Upgrading Win7 to Linux Mint (1 Viewer)

[Gromett]

PS: the reason I recommend a second hard drive where possible is that windows is known to screw up the boot loader.
As I have Linux as my primary OS and only load W7 to play World of Warcraft with my family over the christmas period I didn't want to risk it screwing things up again.

 

[Langtoftlad]

So back from the PC Doctor & all up & running again... tickety boo.

He confirmed that loading Linux on a separate disk was preferable - when we opened up the PC, there is already a spare drive [he left it in there when he installed my SSD].
He showed by disconnecting the SSD, that I could force Linux onto the second drive and then choose which drive to boot from via F12

Yes my machine is 64bit but the Linux Mint 19.2 screwed up the graphics display during installation - which again PC guy said wasn't unknown.

He actually recommended Ubuntu over Mint as being more reliable - but as he pointed out that with my W7 safely tucked away on a separate disk, I can play with whatever Linux distros I like.

So, thanks both of you again Gromett & Gellyneck

So why, in your opinions, is Linux Mint preferable to Ubunto?

 

[Gromett]

So why, in your opinions, is Linux Mint preferable to Ubunto?

Brief bit of history...

Ubuntu is based on Debian Linux and is downstream from them. Ubuntu have traditionally run a "Not invented here" philosophy and they rewrote their own desktop, compositor and much more instead of contributing to the industries established versions. They also dicked around with some stuff that wasn't necessary. They were aiming to release a phone and did something similar to what MS did in making a single front end that was designed to be used on both. Remember Windows 8?
Ubuntu however did have a good control panel and installer and other stuff and was responsible for quite a few bug fixes and nice tweaks.

Linux Mint came along and took the Ubuntu base and stripped out all the non standard stuff and replaced it with a Gnome based desktop. When Gnome decided to dump their V2 software and start over with an obnoxious V3 A group of people forked Gnome V3 and backported the old desktop to it. Linux mint picked this up and helped fund the development. It is a bit like if MS was open source someone forking Win7 and continuing to develop it so that you weren't forced to go to Windows 10.

This is the beauty of Linux in that you can pick and choose which bits you want or you can go to one of the many 100's of distributions who have already done this for you.

I prefer Mint because although based on Ubuntu has been closer to Debian than Ubuntu in reality.

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[NorthernSands]

I personally prefer Gentoo and building from source code, but that's a whole different kettle of fish!!

If I were you, I'd play around with different distro's until you find the one you like ( http://www.distrowatch.org ). On a day-to-day basis preference comes down to window manager (Gnome, KDE, XFCE, LXDE, etc.) and what the distro puts on top, but when setting up and running updates, the package manager (installer) has a large part to play. You can, usually, install several window managers on the same distro and choose when you log in, so you can actually install one distro and try out different ones (just go to the package manager and install another one. Hopefully the distro will enable the chooser on login). But it might be quicker to try various 'live CDs' on a USB stick and try them that way.

You'll find most / all things you could possibly want to install in said package manager. Even if you find an application online that you want, and it has a Linux installer, there's a good chance you'll find it in the package manager already. It's always better to install via the package manager as it handles all the dependencies for you (most Linux software requires - depends on - other software, sometimes tens or hundreds of other applications - take a basic, headless Gentoo install and tell it install a browser: WOW!).

Re. Ubuntu and Mint: politics has even found its way into Linux. Just look at the LibreOffice / OpenOffice split!

Have fun!

 

[Gellyneck]

Langtoftlad
Stephen, pleased you got everything fixed.
Nothing I could add to Karl's Gromett detail on Ubuntu \ Mint apart from I find Mint Cinnamon more "Windows 10ish" than Ubuntu. From memory Karl is a Mate or XFCE supporter.
Out on a limb here but I'd put money on your desktop having NVidia graphics?
When I rebuilt one of our Windows 7 \ Linux Mint desktops a few weeks ago I thought I'd be a smartf*rt and change the graphics card from AMD to a newer NVidia. Once everything was up and running went into drivers settings and change from the default xserver............ to NVidia drivers and all hell broke loose! It was that bad I couldn't get the default drivers to work so had to do another full reinstall.
Anyway, would be interested in hearing how you get on with Linux.

 

[Gromett]

I find Mint Cinnamon more "Windows 10ish" than Ubuntu.

Did you mean windows 7 ish?

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[Gellyneck]

Did you mean windows 7 ish?

Correct

 

[hilldweller]

I'm delighted for you .
But it's not very helpful.

Of course it's helpful. I am telling you, confirming what Jim said, that Linux Mint works very well. It's just a matter of installing it and coming to terms with the differences between Linux and Windows.

 

[Langtoftlad]

Of course it's helpful. I am telling you, confirming what Jim said, that Linux Mint works very well. It's just a matter of installing it and coming to terms with the differences between Linux and Windows.

It might work very well for you.
It wasn't "just" a matter of installing it - as that failed
...it can have problems with a corrupted bootloader as I discovered before your "helpful" post.
Failed dual boot installation is not uncommon - and as various more experienced & helpful people have since suggested, installation on a separate drive is a good way to proceed.
I'm quite capable of "coming to terms with any differences", whether or not I choose to is entirely different.
So I maintain - your comment wasn't helpful in the slightest - but I thank you for your input & interest.

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[Riverbankannie]

Disabling updates is a very effective way to get viruses and ransomware. Windows 7 was great at the time, but Windows 10 is an improvement in all respects.

Thanks, I do know that windows updates contain fixes against viruses but between a rock and a hard place deciding how to proceed. I make sure Norton internet security is up to date.

 

[hilldweller]

So I maintain - your comment wasn't helpful in the slightest - but I thank you for your input & interest.

It's always a great pleasure to assist a fellow FUNster, your thanks are really not needed my reward is to know that I have enhanced the life of a fellow traveller through life.

 

[StephDeLux]

Thanks, I do know that windows updates contain fixes against viruses but between a rock and a hard place deciding how to proceed. I make sure Norton internet security is up to date.

That's a good thing... on Windows 7 if you don't have installed the free Windows Defender. On Windows 10, you get a built-in Windows Defender that insures a better protection than third parties like Norton. And the updates are free.

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[OldAgeTravellers]

Hi,
This is an old thread but I have a very similar problem. I have tried and given up on Linux many times but having now upgraded my SSD to 480gb as win10 had outgrown it I decided to install Mint 19 on the old 240gb one.
The live CD on USB runs well and the desktop looks promising. I have to have windows available as I use legacy software which will not run on Linux but may possibly run in a virtual windows environment.
The install went well and dual boot to windows is fine with windows untroubled but Mint only ran once then I got the (initramfs) prompt which seems to be common but none of the fixes I have found have worked.
Reading Gromett advice above I will try removing all except the Linux disk and do a simple install with Mint as the first OS. But how do I remove Grub from the windows disk? I have read that the dual boot from the windows disk can be a problem so that may be the answer.
Any suggestions, other than "I work with Linux with no problems" would be welcomed.
I will come back when i have done the reinstall.
Steve

 

[OldAgeTravellers]

OK, decided to do as Gromett outlined above, disconnected all but the Linux disk and wiped it with "Gparted" then installed Mint 19.3. Same problem with (initramfs) prompt so ok wiped that and tried Mint 18.3 and here we go again (initramfs).
Now I realise that many people use Linux very successfully on all sorts of hardware but I have never succeeded in installing it. What could I possibly be doing wrong. I have a fairly high spec i7 machine with 16gig memory, only one clean disk, any suggestions? Gromett !
Steve

 

[Gromett]

OK, decided to do as Gromett outlined above, disconnected all but the Linux disk and wiped it with "Gparted" then installed Mint 19.3. Same problem with (initramfs) prompt so ok wiped that and tried Mint 18.3 and here we go again (initramfs).
Now I realise that many people use Linux very successfully on all sorts of hardware but I have never succeeded in installing it. What could I possibly be doing wrong. I have a fairly high spec i7 machine with 16gig memory, only one clean disk, any suggestions? Gromett !
Steve

If you can give me the exact message in full I may be able to advise.

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[Gromett]

OK, decided to do as Gromett outlined above, disconnected all but the Linux disk and wiped it with "Gparted" then installed Mint 19.3. Same problem with (initramfs) prompt so ok wiped that and tried Mint 18.3 and here we go again (initramfs).
Now I realise that many people use Linux very successfully on all sorts of hardware but I have never succeeded in installing it. What could I possibly be doing wrong. I have a fairly high spec i7 machine with 16gig memory, only one clean disk, any suggestions? Gromett !
Steve

Also boot off the live USB/DVD mount the partitions and look for the /var directory. in there you will find the log directory.

Look for the file called syslog and send it to me.

 

[Gromett]

One last thought. Are you installing using bios mode or UEFI?

 

[Gromett]

So why, in your opinions, is Linux Mint preferable to Ubunto?

I am a hardcore linux person. I dislike distributions that do things their own way rather than using industry standards.

Ubuntu created their own desktop, init system and much more. None of them were that good to be honest and to get Ubuntu working well for me meant stripping all their self made dross out and re-installing industry standard stuff.

They have recently dropped development of their own desktop and moved to industry standard ones.

When I say industry standard I better explain. Open software is developed by the community and anyone can contribute. Canonical (the company behind Ubuntu) decided to develop stuff in house, rarely accepted contributions and decided their desktop was primary. They basically did what microsoft did with Windows 8. They wanted a desktop that would work on mobile phones and the desktop. They like microsoft ended up with something unfamiliar that wasn't very good on either.

Ubuntu did do some really good stuff like the installer and the software manager. Mint took Ubuntu and stripped out the nonsense and replaced it with bog standard stuff that works as you would expect.

Then both Gnome and KDE the two industry leaders in desktops did exactly the same thing, and made those desktops unusable for many. So Mint took Gnome v2 and upgraded it to use the latest libraries. So we ended with a traditional desktop looking desktop but that had all the latest features. It was the best of all worlds.

That is a brief, and very simplified explanation.

The ubuntu installed and the Mint installer are exactly the same. So if you have problems with one you are more than likely going to have problems with the other.

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[Gromett]

OK, decided to do as Gromett outlined above, disconnected all but the Linux disk and wiped it with "Gparted" then installed Mint 19.3. Same problem with (initramfs) prompt so ok wiped that and tried Mint 18.3 and here we go again (initramfs).
Now I realise that many people use Linux very successfully on all sorts of hardware but I have never succeeded in installing it. What could I possibly be doing wrong. I have a fairly high spec i7 machine with 16gig memory, only one clean disk, any suggestions? Gromett !
Steve

One more question. Had that hard disk had Windows installed on it at any time? Many moons ago when I still dual booted, I tried to install linux (not mint) on an old windows disk and it failed. I can't remember the details but windows had screwed up the disk which prevented booting. I can't remember what I did to fix it as it must be well over 10 years.

 

[OldAgeTravellers]

One last thought. Are you installing using bios mode or UEFI?

Hi Gromett thanks for the replies.
I thought I would answer this question first. I am running the USB stick in UEFI mode I haven't seen an option for which mode in the installation but the bios is set up as UEFI. Should it be bios?
One other question that may eliminate Linux for me is that I have my data disk D: in Windows 10 set up as a pair of Mirrored disks (raid-1?) as I would need to share this data between the OSes can Linux work with this type of disk.
I got exactly the same result with Mint 18.3 so I am now installing 19.3 again. I can then work out how to send the log file to you.
Steve

 

[OldAgeTravellers]

One more question. Had that hard disk had Windows installed on it at any time? Many moons ago when I still dual booted, I tried to install linux (not mint) on an old windows disk and it failed. I can't remember the details but windows had screwed up the disk which prevented booting. I can't remember what I did to fix it as it must be well over 10 years.

Yes it was my previous Windows SSD but before loading mint I deleted all partitions with a live version of "Gparted" then allowed mint to partition and format it. Perhaps a more thorough preparation is required.

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[Gromett]

Yes it was my previous Windows SSD but before loading mint I deleted all partitions with a live version of "Gparted" then allowed mint to partition and format it. Perhaps a more thorough preparation is required.

Yes, that is what I did and had the problems. I seem to recall removing partitions then manually creating ext2/3 partion that was full size. saving it. Then removing that partition and doing the install.
You should use ext4 these days.

It is a possibility but highly unlikely this is the cause. UEFI/BIOS conflict is more likely. But without the actual full error it is hard to judge. The logs should provide even more info.

 

[Lenny HB]

The last time I tried Linux I gave up as well I think it was Ubuntu 10, got fed up with having to go back to my nerdy days to get things to work.
Just before Christmas spurred on by Funsters good comments about Mint I thought I would have another go as my Win 10 PC was getting slow and cranky and I didn't want to reformat it.

The PC is a few years old now an HP Pavillon 2 in 1 with i3 cpu, 4 GB ram & 1TB hd, went for a dual boot. From the start of the download to an up and running PC with dual boot Mint 19 was running in less than an hour, I made an ISO image on a USB stick for the install.

It's not perfect but it is blindingly fast after Win10, I still have a few bugs to sort out. and I've had to resort to being a geek to install a few things.
It won't remember network drive's logins I've tried the fixes on the forums also I can't get it to map a network drive ( I use a nas drive samba with mirrored raid as my server).
I can't get it to install MS true type fonts, I've been trying via the Terminal.
Images such as jpegs will only show a thumbnail if the file is on the local drive, which is a right pain.
Can't get my scanner to run it's an Plustek Opticbook 3800.
I find Libre Office Draw nowhere near as good as Open office draw, as Libre Office is an updated version of Open Office you can't run both so it looks like I will have to uninstall Libre office and install Open Office.
No way of getting Autoroute to run in an emulator.

Despite a few downsides in the 4 or 5 weeks I've had it installed I've only booted to Win 10 about 4 times, shame it won't do everything I need it would be nice to ditch Windows.

 

[OldAgeTravellers]

Also boot off the live USB/DVD mount the partitions and look for the /var directory. in there you will find the log directory.

Look for the file called syslog and send it to me.

I have found the log file, but the Forum won't let me post it as an attachment in a "Private Conversation" I will try the two step disk wipe you suggest below.

Yes Lenny HB I find it very frustrating having tried so many times to get it to work. The only success i have had is with LibreElec Kodi on my media centre which is now more or less obsolete now PLEX runs on the firestick.

Just found that the keyboard mapping is wrong as well the " is swapped with @ but that may just be the live system.
Steve

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[Gellyneck]

I've updated a couple of my machines from Mint 19.2 to 19.3 with the first one going OK but had issues with the second one. Think there was a "glitch" with power supply when doing the second.
Anyway, when booting GRUB didn't load and I got initramfs prompt. Found somewhere on the net a solution that worked (well it still is a few weeks later!) where it advised to type and enter "exit" at the initramfs prompt and this brought up a message advising there was some corruption in root (think it was some links issue?) and that I had to run fsck manually from the initramfs prompt.
Duly ran this with the root path (as advised in the text that had appeared) and text started scrolling up the terminal screen and finished with the initramfs prompt again.
Typed in "reboot" and it did and GRUB loaded OK.
I then manually ran "update" from the desktop task bar and I think there was a new version of GRUB included in these.
Both machines dual boot Windows 7 Pro and Mint 19.3 (previously 18.3 then 19.2).
OK, owning up, the one I had the problem with was \ is dual-booting from a single SSD (previously a single HDD that I clean reinstalled onto the SSD about 6 months ago).
Might be hee haw to do with the problem you've got but .......

 

[OldAgeTravellers]

I tried deleting partitions then making the whole drive as ext4 then deleting, but the same failure prompt after instalation. So now in the process of doing a full wipe with (sudo dd) just in case there are some Windows bits left about to cause problems.
But for me at the moment, Windows installs just work, I have probably tried Linux of various flavours about ten times over the years and failed every time but never ever failed to install windows of any release. So frustrating and time wasting.
So the wipe will probably take most of the night then I will reinstall and if it fails find a way of sending the logs.
Thanks for all the help.
Steve

 

[Gellyneck]

So the wipe will probably take most of the night then I will reinstall and if it fails find a way of sending the logs.

I think Notepad or Notepad++ will open log files but don't quote me on it!
If it does, you could copy the text into "Word" and save as a pdf to send to Gromett.

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[OldAgeTravellers]

Well, completely wiped the disk last night and reinstalled Mint 19.3 but it stopped at the (initramfs) prompt again with this screen:-

I have looked at the disk from a live Mint from the stick but the syslog file Gromett wanted is not there only a binary file in the /mint/ folder, in the /var/logs/ folder there is mintsystem which is a text file which i can't attach but is below. Any suggestions gratefully received. I really don't want this to beat me! After the failures I have done the file checks as suggested at various places in google but still nothing.
mintsystem is below but I don't think it helps much:

2020-01-19 18:44:30 - mintSystem started
Executed:
/usr/share/linuxmint/adjustments/15-ubuntu-system-adjustments-firefox.execute
/usr/share/linuxmint/adjustments/15-ubuntu-system-adjustments.execute
Replaced:
/etc/apt/preferences.d/official-package-repositories.pref
Edited:
/etc/xdg/autostart/user-dirs-update-gtk.desktop (onlyshowin)
/usr/share/applications/im-config.desktop (hide)
/usr/share/applications/libreoffice-draw.desktop (categories)
/usr/share/applications/libreoffice-math.desktop (categories)
/usr/share/applications/mate-color-select.desktop (categories)
/usr/share/applications/mate-color-select.desktop (name)
/usr/share/applications/yelp.desktop (hide)
Skipped:
/usr/lib/firefox/browser/defaults/preferences/vendor-firefox.js
/usr/lib/firefox/distribution/distribution.ini
/usr/share/cups/data/default-testpage.pdf
/usr/share/icons/HighContrast/16x16/places/start-here.png
/usr/share/icons/HighContrast/22x22/places/start-here.png
/usr/share/icons/HighContrast/24x24/places/start-here.png
/usr/share/icons/HighContrast/32x32/places/start-here.png
/usr/share/icons/HighContrast/48x48/places/start-here.png
/usr/share/icons/HighContrast/scalable/places/start-here.svg
/usr/share/icons/gnome/16x16/places/distributor-logo.png
/usr/share/icons/gnome/16x16/places/gnome-main-menu.png
/usr/share/icons/gnome/16x16/places/start-here.png
/usr/share/icons/gnome/22x22/places/distributor-logo.png
/usr/share/icons/gnome/22x22/places/gnome-main-menu.png
/usr/share/icons/gnome/22x22/places/start-here.png
/usr/share/icons/gnome/24x24/places/distributor-logo.png
/usr/share/icons/gnome/24x24/places/gnome-main-menu.png
/usr/share/icons/gnome/24x24/places/start-here.png
/usr/share/icons/gnome/32x32/places/distributor-logo.png
/usr/share/icons/gnome/32x32/places/gnome-main-menu.png
/usr/share/icons/gnome/32x32/places/start-here.png
/usr/share/icons/gnome/48x48/places/distributor-logo.png
/usr/share/icons/gnome/48x48/places/gnome-main-menu.png
/usr/share/icons/gnome/48x48/places/start-here.png
/usr/share/icons/gnome/scalable/places/start-here.svg
/usr/share/sounds/freedesktop/stereo/device-added.oga
/usr/share/sounds/freedesktop/stereo/device-removed.oga
Execution time: 0:00:00.049837

 

[Gellyneck]

Think it looks like a BIOS \ UEFI problem but wouldn't stake my life on it!
Is there an update available for this from the mobo manufacturer website?
Is your disc initialised as MBR or GPT?
Think you have an Intel CPU? Have you tried updating the microcode?
Are you trying to install from a live CD or a clean install?
Sorry, really just questions rather than answers!

 

[OldAgeTravellers]

Think it looks like a BIOS \ UEFI problem but wouldn't stake my life on it!

Yes from the screenshot it looks like it.

Is there an update available for this from the mobo manufacturer website?

I updated a few months back but will have to check again.

Is your disc initialised as MBR or GPT?

The one with Linux on is GPT.
Interestingly looking at the partition map my d: drive is a dynamic array of two 1Tb disks Mirrored. One is GPT, one is MBR. I didn't notice that when i was setting it up. Hope it will not cause problems.
Reading on the web yesterday it seems that Linux cannot handle this sort of disk. They certainly show up as two discreet disks which will be a problem if I mistakenly write to one of them from Linux. If I ever get it working!

Think you have an Intel CPU? Have you tried updating the microcode?

Processor Intel(R) Core(TM) i5-4690K CPU @ 3.50GHz, 3501 Mhz, 4 Core(s), 4 Logical Processor(s)
I think I mistakenly said i7 yesterday. When I built the computer this processor was faster than the available i7's for the sort of work I do. Don't know about the Microcode will have to look into that.

Are you trying to install from a live CD or a clean install?

I am loading from a live USB, how do you do a clean install?
As I said before it is a dedicated 240gig SSD that I completely overwrote with zero's yeaterday.

Thanks for your help,
Steve

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