Home insurance when away for more than 60 Days & Home is held in a Trust (1 Viewer)

Feb 9, 2008
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Looking for an insurer who will insure our buildings and contents for more than 60 days at a time and with the home being placed in a Trust. Does any member know for certain an insurance company who will provide cover for the above.
Thanks in advance,
Philip
 
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PhilandMena
Feb 9, 2008
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Well if you knew that maybe you should have posted more details about the problem.

Instead of slapping down the first responder.



You may not get many more offers of help.
Suggest you read my post again and not add a different interpretation to that which was posted. I didn't say it was a problem. I did not slap you down, I just corrected the error in your reply which you have wrongly overreacted to. No more details were required in my post as it was a simple straight forward question asked of those who had first hand knowledge to my request for information. Clearly you do not, so am a bit of a loss as why you replied in the first place.
 
Feb 21, 2016
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Oh dear!
I would suggest you go to a good general insurance broker,if you havent already.

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Sep 18, 2010
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Can I ask a question:oops:
What’s getting insurance for 60 days got to do with your house in trust?
We’re going to put ours in trust due to this rediculous unfair self funding business so I’m just interested that’s all
 

jtp890

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May 16, 2014
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I,m more interested in the trust as I thought this loophole had been closed.

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Theonlysue

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Sep 14, 2009
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Not long enough!
Having read up, it looks like government can go back years, and if they think you've done it to avoid care costs, they can recover the funds from you.
 
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PhilandMena
Feb 9, 2008
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Can I ask a question:oops:
What’s getting insurance for 60 days got to do with your house in trust?
We’re going to put ours in trust due to this rediculous unfair self funding business so I’m just interested that’s all
My existing insurance provider will no longer provide buildings Insurance cover once we sign the Trust documents. Many insurance providers only provide 60 days cover when the house is unoccupied. Were looking for insurance cover to cover the house after it's put in a trust and to maintain cover for more than 60 days when we overwinter outside of the UK. If your looking to get cover for more than 60 days you can with Aviva.

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PhilandMena
Feb 9, 2008
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Having read up, it looks like government can go back years, and if they think you've done it to avoid care costs, they can recover the funds from you.
I raised this point with our solicitor, he said putting the house in a 'Deed of Trust' will provide us with the best protection currently available. There are different levels of protection within the trust and we are going to be in the 'Premier league' so to speak. To date, there has not been a breach of this protection made by the local authority within our county/town and we do not have to wait 7 years to obtain full protection, it will be in place once the home is in the trust and Registered. Future legislation may result in this protection becoming meaningless and we are aware the government is looking again at social care and they will introduce new/updated legislation in due course. We may be on a hiding to nothing but are doing what we can to prevent the home from being forcibly sold to pay for megga care home fees should one of us pass on and the other having tom go into a care home at a later date. If I pop my cloggs, Mena becomes the sole survivor in the home and if she has to go into care they can go after a proportion of the tiny savings she will have but will not be able to sell the home.
 
Sep 18, 2010
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Brilliant thanks
Yes as I understand it at the moment they can only go back 7 years for deprecation of assets.
However I have heard from another source that they are looking at stopping this trust thing but it’s not in place at the moment so hurry !

Still don’t understand insurance part wether it’s in trust or no
 
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PhilandMena
Feb 9, 2008
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Having read up, it looks like government can go back years, and if they think you've done it to avoid care costs, they can recover the funds from you.
Sue, I just remembered part of the long conversation we had with our solicitor when discussing this arrangement. He said to us, in setting this up we will be very careful to show and demonstrate that the reason you are putting the house in this trust is not to avoid paying care costs should the remaining partner go into a care home and then we discussed further and agreed several other reasons, (mostly family related, some not) why we were putting the home in a trust. This gave us additional protection and demonstrated the trust was not about trying to avoid the home being forcibly sold to pay for care costs.

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PhilandMena
Feb 9, 2008
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Still don’t understand insurance part wether it’s in trust or no

Neither do I but to date it seems to be an issue with a number of insurance companies and when combined with our need for more than 60 days cover have been turned down by a number of big insurance companies. Namely, Aviva. Direct Line and Churchill. I'm sure we will get the cover we need and thought there must be some Funster members who have done this and so asked the question. Looks like I will be making more enquiries come Monday.
 
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PhilandMena
Feb 9, 2008
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@PhilandMena
The government have a habit of moving the goal posts and taking what they want.
I was told years ago, you're better off having nothing.
I would agree with 'leaving nothing' rather than 'having nothing', although we do have those in our society who have nothing and seem to get by and some of them claiming to have a good quality of life. However, I don't believe that for a second !

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Dennisad

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Neither do I but to date it seems to be an issue with a number of insurance companies and when combined with our need for more than 60 days cover have been turned down by a number of big insurance companies. Namely, Aviva. Direct Line and Churchill. I'm sure we will get the cover we need and thought there must be some Funster members who have done this and so asked the question. Looks like I will be making more enquiries come Monday.

Hi PhilandMena

Did you solve your buildings and contents cover for more than 60 days? We too are trying to get the same cover for 90days, we were with The AA but they say not able to insure us in the future.

Cheers DennisandTerry
 
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PhilandMena
Feb 9, 2008
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Hi PhilandMena

Did you solve your buildings and contents cover for more than 60 days? We too are trying to get the same cover for 90days, we were with The AA but they say not able to insure us in the future.

Cheers DennisandTerry
Yes, we did. Took a bit of doing but we eventually found an insurance broker who was able to find us a company. What was surprising was the ignorance of initial staff contact when trying to obtain cover. The majority of people on the other end of the phone had never heard of a Deed of trust and the remainder did not understand how it worked and almost all had to refer to other staff and I suspect many of them simply did not get it. I discussed with our solicitor and he did say that as our daughters were named as beneficiaries in the trust it might be easier for the insurance companies if they insured the house in their name ?. If your not putting your house in a trust and just looking for 90 days plus, talk to Aviva, they will do it.
 

Puddleduck

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I would agree with 'leaving nothing' rather than 'having nothing', although we do have those in our society who have nothing and seem to get by and some of them claiming to have a good quality of life. However, I don't believe that for a second !

I once drew up accounts for a (titled) man who had enjoyed a very good quality of life. At the end he left nothing but debts..... from what I remember he owed a substantial amount of money as when he was told he had only a year to live he maxed out all his credit (cards and loans) and blew the lot.

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irnbru

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Jun 27, 2013
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Its true it does make a difference. When mum put her house into trust her insurance company rang to say they ha to cancel her insurance. I will give her a ring and ask who she's with now.
 

irnbru

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I once drew up accounts for a (titled) man who had enjoyed a very good quality of life. At the end he left nothing but debts..... from what I remember he owed a substantial amount of money as when he was told he had only a year to live he maxed out all his credit (cards and loans) and blew the lot.


Fab idea for me one day :)

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jtp890

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May 16, 2014
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Interesting note from an article in financial times,

Further tax charges would also potentially arise during the lifetime of the trust, on every tenth anniversary of its creation, depending on the value of the assets within the trust. Finally, it is also worth noting that if in future you need local authority nursing care, any gift made to a trust can be set aside if the local authority considers it was done deliberately to deprive yourself of assets. "
Interested to know how your solicitor hopes to get round this one. Mine advised that even paying rent after transfer will not mitigate charges by LA only satisfies IR
James
 
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PhilandMena
Feb 9, 2008
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Thought I would give you an update which should provide a little more clarification. I had a long chat with Aviva this afternoon and they explained the problem for insurance companies dealing with homes that are placed in a 'Deed of Trust'. The issue for them is they are unable to establish who is the owner of the home as the house is sitting in a trust and neither we (Who have lived in it for the last 40 years and still do) or our daughters who are the beneficiaries, legally own the property. they went on to say, they have found it a legally difficult to deal with, when a claim is made so they have stopped insuring them. They did go on to say, the way forward was to find a broker who would provide the cover as their is a likely-hood that they would underwrite the cover. Also, while I'm at it. This 7 year rule that some members have referred to as being the limit on time costs can be recovered from estates, is according to our solicitor, not so. He told us of a case where a council went after someone's asserts some 20 odd years after it had been transferred to a relative.

The trick in placing your home in a trust is being able to demonstrate with good legal justification that it is being placed in trust for a different reason than trying to avoid paying possible care home costs and In our case we have been able to do this and according to our solicitor we have a level of protection that is not only second to none but it is highly unlikely that a claim will be made against the estate in the first place. Given the odds that I will pop my clogs first I would go knowing I have done my best for her in doors and theirs a reasonable chance our children will have something to fight over when Mena departs too.
 
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PhilandMena
Feb 9, 2008
8,924
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Interesting note from an article in financial times,

Further tax charges would also potentially arise during the lifetime of the trust, on every tenth anniversary of its creation, depending on the value of the assets within the trust. Finally, it is also worth noting that if in future you need local authority nursing care, any gift made to a trust can be set aside if the local authority considers it was done deliberately to deprive yourself of assets. "
Interested to know how your solicitor hopes to get round this one. Mine advised that even paying rent after transfer will not mitigate charges by LA only satisfies IR
James
Yes, Our solicitor covered these points. The value of our property is well below the threshold that will attract any form of taxation. Also discussed your second point in detail and whilst I will not say what we did to avoid that clause being used against us, we have the necessary protections in place.

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Aug 18, 2014
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The issue for them is they are unable to establish who is the owner of the home as the house is sitting in a trust and neither we (Who have lived in it for the last 40 years and still do) or our daughters who are the beneficiaries, legally own the property.
I fail to understand why it should concern them ? If a claim is mad they pay whoever is the trustee/trustor or put the property back in the condition it was before. Sounds to me that because they cannot actually work out who to deal with & attempt to under pay in the event of any claim, they prefer to use any excuse not to insure .
 
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PhilandMena
Feb 9, 2008
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I fail to understand why it should concern them ? If a claim is mad they pay whoever is the trustee/trustor or put the property back in the condition it was before. Sounds to me that because they cannot actually work out who to deal with & attempt to under pay in the event of any claim, they prefer to use any excuse not to insure .
Beats me too Gus. It is what it is though. As best as I can figure out the 'trust' is not a person, just a place where the house resides and therefore there is no one individual to deal with. You would have though we could have just continue to pay for a repeat of our existing cover as we are still living in the house and if a claim was made they would deal with us. Not so, it appears.
 

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