CAUTION When using MV Service Points on C C Sites (1 Viewer)

[Motomuz]

Hi

We have just had an interesting experience on the Swansea C C Site

Our Iveco S/B has a RV Toilet system as the USRV have

We pulled up to the MV Service point to Dump our Grey and Black lifted the Cover and pulled the velve the wste started flowing and the came up over the whole area !! hmmm nice!!!

It turns out that some of the C C Wardens have put a mesh filter on the Drain end of the MV Service point - dont ask us why they just have

After confronting the Warden he ranted and raved that Toilet waste shouldnt be put down the MV Service point to our surprise!!!

After getting onto HQ they informed the Warden to remove the Mesh ASAP but he informed us he has been a warden for 20 years and he always uses a Filter - What a plonnker!!!

Just air on the side of caution although it wasnt our fault we had to clean it up

Motomuz

 

[scotjimland]

An unpleasant incident in more ways than one ..

However, the drive over dump points were designed for grey waste and the warden probably fitted the mesh to prevent solid matter from blocking the drain..

It may also be the case that the grey drain goes to a surface water drain and not suitable for sewage .. so he may , I say may, have been correct to say that the black should have been dumped in the chemical disposal point..

In future I think it's worth checking with a warden before dumping black into the surface drain

Whatever the case, he had no right to go into a rant..

jim

 

[peter marshall]

HI
Hope you made a good JOB of it.

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[Fatalhud]

Because My van has a cassette system I have always used the chemical disposal point, but I must admit I have always wandered whether you can empty loo waste down the MH point drain

Alan H

 

[Larrynwin]

The club sites I have been on have always said no problem use the mv drains for black as well as grey waste

 

[dazzer]

Hi

We have just had an interesting experience on the Swansea C C Site

Our Iveco S/B has a RV Toilet system as the USRV have

We pulled up to the MV Service point to Dump our Grey and Black lifted the Cover and pulled the velve the wste started flowing and the came up over the whole area !! hmmm nice!!!

It turns out that some of the C C Wardens have put a mesh filter on the Drain end of the MV Service point - dont ask us why they just have

After confronting the Warden he ranted and raved that Toilet waste shouldnt be put down the MV Service point to our surprise!!!

After getting onto HQ they informed the Warden to remove the Mesh ASAP but he informed us he has been a warden for 20 years and he always uses a Filter - What a plonnker!!!

Just air on the side of caution although it wasnt our fault we had to clean it up

Motomuz

I would have refused to clean it up. Its not your fault they block up the inlet is it??

You should have just driven away and left them to it. :thumb:

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[pappajohn]

I would have refused to clean it up. Its not your fault they block up the inlet is it??

You should have just driven away and left them to it. :thumb:

my thoughts exactly. :thumb:

 

[Landy lover]

Sounds to me like a typical Club problem - every warden makes up his / her own rules and what to do - what to accept etc on the basis of I'm in charge and I don't care what anyone else says - Surely there should be a sign saying Grey waste only or NO black etc. Surely the club must work to a set of rules general to all sites and then specific variations according to each site - laid down in writing so any warden assistant warden etc has the info to work from.

We seldom use Club sites despite being a member of both we like the relaxed atmosphere of the CL and CS sites but when we have used club sites we have always dumped on the MH point before leaving.

Personally if some jumped up Warden started to rant at me apart from the sharp edge of my tongue he would have had the job of cleaning up - show common sense and I would clean it - rant and he has the job all to himself.

 

[pappajohn]

However, the drive over dump points were designed for grey waste and the warden probably fitted the mesh to prevent solid matter from blocking the drain..

jim

i can see the logic in that Jim BUT if the mesh is to stop solid matter then it will block up eventually regardless of whether its sh*t or lumps of food waste/solidified fat etc going down the dump point.

and agreed.....the warden should have been a little more understanding 'cos as far as the CC HQ were concerned he was in the wrong and was told to remove the mesh.

still, give some folks a nametag and they think they are god. :Angry:

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[scotjimland]

I'm not a fan of the CC but the motorhome dump points were designed for European vans to dump grey tanks, not USRV's to dump black ..

If a mess is made dumping black then I would say it's your responsibility to clean up .. you can't expect someone else to clean up after you..

USRVs are being banned from many sites, lets not give them another reason for doing so ..

jim

 

[scotjimland]

i can see the logic in that Jim BUT if the mesh is to stop solid matter then it will block up eventually regardless of whether its sh*t or lumps of food waste/solidified fat etc going down the dump point.

That's true John, but cleaning out some food waste isn't nearly as bad a cleaning shit out ..
I've seen drive over dumps on aires blocked solid with crap .. and it wasn't the Euro vans that were responsible. As I said in the last post.. lets not give them more reason to ban RVs .

jim

 

[pappajohn]

That's true John, but cleaning out some food waste isn't nearly as bad a cleaning shit out ..
I've seen drive over dumps on aires blocked solid with crap .. and it wasn't the Euro vans that were responsible. As I said in the last post.. lets not give them more reason to ban RVs .

jim

i agree Jim but im sure some site wardens would also frown on dragging your dump hose and shoving it down the elsan point as well.

as the driveover dump points are a relatively new thing i cant see why they couldnt run them into the sewer rather than rainwater drains.

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[nemu]

A european style drive over waste point is for black & grey water

European vans often have marine toilets with holding tanks not cassettes

thats why the clubs are having to fit these motorhome servicing points

this warden was out of place!!!

 

[grasscutter]

Itis illegal for a site to allow grey waste to contaminate any watercourse. All surface water drains discharge to watercourses and are not treated. Waste should be dumped to the foul water system so why would they have a mesh????

 

[des]

i had the same nasty experience in holland earlier this year. i now ALWAYS check with wardens before emptying the black tank.

des

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[olley]

Hi I always assumed they were for both black and grey, never been told not to dump in them, and I remember at Sheep Cote CC being told to. I Guess the question needs to be put to the CC for clarification.

Olley

 

[Landy lover]

As I said in the last post.. lets not give them more reason to ban RVs .

jim

Hi Jim - possibly a little off topic here but does this again go back to what I said about wardens making up their own rules. Many sites have facilities for large vehicles but it is down the Warden - we are 27ft unhitched and there are many sites that refuse because we are a fifth wheel unit saying we are too big yet when the sizes are quoted back at them or I refer to the size of a Bailey Carolina I have been told 'its down to me and I dont want them on MY site' - I can understand 'sorry we are full' - ' sorry all the larger pitches are allocated' etc but surely policy should be made at head office - and Wardens be bound by that set of rules - lets face it large RVs are not new and every year more and more enter the UK. The CC are a business offering a product to the caravaning fraterity. If they have a problem with the size then maybe they should consider charging by the foot on a scale not alienate a potential new and growing market by arrogance and exclusion

 

[scotjimland]

Hi Jim - possibly a little off topic here but does this again go back to what I said about wardens making up their own rules. Many sites have facilities for large vehicles but it is down the Warden - we are 27ft unhitched and there are many sites that refuse because we are a fifth wheel unit saying we are too big yet when the sizes are quoted back at them or I refer to the size of a Bailey Carolina I have been told 'its down to me and I dont want them on MY site' - I can understand 'sorry we are full' - ' sorry all the larger pitches are allocated' etc but surely policy should be made at head office - and Wardens be bound by that set of rules - lets face it large RVs are not new and every year more and more enter the UK. The CC are a business offering a product to the caravaning fraterity. If they have a problem with the size then maybe they should consider charging by the foot on a scale not alienate a potential new and growing market by arrogance and exclusion

Hi

I totally agree, and it's the reason I never renewed my CC membership .. but to be frank, do you think the CC are the least bothered about a few hundred RV owners whom they may alienate .. ?

The CC are not the only organisation who are anti RV, many private sites are also banning or discouraging them.. citing damaged roads, grass verges and ehu bollards and complaints from others about shading them from the sun.... but don't take my word for it .. Eddie, proprietor of Cornish Farms site has this to say:

Good idea Put us on the list at Cornish Farm Touring Park, as we don't welcome very large RV's

The reality is that we get complaints from people with smaller vans and caravans "Do I have to look at "That" all day long" Can't you move them some where else"

Also when a large RV comes on site for one or two nights, after several days freeparking that they arrive with a 50 gallon black tank full, which they dump and wash away with 50 gallons of grey water into our holding tank

The tank that we have to pay to be emptied. The last time we had it emptied it cost us £130 for disposal of "1000 gallons of hazourdous waste" So the 100 gallon dump costs us £13.00

Add the water for washing the RV, the awning and the towed car and another dump before they leave knackering posts and the corners of the adjacent pitches and you will see why we dont jump for joy when a 40' RV pulls up.

Link Removed

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[Larrynwin]

Hi

I totally agree, and it's the reason I never renewed my CC membership .. but to be frank, do you think the CC are the least bothered about a few hundred RV owners whom they may alienate .. ?

The CC are not the only organisation who are anti RV, many private sites are also banning or discouraging them.. citing damaged roads, grass verges and ehu bollards and complaints from others about shading them from the sun.... but don't take my word for it .. Eddie, proprietor of Cornish Farms site has this to say:



Link Removed

Hi Jim

dont know why the guy on Cornish farms should think an rv produces any more waste. If the wife and I were in a 20 fter or a 35 fter we would still eat and wash and produce the same amount of waste, we just need to dump once a week as opposed to every day with a cassette. Its the kind of business attitude that deserves to be broadcast, then perhaps his opinion might change :Angry:

 

[GregM]

Hi Jim
... we just need to dump once a week as opposed to every day with a cassette. Its the kind of business attitude that deserves to be broadcast, then perhaps his opinion might change :Angry:

Larrynwin

I don't agree with the site owners attitude but haven't you just confirmed his point, you can go a week without emptying your waste, you may stay on his site for a couple of nights and empty a full weeks worth of waste into his tank.

 

[Larrynwin]

Larrynwin

I don't agree with the site owners attitude but haven't you just confirmed his point, you can go a week without emptying your waste, you may stay on his site for a couple of nights and empty a full weeks worth of waste into his tank.

Hi Greg

No, I dump at the end of every stop to avoid carrying unnecessary weight and just put a drop of water in to swill around when on the move.

Larry

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[johngee]

Hi

We have just had an interesting experience on the Swansea C C Site

Our Iveco S/B has a RV Toilet system as the USRV have

We pulled up to the MV Service point to Dump our Grey and Black lifted the Cover and pulled the velve the wste started flowing and the came up over the whole area !! hmmm nice!!!

It turns out that some of the C C Wardens have put a mesh filter on the Drain end of the MV Service point - dont ask us why they just have

After confronting the Warden he ranted and raved that Toilet waste shouldnt be put down the MV Service point to our surprise!!!

After getting onto HQ they informed the Warden to remove the Mesh ASAP but he informed us he has been a warden for 20 years and he always uses a Filter - What a plonnker!!!

Just air on the side of caution although it wasnt our fault we had to clean it up

Motomuz

My understanding is that the service point is for grey water. In the CC glossary, there are the following definitions:

Motor Caravan Service Point - A facility on a caravan site where a Link Removed can have the onboard Link Removed tank filled, and the onboard Link Removed tank emptied.

Waste Water - Water which has been used in the kitchen or bathroom area. This should be collected in an internal tank or external container for later disposal at a designated emptying point on the site. Most caravans use external containers, while most Link Removed use internal tanks, although there are exceptions to this.

 

[scotjimland]

My understanding is that the service point is for grey water. In the CC glossary, there are the following definitions:

Motor Caravan Service Point - A facility on a caravan site where a Link Removed can have the onboard Link Removed tank filled, and the onboard Link Removed tank emptied.

Waste Water - Water which has been used in the kitchen or bathroom area. This should be collected in an internal tank or external container for later disposal at a designated emptying point on the site. Most caravans use external containers, while most Link Removed use internal tanks, although there are exceptions to this.

Thanks for finding and posting, that has always been my understanding ..

I've never used the MH service point to dump black waste, I use a 15ft x 3" dump hose or the macerator which has 30mt of hose and deposit in the elsan point, if that's not possible then I fall back on waste master.

I've been in the vicinity when a van has dumped black in the open trench.. it's not pleasant ..

jim

 

[imprint]

caution when using MV Service Points on CC sites

May I suggest contacting the CC tomorrow, and referring this to them.

There are two issues, and for once no pun intended:

1) A reasonably defintive opinion from HQ

2) the conduct of the Swansea honcho

Then please publish the response

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[warwick]

I would`nt be too harsh on the wardens many take a genuine interest in their sites and its only a little natural to become a little annoyed when things go wrong. I witnessed a warden doing his nut after a member drove his outfit around a taped area and through a large area of newly seeded grass lovely big 4x4 tyre marks.
Thats in their defence the other problem is the C.C. and other owners are on a roll and we the customer are suffering as a consequnce you only have to look at some prices of commercial sites here and abroad.

 

[olley]

Hi Jim

dont know why the guy on Cornish farms should think an rv produces any more waste. If the wife and I were in a 20 fter or a 35 fter we would still eat and wash and produce the same amount of waste, we just need to dump once a week as opposed to every day with a cassette. Its the kind of business attitude that deserves to be broadcast, then perhaps his opinion might change :Angry:

Eddie neglected to say in his rant, that if you don't use chemicals in your toilet, you dump in the ordinary sewer, which he pay's a fixed charge for, irrespective of how much its used.

Olley

 

[Landy lover]

Hi

I totally agree, and it's the reason I never renewed my CC membership .. but to be frank, do you think the CC are the least bothered about a few hundred RV owners whom they may alienate .. ?

The CC are not the only organisation who are anti RV, many private sites are also banning or discouraging them.. citing damaged roads, grass verges and ehu bollards and complaints from others about shading them from the sun.... but don't take my word for it .. Eddie, proprietor of Cornish Farms site has this to say:



Link Removed

I think Wildman answered that very well on the original post as follows:-

Bearing in mind the larger RV's tend not to wildcamp, they only produce the same amount of waste per head as the rest of us, apart from a few who are always so full of it they will dump less anyway, hee hee. As to clipping other pitches then I suggest that is a layout and management problem. Other mh owners are usually pleased to large RV's, I know I would be, but then I don't use sites and don't spend much in motorhome shops or have work done in garages. I am a self confessed recycler skin flint, cheapscate and proud of it. I do not waste the resources I have lining other peoples pockets. When I wild camp we buy all of out food etc locally, vist local attractions then move on to the next place, we tour, we do not actually camp. Stop, cook, sleep, move on. we enjoy life on the move. It is only new age travellers who give us old age travellers a bad name. Businesses need to learn they cannot differentiate or very soon the people who provide their living will find that income reducing as members vote with their feet.
I think that was a very blinkered veiw Eddie. but then maybe you have been having a bad day. Hope it improves. .

Personally when we go onto a site - we have grey and black tanks totally empty except for any usage on route - water tank generally full but certainly at least half full - I dont want to spend money hauling unnecessary weight. When we leave we are the same . whilst we are on site we do not use any of the facilities except water - waste (black grey and dustbins ) and EHU so our presence on a site is of minimum impact. Its interesting to note Eddie is still in the Big Pitch Guide giving a size up to 36ft so maybe its the extra 4ft thats the problem

Regarding the CC on many sites they seem to be invoking a 26ft rule which as many standard motor homes are over that now days if they applied that rigidly they would be refusing a lot of their membership . However it seems to be aimed more at the RV community. Again weight is sometimes quoted at me my 5'er weighs in at 3.5 tonnes on 2 axles with 15 inch wheel - response that too heavy - thats funny many motor homes weigh in at 3.8 tonnes !!

I could go on but you can see where I am coming from:thumb:

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[Larrynwin]

I am a Caravan Club member and the club are happy to take my subscription annually as they would from a member with a 15ft caravan. Whilst that is the case then other than for access restrictions I have the same rights as the member in his 15ft caravan. With my 32ft RV I do not cut across the grass any more than the member with over 30ft of car and caravan. I know mine does not bend in the middle , but with 12ft of rear overhang I have a fairly short wheelbase and can maneuver without grass clipping.
As far as dumping is concerned I only use the mv service points with wardens agreement. These service points if used for grey waste must enter a sewer or septic system to comply with environmental issues and as such are then suitable for black waste.
As far as weight is concerned it is probable that a 7.5 ton rv with its large double rear wheels creates no more ground pressure psi than a 3.5 ton motorhome on single, much narrower wheels.
I would not want to lose the option of CClub sites as they do extend the choice of stops available. I think I feel better for getting that off my chest.

 

[Motomuz]

Thaks everyone for your replies

The moral of the story is - Air on the side of caution

OK the CC want our money and 9.9 time out of 10 there facilties are spot on it doesnt need the Warden chipping in his ideas me thinks

As some EU M/H are now using the Black Tank system there will be more call for MV Service points which surely will be better for everyone?

Motomuz