A frames update May 2018 gov. UK (1 Viewer)

irnbru

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What’s the change then Kate? I don’t know what the rule was before .
 

Jim

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No changes really. Essentially the updated document clarifies the braking requirements for A-frames, and confirms that the advice provided relates solely to vehicle construction and use requirements. (y)

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The Nomad

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Whoever did the spelling/grammar proof-reading for that revised note before they published it should get the sack.

The note now seems stronger than before on the "this is only probably legal within the UK; other countries laws are different" message.
 
Oct 29, 2008
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Does it not imply that vehicles with ESC or AEB cannot be A framed as they will not operate?

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Aug 6, 2013
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Whoever did the spelling/grammar proof-reading for that revised note before they published it should get the sack.

The note now seems stronger than before on the "this is only probably legal within the UK; other countries laws are different" message.
Same guy who wrote the opening lines for Startrek.
 
Aug 6, 2013
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Does it not imply that vehicles with ESC or AEB cannot be A framed as they will not operate?
I thought that at first read - but if true there would be little point in their clarification because it would exclude all current cars being used as a toad.
 
Oct 29, 2008
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I thought that at first read - but if true there would be little point in their clarification because it would exclude all current cars being used as a toad.
I cant see any other way to see it. It implies that the car braking should work as intended, and AEB and ESC wont when being towed.
Strange that it doesnt mention ABS

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Aug 6, 2013
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I cant see any other way to see it. It implies that the car braking should work as intended, and AEB and ESC wont when being towed.
Strange that it doesnt mention ABS
Unsurprisingly the clarification raises more questions than it answers :).
 
Feb 20, 2017
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Useful clarification of the law in the UK - now if we can only get those idiots in Europe to agree!!

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The Nomad

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Useful clarification of the law in the UK - now if we can only get those idiots in Europe to agree!!


They have agreed.
They've almost all agreed right across mainland Europe.
They've agreed that it is illegal to tow one road vehicle on it's road wheels with another on their roads.

The one set of idiots in a part of Europe that still hasn't quite yet definitively banned the practice is .... the UK;)
 
Oct 2, 2008
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It begs the question as to why they would update the advice , one has to ask is it in preparation to take moves to get a stated case , to effectively ban , as Brexit will cause UK needing to sign and ratify
Vienna Convention on Road Traffic , which they have yet to do .
 

vwalan

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It begs the question as to why they would update the advice , one has to ask is it in preparation to take moves to get a stated case , to effectively ban , as Brexit will cause UK needing to
sign and ratify
Vienna Convention on Road Traffic , which they have yet to do .
uk might not ever sign it. havnt so far. it really started before the eu and even before uk joined the eec.
best we dont sign and tell the rest of europe to go away.

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May 7, 2016
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There are two Vienna Conventions, one concerning traffic and the earlier 1961 one concerning diplomatic relations. I think they sometimes get confused. We are not the only Eoropean nation that has not ratified the traffic one.
 
Feb 20, 2017
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They have agreed.
They've almost all agreed right across mainland Europe.
They've agreed that it is illegal to tow one road vehicle on it's road wheels with another on their roads.

The one set of idiots in a part of Europe that still hasn't quite yet definitively banned the practice is .... the UK;)
Have you ever towed a car with an electronically braked A Frame?

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D

Deleted member 29692

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Useful clarification of the law in the UK - now if we can only get those idiots in Europe to agree!!

No it's not.

It's a clarification of their interpretation of current trailer legislation and how they're guessing it applies to these devices.

The law can't be clarified by the government, only by the court. (Parliament is technically a court)
 
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bigtwin

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Whoever did the spelling/grammar proof-reading for that revised note before they published it should get the sack.

The note now seems stronger than before on the "this is only probably legal within the UK; other countries laws are different" message.

I’m curious to understand the flaws that you found.

Can you enlighten us (me)?

Ian
 

Mikey RV

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All these A frame threads etc are great. I am just about to get a A frame for my toad so hope it becomes legal all over the whole world. (y)

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Charlie

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They have agreed.
They've almost all agreed right across mainland Europe.
They've agreed that it is illegal to tow one road vehicle on it's road wheels with another on their roads.

The one set of idiots in a part of Europe that still hasn't quite yet definitively banned the practice is .... the UK;)

What about towing a caravan ?

The only difference between a towed car and a caravan is the caravan is and never can be as stable as towed car.
 
D

Deleted member 29692

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What about towing a caravan ?

The only difference between a towed car and a caravan is the caravan is and never can be as stable as towed car.

A caravan is specifically designed to be towed.

These devices are a modification to a car that is not designed to be towed.

Is the modification adequate for long term use? The rest of Europe say no, the UK doesn't have a clue but nobody cares enough to test it so someone's best guess is as good as it's going to get.

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Feb 20, 2017
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I would really like to know if any of the naysayers have actually towed with one and what exactly did you discover was fundementally wrong with the setup?

I have in the past towed boats, small trailers and caravans and my current A Frame setup has been the most stable towing combination.

Just an observation but I have seen more badly maintained/loaded trailers involved in breakdown/accident situations.
 
D

Deleted member 29692

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Both my cars have towing eyes on the front. I assume these eyes have been specifically designed to be used....

Two questions:

1. Is the towing eye designed to be used for prolonged periods or long distances? Or is it perhaps intended only for recovery over short distances?

2. Does the A frame device connect only to the towing eye and nowhere else on the vehicle?
 

pappajohn

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Both my cars have towing eyes on the front. I assume these eyes have been specifically designed to be used....
Yes, they have.......but with a straight tow pole and a person in control of steering and, if necessary, braking.
The most common use is to winch an broken down car onto a slidebed/beavertail recovery truck.
 

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