centre. I don't think it's right or wrong to stay on a full facilities park, a caravan club site (but can't understand the fun of sitting there all day and not moving on to explore) a c/l an aire or wild camping provided no litter or nuisance.I bought a motorhome to explore different places [HI]it's just a pity we seem to live in the most motorhome unfriendly country in europe.[/HI]

David
Do we live in the most motorhome unfriendly country in Europe or simply live in a country which (because of its size and geographical/population mix) happen to have few places similar to those which Snowbird and others have described, as opposed to car parks?

It's interesting to see Big1's point about vans parking up for as long as they can get away with. I've recently been in touch with a council in Devon where one of the problems they have is people using residents' preferential parking rates to use car parks as storage sites for their motorhomes.

There is no escaping the facts that, in this country, there are thousands of places to overnight legally if one seeks them out but many desirable places are denied to those people who will stay, responsibly, for just one night by the actions of abusers whose only priority is their own selfishness and who upset local residents as a result.

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Quintapedro

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I think that is where the difference lies, Free camping and Wild Camping are not even close to being the same thing.

Free Campers are just trying to get something for nothing and Wild campers are trying to get at one with their environment.



:Cool:

Hello my friends

i think you are right, it's a big difference, today a went arround "free campsites" to make some publicity about the site I'm managing, i sow a lot of MH park around Albufeira near the beaches in amazing and very beautiful places ( Praia de s. Rafael, praia do Castelo, Gale) , i was in Silves ( near the swiming pool and ner the Castelo). i sow a lot of new people and sow a few friends that pass an few days with us....
I agree with free camping, people should be free to travel around Portugal and park in same nice free spots for a few days ( maximo 3 or 4) them go to onother spot and duscover difrent places, and between that visit the Campsites or places where they ken empty there grey waters and toilet. ...
like this i think it will be ok for every one., tge MH people have a motor home to for travelling around, the sites will have people came and going and the vilas and cities have people visiting there nice places.
the problem now is like it what appended today, i was giving a flyer to an MH and the lady say to me; "....i have all ready you flyer, I'm here 5 mounts and you had give me all ready..."....i ask her 5 mounts here? She say to me".. yes, here i dont pay and it's nice...." i ask her about what they do with the waters, she loft and point it for the sandy flor....
In January and February is near 30.000 campers in Portugal, if like it seams drop they toilet waters in places that the water have an treatment in what they will transform that beautiful places? Dont tell me that people that have MH of € 10.000 and a lot more dont have € 5 to go enpty they waters...
Free MH is go to discover new places, it's go and make new friends, its go and see new cultures, its for shore don't stop to long in one place.....
If people want to run from the rain, get some sun, still eating the same food that you eat in home, if you is in no mood to travelling around, if they like to be in long term with a group of MH friends, then they should shose one pay compsite that they like whit all the conditions to they dont have to move...
It's 2 options or spending in diesel or spending in a campsite. ...
I see a lot of abusers, i near me in Paderne ( fontes de paderne)its a smal area that aloud 8 MH to patk for free for 48h, I normally see m o re then 12MH, some of them stay there f o r more them 30 days, I have to tell you that the place is a "fonte" (sweet water commig from the ground) and I sow msny times people empty there toilet waters to the ground. ...
I ken not say nothin, because people think th a t I will do it because of my campsite, but if you dont start to change this mentalities in the people that is abusing it will be bad to you and to us from campsites, because MH people it will start tinking that they are not welcome and that is not the true.
Portuguese people love MH people and that I ken guarantee. ...
 
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The problem is that as people keep abusing the more barriers and height restrictions are put in place,and we end up having to pay £20 plus to stop when travelling even if one arrives at 7-8 at night and leaving early next day.I don't mind paying for sites if staying for a few nights when using facilities.
 

gibbon

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Freeloading tossers

i personally dont see the fun of camping in a supermarket carpark or on waste ground amongst rubble weeds and rubbish. with no facilities wildcampers are often prone to dumping their waste inappropriately. this then leads to areas being fenced off and all motorhomes banned from even using a spot to park for the day

my way of looking at it is that the selfish and dirty few have spoilt it for the great many others that travel in their motorhome. as you quite rightly say, all land belongs to somebody, so what about the rights of the people on whos land they are illegally trespassing and squatting?

i am sure we have all seen vans inappropriately camping out and not just parking. maybe if the various authorities started fining transgressors on the spot we would soon see an end to the issue. once it starts costing people to camp rough in carparks or waste ground, then they will see the need for small cheap sites

to me freeloading tossers have got away with it for far too long, and it needs stopping to improve the opinion of the wider motorhoming community. we're not all Itinerants trying to get something for nothing whilst contaminating the environment.

I quite like a bit of RESPONSIBLE wild camping, we are not all freeloading tossers .
Done wisely it can make an expensive alternative lifestyle more accessible to people with a less than flambouyant income.
I don't camp on car parks, building sites etc.
The poi's on wildcamping are very helpfull.

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