Help me to choose a Thatcham 2-1 alarm please (1 Viewer)

[Nosmo King]

New PVC camper, brand new, based on Fiat Ducato. Insurers require a Thatcham 1 alarm fitted.

It already has an immobiliser as standard so it needs to convert from a Cat 2 to a Cat 1.

Any suggestions?

Does it have to be fitted by a registered installer?

TIA

 

[Deleted member 29692]

Vanbitz Growler.

Job done


Yes, whatever you choose must be fitted be an approved installer otherwise it's not Thatcham anything, just a box of expensive electronics.

This is the list of approved installers. If they aren't on this list they can't install an approved system whatever they try and tell you.

http://ww2.thatcham.org/tri/index.jsp?page=1259

 

[peterc10]

Another vote for Vanbitz Growler. Not the cheapest, but the best. Most other alarms are designed for cars. the Growler is specifically designed for a motorhome

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[Zigisla]

May I also suggest the Strikeback or Growler, but Vanbitz never the less. Theirs is a 2 - 1 upgrade and Thatcham approved.

 

[Nosmo King]

Thanks folks and thanks for the list and the confirmation.

Had a quick look and the Growler does indeed look the part. Unfortunately there's a price to pay for this quality and at the moment we're a tiny bit strapped....

I suspect I know what some of the comments might be (cost of van etc compared to alarm) but really - all I want to do is tick the Insurance box. I believe that if someone has their mind set on taking the new one, they will....

Home storage is off road and secure. Biggest threat will be while travelling either out on the road (motorway etc) or parked up and out for the day.

Someone has suggested a Sigma S34. Complies. What I'd really like is for the usual 'van key to set the alarm when the doors are locked - one key does all in effect.

 

[Zigisla]

What I'd really like is for the usual 'van key to set the alarm when the doors are locked - one key does all in effect.

I hope @eddievanbitz will be along very soon to fully explain the flaw behind that want!!

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[Nosmo King]

Thanks. Intrigued....

 

[peterc10]

I have the Growler with the non starter. It is actually painful to be in the motorhome when the sirens are on. So even if they get in they will probably want to get out quickly. And if the alarm goes off, or if anybody tries to use it with stolen keys, we get a notification on my and my Wife's phone. It will then link to Google maps to show where the motorhome is.

 

[deleted-member02]

Another vote for Vanbitz, it's worth it for the ongoing customer support alone.
You can certainly buy cheaper and save £200 maybe even £300 if you go for the cheapest alternatives.
I guess it depends if you're happy to trust a.n.other to do a quality install and be there for you (or the next owner) in the unlikely event that things go wrong...
Vanbitz also offer Funster discount (if mentioned at time of booking)

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[Nosmo King]

I shall give them a call, but I really want to spend no more than £300-£400 if possible. As I said - it's just a tickbox exercise...

 

[Clarky]

As I said - it's just a tickbox exercise...

Also, think about security at night when you are asleep in the van. You need a system where you have perimeter security but the internal sensors are off so that you can move in the van without waking the whole site up.
Sometimes cheap isn't cheerful.

Richard.

 

[NickandClair]

Thanks folks and thanks for the list and the confirmation.

Had a quick look and the Growler does indeed look the part. Unfortunately there's a price to pay for this quality and at the moment we're a tiny bit strapped....

I suspect I know what some of the comments might be (cost of van etc compared to alarm) but really - all I want to do is tick the Insurance box. I believe that if someone has their mind set on taking the new one, they will....

Home storage is off road and secure. Biggest threat will be while travelling either out on the road (motorway etc) or parked up and out for the day.

Someone has suggested a Sigma S34. Complies. What I'd really like is for the usual 'van key to set the alarm when the doors are locked - one key does all in effect.

The danger you have with using the factory key, is that it can be easily "cloned", thus allowing the alarm to be switched off. Typically these systems are also connected via the OBD diagnostic wiring, so can be easily by-passed, again an easy override.
Having a system with an independent ECU and 2 separate keys that have a rolling code, the Strikeback or Growler is very difficult to by-pass/override.
Please call the office and we will happily run through some options with you .

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[Nosmo King]

Clarky - that's an excellent point.

Nick - I shall call later. One point if you could clarify tho'... if these are Thatcham approved - how can they be so easily duplicated / bypassed? What's the point of Thatcham?

 

[Terran]

Congratulations on your new PVC Another vote for Vanbitz Growler; external lockers - alarmed, bike rack - alarmed, perimeter alarmed while you sleep, most professional install and hand-over, full and prompt technical support - absolutely none better! You'll love your new PVC and congratulate yourself every time you travel for years to come - but will you still congratulate yourself on deciding to safeguard your pride and joy on a box ticking cheap alarm?

 

[Nosmo King]

Terran - all I want to do is tick the Insurance box. Though I'm starting to re-consider this...
I believe that if someone has their mind set on taking the new one, they will....

Home storage is off road and secure. Lots of hurdles to overcome if they really want it.
Biggest threat will be while travelling either out on the road (motorway etc) or parked up and out for the day.

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[Terran]

Understood, but will you still think that when it's a year old? Your choice of course, but when I leave my pride and joy in a car park, I want to feel it is properly protected.

 

[Terran]

...and before you lot say it - I mean the MH not SWMBO

 

[NickandClair]

Clarky - that's an excellent point.

Nick - I shall call later. One point if you could clarify tho'... if these are Thatcham approved - how can they be so easily duplicated / bypassed? What's the point of Thatcham?

Sadly we have no control over the requirements of Thatcham, however we tend to spec the alarms for the motorcaravan market and not the LCV market (we don't work on anything other than Motorcaravans/RV's). We provide a comparison chart at the rear of the brochure, which can be downloaded at our website. This shows the difference between an LCV alarm and our standard Strikeback system.

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[Deneb]

In addition to what @nickvanbitz said about using the factory key, if you have an alarm that is disabled by unlocking the door (like for instance the Ford factory system on some Transits) all it takes is for a thief to use the common screwdriver under the door handle to manipulate the lock on a Ducato trick and he's in the van and also disabled the alarm in seconds. Can't happen with the Vanbitz alarm because it's separately (de)activated

When I say "common" I don't mean that it happens regularly, but it is one of the most used methods of breaking in to those vans!

 

[Zigisla]

Terran - all I want to do is tick the Insurance box. Though I'm starting to re-consider this...
I believe that if someone has their mind set on taking the new one, they will....

Home storage is off road and secure. Lots of hurdles to overcome if they really want it.
Biggest threat will be while travelling either out on the road (motorway etc) or parked up and out for the day.

Unfortunately it is not theft OF your MH it is more often theft FROM a MH that you need to be protected from. Flashing external blue lights and ear piercing sirens certainly help.

 

[Langtoftlad]

If you're not bothered about having a proper security system why not save yourself £300 getting an iffy one and change insurers, to one that doesn't have a Thatcham requirement ?

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[Nosmo King]

Most insurers require one.
I was under the impression that a Thatcham Category 1 was / is a 'proper' security system?

 

[peterc10]

Most insurers require one.
I was under the impression that a Thatcham Category 1 was / is a 'proper' security system?

But designed for cars, not motorhomes

 

[Nosmo King]

The insurers don't distinguish between the two...
They just want a proper 'Thatcham Cat 1' alarm...

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[Langtoftlad]

Your money, your choice.
Outsmartthethief is another MH specific security system...
https://www.606060.com/motorhome-security-13-p.asp
Probably no better/cheaper than VanBitz but an alternative
[I have the Strikeback & No Start for my peace of mind].

 

[peterc10]

The insurers don't distinguish between the two...
.

But you should. It is your motorhome the alarm is protecting.

Edit: BTW you did ask for suggestions and you got them, so should have no complaints. If you want to you can just ignore them.

 

[NickandClair]

May I suggest that you take a look at the following link, which takes you through our system:

This will also include the comparison chart I mentioned previous, but give you an understanding to our approach on motorhome security.

Your money, your choice.
Outsmartthethief is another MH specific security system...
https://www.606060.com/motorhome-security-13-p.asp
Probably no better/cheaper than VanBitz but an alternative
[I have the Strikeback & No Start for my peace of mind].

This equipment isn't Thatcham approved as far as I'm aware and a derived motorcycle alarm, with additions that aren't really suitable for motorcaravan applications (PIR/Pin Switch Bonnet detection etc).

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[Nosmo King]

Langtoftlad - thanks for the suggestion. I shall try them also
Peter - I have no complaints. I've asked for help. I've been given some suggestions. I'm trying to figure out if I should pay in excess of the insurers requirements, and if I do, what benefits that will bring.
I don't want an 'iffy' one.
I want a proper one.
A Thatcham approved system, properly installed.

Gather the data, evaluate, make an informed decision.
Simples.

 

[MikeD]

Have a chat with Dave Newell. He has upgraded to Cat 1 both of the vans (Fiat) we have owned and done a fine job.

https://davenewell.co.uk

I would (if I thought we had a need) fit the Vanbitz alarm as it is easily the best on the market.

But we just needed to satisfy the insurers.

Also we live in a reasonably safe part of the UK and mostly stay on sites so never thought we will need the extra.

But don't forget your Funster discount. Request it on booking.

Been proved correct so far - Now that has tempted fate

 

[Deneb]

Most insurers require one.
I was under the impression that a Thatcham Category 1 was / is a 'proper' security system?

It is, but what may be suitable for a white van is not necessarily the most suitable for a motorhome.

Security requirements for LCVs are not as onerous as for cars. Going away from the alarm system itself for a moment, Thatcham do not lay down a de facto standard set of security requirements for vehicles which must be rigorously followed. The security assessment consists of a list of items which are considered desirable, and each item is weighted by being given a certain number of points. The vehicle manufacturer obtains the necessary level of security to enable his vehicle to meet the requirements of the insurance group rating system by including whichever of those items he feels are most convenient for him to include in production whilst attaining the minimum required number of allocated points. Because for instance, Deadlocks are quite heavily weighted on the points scale, it induces manufacturers to include them as an easier way to attain their rating than by perhaps designing in several alternative options that each score lower and would be more inconvenient to insert into the production process.

However, unless your motorhome was built or converted in the UK from a base vehicle manufactured to UK standards for the UK market, the Thatcham vehicle security level is immaterial because vehicles built for other markets including much of Europe don't have to meet it, and the vehicle manufacturers often won't include items that they are not compelled to fit as a matter of course, because it eats into their profit margins.

I'm not certain, but from previous posts here and elsewhere I believe that Fiat campervan chassis and cabs supplied as back to back delivery for Alko or similar chassis to be added by the converter are also not supplied to meet Thatcham security criteria whatever the intended market (UK or otherwise).

So many motorhomes are built on base vehicles which do not meet the UK minimum security criteria laid down by Thatcham, which is in itself less onerous than the criteria for private cars.

In those circumstances, the price of a proper alarm/immobiliser and/or tracking system designed specifically for the motorhome market and costing around 1% or so of the cost of a new motorhome doesn't seem that expensive to me.

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