Insurance Quote ~ don't mention Solar Panels!! (1 Viewer)

Jul 4, 2010
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I just committed a boo boo.

Speaking to a very pleasant insurance quote advisor at SAGA who asked if the MH had been altered or modified.

Stupid stupid me as I said I had added (that's not fitted from scratch) a solar panel. This is now an added power boost or an accessesory and the quote has to go to underwriters, yes really.

The other question to back that up "was this fitted professionally ?". So no more DIY for SAGA maybe?

So please please if you fit a bike rack, top box, sat dish or solar panel etc don't make the same mistake in being honest, or is that naive?

Funny world when common sense has dissapeared completely.




.
 

tonka

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Can say I never had an issue with Safeguard... Even told them about having the engine re-mapped on my old van and it was all noted and never any extra charge...

Thanks on the tip, SAGA just Never come out cheap for me on anything, don't even bother getting quotes off them now...
 

raysalaugh

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Their not called SAGA for nothing.:ROFLMAO:

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ShiftZZ

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I just committed a boo boo.

Speaking to a very pleasant insurance quote advisor at SAGA who asked if the MH had been altered or modified.

Stupid stupid me as I said I had added (that's not fitted from scratch) a solar panel. This is now an added power boost or an accessesory and the quote has to go to underwriters, yes really.

The other question to back that up "was this fitted professionally ?". So no more DIY for SAGA maybe?

So please please if you fit a bike rack, top box, sat dish or solar panel etc [HI]don't make the same mistake in being honest, or is that naive?[/HI]

Funny world when common sense has dissapeared completely.


.


So your solar panel (DIY) comes off on the M6, hits another car, causing a big pile up and the cost could be thousands, your insurance company asks you for proof that the solar panel was fitted correctly and professionally,
You..."Aghhhhhhh".
Insurance company -- as Slob/buttons would say "Have a nice day"!

Had you told the insurance company and they considered the risk and the premium, you are covered.

I have told mine about all the mods done on the Rapido, when asked about other mods, I reply, "not as far as I am aware".

Failing to advise the Insurance company and you have an accident or incident could ruin you financially..
 

chatter

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arent Saga just a part of the AA these days - thought AA bought Saga out a few years ago, and usually quotes only rise if its vehicle engine performance related mods, it used to be alloy wheels as well at one time but now they are as common as muck
 
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Aug 27, 2009
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So your solar panel (DIY) comes off on the M6, hits another car, causing a big pile up and the cost could be thousands, your insurance company asks you for proof that the solar panel was fitted correctly and professionally,
You..."Aghhhhhhh".
Insurance company -- as Slob/buttons would say "Have a nice day"!

Had you told the insurance company and they considered the risk and the premium, you are covered.

I have told mine about all the mods done on the Rapido, when asked about other mods, I reply, "not as far as I am aware".

Failing to advise the Insurance company and you have an accident or incident could ruin you financially..
Same as all insurance, if you don't own up they don't pay up. If travailing to the US then it is worthwhile to get your doctor to sign a copy of your medical records, saves a lot of doubt. Sorry going off at a tangent. I agree with Shiftzz:winky:

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OP
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So your solar panel (DIY) comes off on the M6, hits another car, causing a big pile up and the cost could be thousands, your insurance company asks you for proof that the solar panel was fitted correctly and professionally,
You..."Aghhhhhhh".
Insurance company -- as Slob/buttons would say "Have a nice day"!

Had you told the insurance company and they considered the risk and the premium, you are covered.

I have told mine about all the mods done on the Rapido, when asked about other mods, I reply, "not as far as I am aware".

Failing to advise the Insurance company and you have an accident or incident could ruin you financially..


Or how about, you fit a new metal towel hook, it comes off under severe braking, hits the driver on the back of the head, he goes unconscious...

How far does this go? Should you declare literally everything to your insurers once fitted?

Is there no element of acceptable risk allowed now? Can a non qualified person change their spark plugs without informing the insurers?

Sorry Mr ShiftZZ, but if your pedal bikes fall off the back of your MH and mayhem is caused, can you be sued for not being a professional bike fitter-oner, I hope not. I assume that most people have basic levels of competance and common sense and that do not deliberately tie their bikes on hoping they will come off. Sometimes there are accidents and risks, that's what humanity does.

Have you ever in your life seen incredibly bad work by 'professionals', I have and was able to do better although an 'amateur'.

Do DIYers doing up a house now run the risk of everything they do that is not completed to a professional standard making them open to being sued or refused insurance?

If we take all the risk our of our lives it would be so boring that many would question what is the purpose of it all. Can't this trend go too far if we are all forced to become riskless robots to make insurers happy/profitable?

Last, does this mean that in the brave new world, will we no longer have accidents as no one is allowed to do anything that insurance companies and lawers don't allow?

Some big questions for the future.




.
 
OP
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By the way, SAGA haven't quoted yet as it's 'gone to the underwriters' , so have no idea if their insurance conditions and price are reasonable or not.
 

GJH

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Or how about, you fit a new metal towel hook, it comes off under severe braking, hits the driver on the back of the head, he goes unconscious...

How far does this go? Should you declare literally everything to your insurers once fitted?

Is there no element of acceptable risk allowed now?(snip for brevity)

That's getting the wrong end of the stick isn't it? Dave's response wasn't about risk but about honesty - the comment "don't make the same mistake in being honest" was highlighted.

If an insurance company asks a question and the proposer gives a dishonest answer (and then signs a declaration, on all proposal forms, that full and honest information has been given) then the insurance company has every right not to pay out in the case of something going wrong.

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Techno

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At nearly 55 I wonder just how old I have to get before they become the teensiest bit competitive on price
 

ShiftZZ

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That's getting the wrong end of the stick isn't it? Dave's response wasn't about risk but about honesty - the comment "don't make the same mistake in being honest" was highlighted.

If an insurance company asks a question and the proposer gives a dishonest answer (and then signs a declaration, on all proposal forms, that full and honest information has been given) then the insurance company has every right not to pay out in the case of something going wrong.

Indeed, a number of Insurance companies use Voice Stress Analysis software to try and identify non truths...

If as Graham states dont tell the truth when asked and sign the proposal for to say that the information contained within is true and its not, technically you may NOT be insured and then the whole liability for your actions will fall on your shoulders.

Insurance as you know is based on probability and risk, they therefore they will charge you accordingly.

You pay your money and they cover the liability.


Recently I met a student who had not declared to his insurance company that he had lost his DL some 5 years ago (12 month ban). I suggested to him that for the last few years he had been driving effectivly without insurance, was he bothered? No...
 

aba

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lets just hope nothing happens and your insurance say pi$$ off you havent told us about this solar panel so what else have you not told us.
 

stcyr

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As an aside ... I steered clear of Saga for years, not just because they always seemed to be far from competitive, but also because I was reluctant to admit to getting old, lol.... Renewed car insurance this year (was with RAC, £333p.a. with just 60 days foreign use) -

- Saga came out best of all: £144, f/comp, 365 day foreign use with full policy cover...

Result.

::bigsmile:

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quarryjmiller

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Modifications

How far does this go then?

I've got a Fiamma awning and bike rack, both fitted by the dealer, through roof tv aerial fitted by a specialist, last motorhome had a satellite dome (I did once mention this to Scenic and they said don't worry about it).

Insurance companies seem to be content to ignore whiplash fraudsters and focus on this type of thing.

I bet the underwriter has got a degree in something or other but would you trust him/her to actually fit a solar panel to your van?
 

pappajohn

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whoever you spoke to is a numpty.....

how is a solar panel a 'power boost' except in the sense of an electrical charger.

they are referring to a power upgrade (ECU chipping) but obviously don't know their own terminology.

i dont doubt for one minute they do need to know of any modifications/accessories but to call it a power boost is beyond belief :Doh:

many insurers have a list of items they class as a modification, which you can check.....

my car insurers class a towbar as a modification...not an accessory...but it doesnt affect the premium.

tell them everything or risk a refusal at claim time.
 
OP
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That's getting the wrong end of the stick isn't it? Dave's response wasn't about risk but about honesty - the comment "don't make the same mistake in being honest" was highlighted.

If an insurance company asks a question and the proposer gives a dishonest answer (and then signs a declaration, on all proposal forms, that full and honest information has been given) then the insurance company has every right not to pay out in the case of something going wrong.

I understand you are not making any accusations, along with ShiftZZ, but may I just say that a complaint against me is I am too brutally honest.

I was trying to make a point that by being honest my insurance proposal will be referred due to vehicle modifications. To be truthful I really didn't consider that adding an extra solar panel was a vehicle modification, does everybody on hear declare them when renewing insurance? If so I am way behind the times.
I am so out of touch that I consider modifications being things like fitting larger wheels, fitting a turbo, chipping an engine etc etc. My background is vehicle modification so I do/did have an understanding as to what modification and it's consequences are.
So is it correct that everybody that uses a top box on a car advises their insurers? Of course that may be so but I don't think so and the same example applies. It comes off and havoc including not being insured?

Graham you are partially right in respect to Dave's comment. His was directed at the advising the insurance company honestly and my response was regarding how long and comprehensive is the list of modifications and who has this list?

This is really about whether to advise that solar panel was fitted and should it be considered a modification at all.

The pleasant person at SAGA didn't know what a solar panel was at all. Not what it looked like and what it did, in fact had never heard of it. She was maybe late 20's, well spoken and sounded bright. It wasn't in her box of options, accessories or modifications, she didn't know what to do so referred the proposal.

If I had kept my mouth shut (that's not the same as being dishonest as I didn't and don't consider it a modification to the motorhome, it's an accessory) she would have given me my quote there and then.

So after considering all your points, my conclusion is to answer the questions that you are legally and morally required to do, don't say anything else as it can hinder the passage of life.

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GJH

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From the online dictionary - note number 3
modification [ˌmɒdɪfɪˈkeɪʃən]
n
1. the act of modifying or the condition of being modified
2. something modified; the result of a modification
3. a small change or adjustment
4. (Linguistics / Grammar) Grammar the relation between a modifier and the word or phrase that it modifies
In the case of completing an insurance proposal we are all legally (never mind morally) required to be totally frank. Look at any advice issued by insurance companies and it says something along the lines of "if in doubt mention it". If any of us "don't say anything else" we run the risk of being uninsured.

It doesn't matter if I, or another proposer, considers a solar panel (or anything else) a modification, what matters is whether or not the insurance company does so - and unless the proposer tells them then he/she cannot be certain what the company attitude is.
 
OP
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Graham

I would like to know if in your view using a non manufacturers' jack a modification for example? It's a change in the vehicle equipment.

Dictionary definitions and theory is wonderful, but in real life there may be hundreds of items added to a motorhome. Where do we start or end. Have the insurance companies enough time to listen to whole list of items the MH didn't start life with. Who has the definite list, where can we all view it?

I am just trying to make the point that even adding something like an extra external mirror would need to be mentioned with your definitions and it's neither practical or common sense.

Just keep thinking about top boxes on MH's and cars, and whether the insurance industry need or want to know.

I believe that most people are grown up and can make most reasonable decisions on their own. There's a greater degree of self reliance and common sense than the population are give credit for.

ps: I do believe in morality and think it should be taken into account more often.

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sedge

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Wellllllll - can I just tell you what this is All About?

Saga's underwriters know that Joe Bloggs who you spoke to, IS a numpty or possibly, has more chance of BEING a numpty, than not in this day and age.

So they tell him that all Power Boosting amendments must be referred to them, because they actually have a brain. With me so far? He doesn't give Joe a choice, it's a jobsworth issue. ie Refer it or you'll get your arse licked/the sack.

They now discover that Joe is even more of a numpty than they have previously allowed for and all that's going to happen is that they are gonna stamp it with the 'Accepted at no increased premium' stamp, and sign on the dotted line.

And Joe Bloggs' name will go round the Underwriters' office like wildfire and everybody will have a good laugh. One of them will probably ring him up tomorrow and offer to sell him a Long Stand ....... :thumb:

Many hours of innocent fun for Underwriters everywhere, are Middle Men. Guaranteed to brighten my day, daily.

eg young lady broker rings insurance company livestock underwriter.

'I've quoted (your rates) on this lady's horse and she thinks its expensive, can you do anything to reduce it?' 'Give me the details and I'll see'.

It becomes apparent what the person has done.

'You have quoted on this horse as if it were a full stallion, but it isn't - it's a gelding'

'Oh - What's the difference?' :Doh:

See what I mean?

What did the Underwriter say?

'Ask your dad'. :Eeek:
 

ShiftZZ

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Remember it could work both ways...

You have a solar panel or two or more, you don't tell them and the van gets nicked, you then claim and that claim includes the value of the solar panels, or sat or whatever and they could say, sorry, not covered, or, sorry the van is covered but not the solar...

As Graham said, if they ask you tell them, I had a similar problem with the new (to us) van, it had solar and sat installed along with Cobra Alarm, but I was not suppled with the Thatcham Certificate, they then said that as the Alarm certificate was missing they would have to increase the insurance or remove the sat cover. Long story, got the dealer to write (several attempts at wording) to the insurance company. sorted, eventually..

As Jenny said , the 'agent' on the phone will have little idea as to what you are talking about, thats not important, YOUR COVER IS.

How far do you go?
Tell them if they ask..
 

GJH

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I'm not being rude, Veevee, but what part of "if in doubt mention it" is unclear?

Yes, most people are grown up but that doesn't matter a jot because all insurance companies reserve the right to make the decision, not leave it to the proposer. Fail to tell them something which they them deem material to a claim and the claim could well be rejected.

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OP
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I don't think either you Graham or Dave are being rude, just putting over views that you believe are correct in your eyes.

We see the world from different angles and guess we will have to agree to disagree.

I just hope that this discussion has helped others to realise they have to think carefully about what they tell their insurers.

Good luck
 
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Geo

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I don't think either you Graham or Dave are being rude, just putting over views that you believe are correct in your eyes.

We see the world from different angles and guess we will have to agree to disagree.

I just hope that this discussion has helped others to realise they have to think carefully about what they tell their insurers.

Good luck

Like you Vee
I was asked what mods if any were made to my Motorhome, I replied casually "No its all as it should be except the TV"
You changed the TV why?
Its American and the TV's dont work over here
They dont? do all RVs have to change the TVs?
Yes they do, :Eeek:
Sensing the alarm in her voice I stopped short of pointing out that the whole electrical system is sometimes changed from 110v to 240V
They really don't have a clue, and this was from an RV specialist insurer too:Doh:
I suspect most of the interest in modifications is to do with value and its effect on the increased likely hood of theft ie increase in risk

But rest assured anything you do or have done is indeed a modification to the Manf spec, (on which your quote is based) your solar panel changes the way your leisure batteries are charged, and i'd bet a pound to a penny an electrical fire reporting that the solar system was to blame would result in nil payout if not declared:Doh:
any other view on this is pure wish full thinking and belongs in fantasy land
 

JayDee

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As a result of this thread we remembered that we hadn't told our insurers (Comfort) about the solar panels, so this morning Pat (it registered and insured under her name) phoned them up and they told her -

'Yes we know about the re-map and the air-rides and up-plating and they're mentioned on your data.
We didn't know about your gas tank and solar panels but they are all covered under the policy anyway. I've made a note on your file'.

Sounds good to me.:thumb:


John

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GJH

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Great John. It would be nice to think that everyone enjoyed the same outcome - but the point is that everything is known to both parties in the insurance contract so avoids any misunderstanding.
 
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Quote from Geo

"Its American and the TV's dont work over here
They dont? do all RVs have to change the TVs?
Yes they do, :Eeek:
Sensing the alarm in her voice I stopped short of pointing out that the whole electrical system is sometimes changed from 110v to 240V
They really don't have a clue, and this was from an RV specialist insurer too"

So what happens if you or other RV owners have an electrical fire and you haven't declared it?

Geo you know how to do loads of stuff on your RV, and do it well. Have you informed your insurers of every tiny electrical installation, even if it's only a replacement of say 1m of cable?

What the right thing to do when you fit a charging relay from leisure to vehicle battery?

Will someone tell me at what point do we not inform the insurers, when is the item too insignificant? Where is a list we can work from?
That's the 3rd time I have asked who has the definitive list of what we should ignore and no reply from people with strong opinions on this.

Have been very lucky to have had only 2 insurance claims in my life (no make that 3 as also a cracked windscreen), 1 where our MH was broken into and trashed in Spain, the second when a very nice car of mine was locked in a garage and someone an employee of a neighbouring business walked across the roof of my garage and fell clean through, damaged the boot, rear wing and roof, it had an aluminium body.

In both cases I was correctly insured and in both cases not present, in both cases the insurers wriggled to an obscene degree. So my regard for insurers isn't too high especially after meeting a claims adjuster on a social level and heard a few stories.

Everybody should stay within the rules and regs of their insurance, but for the fourth time where is the list, or do we use common sense God forbid?
 

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