Smell of gas (1 Viewer)

[Bart]

So I installed a gas it system and our original regulator was used , which meant only 1 hose was newly installed ( from filler point to the bottle ) , at the end of the existing regulator hose an adapter supplied by gas it was used to connect it to the new cylinder valve.
So at home in n.Ireland I put £14 of calor LPG gas into the bottle and did a leak test using the leak spray pen supplied , all was good and no smell of gas . We the started our holidays and came to the main land UK .that was last Monday , and all seemed good as far as i could see and NO smell of gas , and we have been using all the appliances
then yesterday while we were at one of the motorway service stations we decided to fill up the bottle while we were there . Using one of the modern refillers that looks just like a petrol pump, the same LPG that is used to run a gas converted vehicle. As the vehicle in front of us was one that was converted.
Anyway we fitted about 18lts into it , and it filled that 18lts very fast compared to how long it took to fill the car in front ( he took 36 lts )
But SINCE that refill yesterday morning we gave smelt gas in the Mh , and also when you open the gas locker I'm sure I can smell gas.
I refilled the system I closed of the main valve on the top of the bottle as I had read of people damaging there regulator , but I left open the regulator output valve lever. WAS THAT OK ?
WHY would we smell gas now and not before ?
Different gas?

 

[scotjimland]

I refilled the system I closed of the main valve on the top of the bottle as I had read of people damaging there regulator , but I left open the regulator output valve lever. WAS THAT OK ?


WHY would we smell gas now and not before ?
Different gas?

yes, that was ok.. you closed the bottle outlet when filling, that's correct..

if you smell gas you have a leak.. they all smell much the same.. 'stench' is added at the refinery to make leaks more apparent..

If you filled untill the 80% shutoff valve closed.. it's possible that the leak is coming from the fill hose, which will be full of liquid gas until the bottle level drops and allows it to go into the bottle..

check for leaks around both ends of the fill hose..

 

[Bart]

Btw Is the "refill hose" constantly under pressure once the gas cylinder has gas in it ?? Or is there a 1 way valve fitted to the refill inlet let.
Reason I ask is if I ever needed to remove the cylinder from the Mh would it have to be empty

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[Emmit]

Says he who is the proud owner of a new (to me) Gaslow system....
When I bought the bottle there wasn't a pipe on the 'Inlet' of the bottle and yet there was gas in the bottle.
I did ask the seller and he told me that there is a one way valve in the Gas Inlet to the bottle.
Must be true (unless he filled the bottle with water???) as I could only get 12 Lts of gas into an 11Kgs bottle when I filled it.

 

[Boringfrog]

Btw Is the "refill hose" constantly under pressure once the gas cylinder has gas in it ?? Or is there a 1 way valve fitted to the refill inlet let.
Reason I ask is if I ever needed to remove the cylinder from the Mh would it have to be empty

The refillable hose on mine has a one way valve and is under a little pressure, if you remove it a little gas will come out of it.

 

[scotjimland]

is there a 1 way valve fitted to the refill inlet

yes.. as said .. it has a non-return valve on the bottle inlet..

if required you can safely remove the inlet hose ..

but as said in first post, it may have liquid gas in it until the bottle level drops and allows it to escape into the bottle. It will then just have a small volume of vapour that will dissipate quickly.

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[Bart]

yes, that was ok.. you closed the bottle outlet when filling, that's correct..

if you smell gas you have a leak.. they all smell much the same.. 'stench' is added at the refinery to make leaks more apparent..

If you filled untill the 80% shutoff valve closed.. it's possible that the leak is coming from the fill hose, which will be full of liquid gas until the bottle level drops and allows it to go into the bottle..

check for leaks around both ends of the fill hose..

The filler end of the hose is outside the gas cabinet on the valance . But this is below the gas cabinet , but the smell could be traveling up into the cabinet, however there is a smell of gas in the MH. So I would aim more for the filler hose joint at the bottle... but w8 having said that I turned off the gas bottle last night while we're were sleeping in the Mh. . And never smelt anything . Which would suggest the bottle outlet ..
Ps when we smell gas it is both in the cabinet and inside the mh .. so I would lean more to the gas cylinder connection . As apposed to appliances

 

[scotjimland]

All I can suggest is to get busy with gas leak detection spray .. if you don't have any to hand, use water with a drop of dishwashing liquid .. wet liberally around all hose connections, valve stems, and unions . and watch for tiny bubbles..

LPG is heavier than air so unlikely to travel up into the cabinet

http://www.screwfix.com/p/arctic-products-leak-detection-spray-400ml/41019

 

[Bart]

yes.. as said .. it has a non-return valve on the bottle inlet..

if required you can safely remove the inlet hose ..

but as said in first post, it may have liquid gas in it until the bottle level drops and allows it to escape into the bottle. It will then just have a small volume of vapour that will dissipate quickly.

I take it this Is not normal ?
And I should try to re tighten all the joints .. I think they are all metal to metal joints apart from the 1 adapter at the reglator

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[Bart]

All I can suggest is to get busy with gas leak detection spray .. if you don't have any to hand, use water with a drop of dishwashing liquid .. wet liberally around all hose connections, valve stems, and unions . and watch for tiny bubbles..

LPG is heavier than air so unlikely to travel up into the cabinet

http://www.screwfix.com/p/arctic-products-leak-detection-spray-400ml/41019

Thanks for the spray link . Will get some tomorrow

 

[Badknee]

I have an old pump action bottle filled with soapy water that I use to check the 47kg bottles on our static, I also occasionally spray around the joints on our gasit system, cheaper than detection spray.
As Jom says gas drops as its heavier than air, if you can smell it in the Moho check the vents in the floor of the gas locker have not becomed blocked.

 

[Bart]

Isnt it true that Gas vents are only used when there is a gas leakage ?
So if I am smelling gas . Then there is a leak ?
P.s I've just tightened all the joints up another bit. And cooking dinner
If I still smell gas I'll get a roll of gas tape and re connect all the joints again., note : I never used tape 1st time as advised by the bottle supplier . Due to the connections I was using

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[scotjimland]

If I still smell gas I'll get a roll of gas tape and re connect all the joints again., note : I never used tape 1st time as advised by the bottle supplier . Due to the connections I was using

NO NO NO .. do not do that .. Your supplier is correct.. never use PTFE tape on a bottle connector or any other surface to surface connections or on gas compression fittings..

It should only be used on BSP and taper threaded fittings as a lubricant and aid to sealing..

Be careful not to over tighten the connections as they can crack .. .. finger tight , then nipped up..

if they are leaking, then either there is dirt on the mating faces or they are scratched/damaged..


Taper thread fitting

 

[DavidG58]

you are a braver man than me cooking on gas when you can smell a gas leak

a recent thread had a similar issue, turned out that was a split probably over tightened connector

personally I would be down the pub eating, then getting it checked tomorrow

 

[Bart]

@DavidG58 yip yoiu are correct but the smell is minor and only happens after a few hrs . When we cooked tonight there was no smell as the gas had just been turned back on.

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[Badknee]

Have you any cleaning product handy in a squirty bottle that will produce bubbles? If so give it all a good dosing tonight to put your mind at rest.

 

[Bart]

NO NO NO .. do not do that .. Your supplier is correct.. never use PTFE tape on a bottle connector or any other surface to surface connections or on gas compression fittings..

It should only be used on BSP and taper threaded fittings as a lubricant and aid to sealing..

Be careful not to over tighten the connections as they can crack .. .. finger tight , then nipped up..

if they are leaking, then either there is dirt on the mating faces or they are scratched/damaged..


Taper thread fitting

Thanks Jim for the info , it's to late re me over tightening the joints as I tightened them with a 10ft bar
But it's not to late for the gas tape Thanks

 

[DavidG58]

If your nose is a sensitive as mine you will be still be smelling the gas long after it is cured

Good luck sorting it

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[Bart]

Thanks I'll keep yous updated..

BTW as a matterer of interest how many people here that travel lots between spots that they stop at DO NOT turn off their gas bottle while traveling between sites..
Yes I know Im gonna get all the it's illigal to drive with the gas bottle open brigade. But I'm just curious

 

[DavidG58]

there are fittings that make it both safe and legal to drive while still turned on, but way back I worked for a company selling fire fighting equipment, as sales training we had to tackle real fires, sure it wouldn't be allowed now

we were told a sealed gas canister is one of the worst things to find in a fire, so my logic is, with a valve open the worse you might get is a flame thrower, hopefully better that and know it is there than a hidden bomb, even with labels on the external door (presuming they are fitted)

 

[peterc10]

I can confirm that David's nose is incredibly sensitive. He can detect chlorine in water in minute amounts

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[Bart]

Lol @peterc10
We have had no smell of gas again since the other day when I re tightened up the gas pipes with a 10ft bar
So it was either not sealed right somewhere or there is a slight leak at the filling hose . As the smell started just after we refilled and lasted for about 2 days.

 

[tonyidle]

you are a braver man than me cooking on gas when you can smell a gas leak

a recent thread had a similar issue, turned out that was a split probably over tightened connector

personally I would be down the pub eating, then getting it checked tomorrow

The smell of an explosive gas / air mix would have you retching and ill. You would have vacated the vehicle long before there was any possibility of igniting it.

 

[dabhand]

It sounds to me as though you have overfilled your gas bottles and the pressure relief valve has operated, this will cause a smell of gas until some has been used, it's just happened to me, it is of course worse if you don't turn your gas bottles off when filling!

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[The Wino]

We had a similar thing after first fitting gasit there was a leak from the back of the bayonet ftting to the high pressure hose which fits on the cylinder there was an audible leak and the bayonet fitting was cold on the back when tightened it was ok but the locker still smells very slightly of gas. Gasit said there is a one way valve on the cylinder so you can disconnect the hose but it only closes on a fairly big gas leak a slow one will seep until the gas runs out!!!. I was told to disconnect when the cylinder is empty and beware of liquid gas leaks the hose is full of liquid gas when you finish refilling. I also had a problem filling once the 80% limit was reached but I topped up a bit like you would on a petrol tank......not a good idea as the gas still was on with the cyl valve closed I think some liquid gas was in the hose past the valve. As others have said don't use ptfe the fittings aren't meant for it I think they often settle a bit as the system is used the first few times.

 

[Bart]

It sounds to me as though you have overfilled your gas bottles and the pressure relief valve has operated, this will cause a smell of gas until some has been used, it's just happened to me, it is of course worse if you don't turn your gas
bottles off when filling!

Sure when filling the lpg tank are you not meant to fill it the same as putting petrol in a car . As in it auto cuts off when full. And the gas it bottle has an 80 per cent cut of same as all bottles for safety.

 

[dabhand]

Sure when filling the lpg tank are you not meant to fill it the same as putting petrol in a car . As in it auto cuts off when full. And the gas it bottle has an 80 per cent cut of same as all bottles for safety.

If you don't turn your bottles off when filling it is possible to overfill ie. more than 80% this will give you liquid gas in the pipes and can operate the pressure relief valve giving a smell of gas!

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[Bart]

If you don't turn your bottles off when filling it is possible to overfill ie. more than 80% this will give you liquid gas in the pipes and can operate the pressure relief valve giving a smell of gas!

Yip I did close it as I had read before that it can damage your regulator. If you filled it with the value open.

 

[Badknee]

Yip I did close it as I had read before that it can damage your regulator. If you filled it with the value open.

I turn both my bottles off when filling and only open the 11kg to use and leave the 6kg one closed to use as a back up. Never needed it yet as the 11kg one lasts for ages. I filled them from new last year and have filled them twice over the winter. Just before we went to France in June I thought I would top them up so we set off with full tanks. I was a bit embarrassed when I could only fit 65p's worth in.
I must admit I never turn the 11kg one apart from when filling.