A frame ...not happy at all (1 Viewer)

[cookie]

Had an a frame fitted last year and not happy at all.
Noticed on way up here car seemed jerky on braking.

Away on hols near skipton come to hitch up car and brake cable seems really tight.
Had a look and it's resting on the drive shaft and obviously been wearing away.it's now flattish on the underneath

looks like they've suspended it on cable ties and ones given way but cable ties are attached to the car brake pipes

Rang them up and really not being helpful.my immediate thought it possibly being unsafe is that they'd send a fitter straight out to make it safe. Its only 80 miles away.Wouldn't have thought brake pipes should be used to support anything.
Awaiting a call back from them to see what they are going to do

What would you do now?

 

[zac]

Had an a frame fitted last year and not happy at all.
Noticed on way up here car seemed jerky on braking.

Away on hols near skipton come to hitch up car and brake cable seems really tight.
Had a look and it's resting on the drive shaft and obviously been wearing away.it's now flattish on the underneath
View attachment 232002
looks like they've suspended it on cable ties and ones given way but cable ties are attached to the car brake pipesView attachment 232002
Rang them up and really not being helpful.my immediate thought it possibly being unsafe is that they'd send a fitter straight out to make it safe. Its only 80 miles away.Wouldn't have thought brake pipes should be used to support anything.
Awaiting a call back from them to see what they are going to do

What would you do now?

Give them a chance to fix it and if not name them, to be honest i think i would want the whole lot checked given what they have done anyway but thats just me.

 

[tonyidle]

Ask myself why I didn't check their workmanship sooner?

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[Kevan]

Name them? Shoddy workmanship, warn others,

 

[cookie]

Oh ifs there's any problem getting them to make it safe their name will be posted everywhere.

 

[Rally man]

I think you are looking at P.A.S. pipes.
But agree not a very good job, ask for the cable to be replaced.

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[DavidG58]

I think a firm that fitted it like that is extremely unlikely to think they should jump in a van a drive out to 80 miles fix it

You had best get it looked at locally, or if it will wait till back then get the original fitters to look and sort

 

[Larrynwin]

Appears that when fitted a cable tie was attached to lift the brake cable to prevent rubbing. Possibly difficult to re route to avoid which might cause an unnecessary bend so another cable tie to lift it clear would probably solve the problem.

 

[SuperMike]

That looks like quality work to me.


A definite don’t care attitude. I know it is a completely different thing but during my apprenticeship, misuse of a tool would cost the apprentice one days pay. The classic one was a file, which only cuts one way, so it’s forward, lift, back, down, forward, lift, back down. It’s called standards and pride in what you do. That was 55 years ago, but the same standards should apply today. Sadly they are not and one reason why this country is in such a sh*t hole.

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[cookie]

On looking yes it's PAS PIPES .but still not satisfactory place to anchor anything .

when brakes are used cable straightens and flexes PAS pipes .

£1200 for a bodge job I don't think so

Mechanic on farm here says it looks like a child has fitted it.

Latest.......when explained I'd either drive it or run it into local garage all at their expense they've agreed to send a "lad" out tomorrow with a couple of cables.

When it's fixed then I will name and shame .

When a company doesn't care about safety others need to be warned.

 

[tacr2man]

There is no drive shaft in the picture and the brake cable appears to be cable tied to the aircon pipes (or maybe PAS) but pas is not normally ally (but things change) The item that it seems to be rubbing on is a anti roll bar . Ideally they should have put a metal bracket secured on the anti roll bar mounting , but cable ties are used frequently and are sufficient for most purposes , a second as a safety would have been an idea . The bowden cable probably needs replacing , but there is nothing happening there that is life threatening , no brake pipes in pic . HTSH
ps you are probably getting worried due to a lack of knowledge , that makes you think the situation is far worse than it is.

 

[cookie]

Another view. . Deffo drive shaft

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[cookie]

There is no drive shaft in the picture and the brake cable appears to be cable tied to the aircon pipes (or maybe PAS) but pas is not normally ally (but things change) The item that it seems to be rubbing on is a anti roll bar . Ideally they should have put a metal bracket secured on the anti roll bar mounting , but cable ties are used frequently and are sufficient for most purposes , a second as a safety would have been an idea . The bowden cable probably needs replacing , but there is nothing happening there that is life threatening , no brake pipes in pic . HTSH
ps you are probably getting worried due to a lack of knowledge , that makes you think the situation is far worse than it is.

I think I know what a drive shaft looks like
And whether something is safe or not.

 

[Larrynwin]

To be fair , I don’t think your first photos showed a drive shaft but the last one it’s obvious , but again I would if possible use a cable tie even if only as a temporary measure.

 

[DBK]

The Bowden cable should have been secured with proper metal clips to something solid like a bit of the metal bodywork. No way cable ties should ever have been used.

Sadly, this example reinforces why A Frames are highly questionable because companies are doing things completely unregulated without following the sort of standards the vehicle manufacturers have to follow.

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[cookie]

To be fair , I don’t think your first photos showed a drive shaft but the last one it’s obvious , but again I would if possible use a cable tie even if only as a temporary measure.

You might use anything as temporary but I certainly wouldn't do a bodge on brakes
The outer casing has worn away both the rubber outer and the metal. and the inner cable is sticking as it passes through the damaged section it's probably partly cut through this as well.
I certainly wouldn't advise anyone to do anything temporary especially on a safety feature.

 

[cookie]

The Bowden cable should have been secured with proper metal clips to something solid like a bit of the metal bodywork. No way cable ties should ever have been used.

Sadly, this example reinforces why A Frames are highly questionable because companies are doing things completely unregulated without following the sort of standards the vehicle manufacturers have to follow.

Agree. But surely they still have a responsibility to make everything is safe to use.

 

[DBK]

Agree. But surely they still have a responsibility to make everything is safe to use.

Absolutely, it should be safe and should never have left their workshop like that - assuming it did of course and hasn't been altered subsequently.*. My broader point is do these companies operate under any sort of code of practice? I suspect not but this means they are fiddling with braking systems without following any standards.

*My lawyer has advised me to add that bit.

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[Larrynwin]

You might use anything as temporary but I certainly wouldn't do a bodge on brakes
The outer casing has worn away both the rubber outer and the metal. and the inner cable is sticking as it passes through the damaged section it's probably partly cut through this as well.
I certainly wouldn't advise anyone to do anything temporary especially on a safety feature.

If this is the overrun cable then just don’t use the a frame, provided the cable is temporarily kept clear of the drive shaft then the car should be safe to use until the cable is replaced.

 

[tacr2man]

I think I know what a drive shaft looks like
And whether something is safe or not.

I was going by the pics you posted , not being telepathic I was unable to ascertain that the contact between a drive shaft and a bowden cable was occurring as you stated. My subsequent remarks were all based on what you posted . There was nothing in the pics that was life threatening . The danger level in the final pic is a matter of judgement , same as using an A frame in the first place, as some would say .

 

[olley]

If the cable snapped or you disconnected it, your then pulling an unbraked trailer over 750kg which is illegal.
As has been said crap workmanship, should have fixed properly, what else have the bodged?

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[Lenny HB]

That's what I expected them to say. Totally unacceptable the job need redoing properly.
There is a clue in the name "Cable Ties" they are not designed to hold heavy brake cable and certainly shouldn't have been attached to a brake/power steering pipe.

 

[Teuchter]

Another view. . Deffo drive shaft

View attachment 232076

That is diabolical workmanship and an accident waiting to happen!!!

 

[Steve and Denise]

Anyone like to guess Armitages or Towtal ?

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[GWAYGWAY]

That is rubbing on the car drive shaft and it will not be long going through the cable. far too tight and cable ties to the power steering is not good either. I take it they want you to goo back with it but by then the cable will have had it and so will the brakes.

 

[tonyidle]

Cable ties in themselves aren't a 'bodge'. They are immensely strong (try a 3mm one zipped as a stirrup - it will carry your weight). The problem is the attachment and routing of the cable. The cable has to accommodate movement caused by operation of the brakes and by the vertical movement of the toad relative to the mh so the position and design of the first anchor point and connection to the A frame cable or rod is critical. Routing should be as straight as possible to avoid excessive straining of the cable and its mountings. Ideally the cable should not move at all within the engine bay.

 

[bigtwin]

In my opinion, that is worthy of Trading Standards involvement.

Shockingly bad workmanship.

Ian

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[Lenny HB]

Cable ties in themselves aren't a 'bodge'. They are immensely strong (try a 3mm one zipped as a stirrup - it will carry your weight).

Don't agree had loads fail just with a small amount of pressure on them. They won't break but the ratchet grip gives way.
In they days when you could only buy only branded ones they were a lot better nowadays mostly cheap Chinese crap.
IMO opinion a totally bodged job, cable ties are cables why else would they call them cable ties.

 

[PP Bear]

I'd report it to the trading standards, that's the worst case of professional neglect I've seen.

There must be a tremendous amount of heat buildup as the drive shaft rotates on the cable. Plus the strain with the fact that cable ties are attempting to pull the cable out of the way.

Shoddy shoddy workmanship. Is the company even registered as an ISO, have an accredited Chartered Engineer status, or a bunch of cowboys as the pictures dictate.

 

[Steve and Denise]

I'd report it to the trading standards, that's the worst case of professional neglect I've seen.

There must be a tremendous amount of heat buildup as the drive shaft rotates on the cable. Plus the strain with the fact that cable ties are attempting to pull the cable out of the way.

Shoddy shoddy workmanship. Is the company even registered as an ISO, have an accredited Chartered Engineer status, or a bunch of cowboys as the pictures dictate.

I do agree with what you say but none of these companies will be ISO and I must say the majority of motor home companies I have bought from are cowboys!

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