12v Circuit Hymer B594 1996 (1 Viewer)

[Triple7]

I recent bought my B594. Overall Im delighted with it as it's been well cared for, mechanically near perfect with only 60k and the interior is very original and good condition.

The one exception is the 12v wiring. Over the years a reversing camera and additional interior lights were added but the 12v feed was taken from the engine battery. The whole thing is now a bit messy.

I decided to sort this out but found that for some reason the original 12v circuit won't power leds although it's fine with the original halogens. I tested the voltage and that was showing about 11v.

Why can't I or the previous owners tap into the original leisure 12v circuit? Any comments or advise would be really appreciated ; it's driving me nuts!

Many thanks

 

[JeanLuc]

You should be able to link to an original 12v circuit, or set up a new additional one. What charger model do you have?
There should not be a problem with LED lights. Where are you trying to fit them?

 

[pappajohn]

Sounds like theres a resistance somewhere.
Try cleaning any earth wire connectors you can find and remove both battery terminals, clean thoroughly and refit them then smear with a little petroleam jelly.

Some LEDs are polarity sensitive so if possible turn them round then reinsert.

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[mitzimad]

do you realise that led's are polarity sensitive if you wire the wrong way they dont work try reversing the wires it will not damage them in reverse just do not work

 

[Triple7]

You should be able to link to an original 12v circuit, or set up a new additional one. What charger model do you have?
There should not be a problem with LED lights. Where are you trying to fit them?

I would have to go to the van and have a look. Is the charger all part of the distribution panel? It looks like something from the 50s rather than the 90s in german and with dark red connectors Ive never seen before.

I have a feeling nothing works. It would explain the previous owners wiring and Ive had a selection of led light fittings not work and it actually blew up a usb female connector with 5v step down I was wiring in. The original wiring is very heavy duty so Im wondering if its pushing too many amps?????

I can have a look tomorrow

 

[Triple7]

Sounds like theres a resistance somewhere.
Try cleaning any earth wire connectors you can find and remove both battery terminals, clean thoroughly and refit them then smear with a little petroleam jelly.

Some LEDs are polarity sensitive so if possible turn them round then reinsert.

The battery setup is all new (dual) and the leds are actual light fittings, not individual leds. Strange..... I assumed there was some simple well known explanation. I honestly dont think its anything faulty with the van. I think its something to do with the original setup.

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[Triple7]

do you realise that led's are polarity sensitive if you wire the wrong way they dont work try reversing the wires it will not damage them in reverse just do not work

as I mentioned to papajohn I was installing led light fittings so they would have been labeled correctly. I cant remember if I tried reversing the polarity; maybe the wiring in the van was switched somehow. I will try that tomorrow

 

[mitzimad]

heavy wiring is a bonus its not the wiring that pulls current but the aplliance in your case the light

 

[Triple7]

heavy wiring is a bonus its not the wiring that pulls current but the aplliance in your case the light

sure but it suggests to me something else is going on. Im wondering is it something to do with the 240v system

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[JeanLuc]

I'm not certain what charger / 12v distribution system Hymer was fitting in 96; by 99/2000 they were fitting a Schaudt Elektrobloc - either EBL99 or 100. It might help to have a picture of yours so we can get an idea what 12v distribution circuits you have.
Be aware that Hymer, in common with most German manufacturers use blue (or sometimes black) cable for 12v positive and brown for 12v negative.

 

[Triple7]

I'm not certain what charger / 12v distribution system Hymer was fitting in 96; by 99/2000 they were fitting a Schaudt Elektrobloc - either EBL99 or 100. It might help to have a picture of yours so we can get an idea what 12v distribution circuits you have.
Be aware that Hymer, in common with most German manufacturers use blue (or sometimes black) cable for 12v positive and brown for 12v negative.

Based on your comments and others, Im beginning to think it might be a polarity issue. Im pretty sure I didn't check as I assumed brown is positive and blue negative; not the other way around. It would explain why my USB adapter fitting, a cheapie off ebay, blew up. Probably didn't have reverse polarity protection.

What has thrown me though is the previous owner(s) wiring. They went out of their way to avoid the vans circuit when wiring up a florescent light. Choosing to tap into the reversing camera wiring instead which was wired to the engine battery (even though it uses a manual switch).

I will either post a few pics or a positive result tomorrow. Many thanks.

 

[JeanLuc]

Sounds like a bit of a bodge! Send us a picture of the charger.

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[Triple7]

Well that was easy it was as simple as reserved polarity. Many thanks for your collective wisdom. Even the original lights have the red going to blue which I failed to notice the other day.

While I'm on the subject I thought I would push my luck. The picture of my distribution box shows a spare solar input socket on the right. Currently my solar panel is going directly to the battery. Can I wire it up here and if so what might be the order?

From the top down they are labeled 3,2,1.

Thanks again

 

[JeanLuc]

The short answer is yes you can.

The charger/rectifier is a Schaudt Elektroblock but I cannot see the full model number. It looks like an earlier version than the EBL99 that I have (EBL99 and EBL100 are very similar and used on most Hymers from the late 90s until mid 2000s).
You should have a separate instruction manual for the EBL, if not it may still be available as a download from the Schaudt website - if not an email to Udo Lang there may get you a copy.
The factory-fitted 12v circuits are supplied from the Molex (or Tyco) Mate'n'Lok (MNL) connectors on the front panel. That is where the supply for any additional circuits should have been taken from, using new MNL pins in spare holes, or by splicing into existing circuits (provided there is capacity). To do this of course, you need the EBL circuit diagram to know which pin supplies what.

The Solar input is a three-pin MNL connector and again you need the EBL circuit diagram to know which pin is which. If you buy a Schaudt solar regulator, it comes with the required connector. Other regulators may be usable but you have to know that the spec is compatible. One advantage of connecting the solar reg to the EBL is that the incoming charge will show on the control panel dial.

I suggest we start with you confirming the EBL model number then we'll consider the next step.

 

[Triple7]

Is the 3 pin connector on the top right not the one?

Unfortunately, the van didnt come with a wiring diagram. Im guessing that all chargers would have common sequences , and in the 3 2 1 on mine. What is the sequence on other (working) solar setups? The connector plug is there; just waiting for some wires

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[JeanLuc]

Yes, the three-pin connector on the right is for the input from a solar regulator. But you need to know how the pins are connected inside the EBL before attempting to connect to it. Judging by the fuse marking for the solar input, the maximum charging current that the EBL can take is 10 amps. How does this compare with the regulator you have and the panel size feeding it?

Which model EBL is it? The number is partly obscured in your picture by a bit of blue string!

 

[JeanLuc]

What you see on the right of the EBL is a MNL socket which needs a plug to engage with it. This needs crimp pins that hold the cables and then click into place in the plug (very hard to get out again without the correct removal tool). The plug is something like this (but you need to ensure you get an exact match for your socket):
Broken Link Removed

On the later EBL99, pin 1 is -tve and pin 3 is +tve. Pin 2 in the middle is not connected.

 

[Triple7]

Yes, the three-pin connector on the right is for the input from a solar regulator. But you need to know how the pins are connected inside the EBL before attempting to connect to it. Judging by the fuse marking for the solar input, the maximum charging current that the EBL can take is 10 amps. How does this compare with the regulator you have and the panel size feeding it?

Which model EBL is it? The number is partly obscured in your picture by a bit of blue string!

Blue String?....... Thats the charger ejector mechanism ;-) I will have a look tomorrow and uncover the number. 10a is fine for the solar panel.

Many thanks for your help

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[Triple7]

Blue String?....... Thats the charger ejector mechanism ;-) I will have a look tomorrow and uncover the number. 10a is fine for the solar panel.

Many thanks for your help

From a bit of scratching around on the internet it looks like a 104 or 105. As a matter of interest if the layout on the top is identical, are they interchangeable?

 

[Ed Excel]

It may be worth pointing out, there are no colour conventions for vehicle ELV wiring, only perhaps some manufacturer's preferences. The only harmonised colours apply to LV (230/415V) cables.

 

[Triple7]

From a bit of scratching around on the internet it looks like a 104 or 105. As a matter of interest if the layout on the top is identical, are they interchangeable?

The 105 says 12v=15a whereas the picture Ive found for the 104 says 10a ; same as mine. I wonder if I could put a 15a one in? I suspect the charger in mine is not up to snuff. Its not doing a great job recharging my new dual battery setup

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[Triple7]

It may be worth pointing out, there are no colour conventions for vehicle ELV wiring, only perhaps some manufacturer's preferences. The only harmonised colours apply to LV (230/415V) cables.

Ive learned that lesson the hard way lol

 

[denisejoe]

The connector on the top right is the socket, the schuldt solar reg has different connectors that to suit different models that have to plug in the socket

Joe

 

[JeanLuc]

The Schaudt website download section has only German language manuals for the 104 and 105 EBLs. I suggest an email to Udo Lang who speaks English and is very helpful. Ask him for an English manual and any questions about connecting your solar regulator (e.g. MNL plug format). I would not recommend increasing any of the fuses above the limits marked on the EBL front plate.
Udo.lang@schaudt-gmbh.de

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[JeanLuc]

Just had a look at your picture of the EBL. It has a maximum charging current of 10 amps which indicates that your two batteries will be straining it somewhat. The general rule is to limit the battery capacity to roughly 10x the max charging current. So, about 100-110 Ah of battery is a sensible working limit.
One other thought - you have not fitted AGM batteries have you? They require a higher charging current and your EBL will not charge them properly.

 

[Triple7]

My thoughts were to change the whole unit to a 105 (15a).... My batteries are two gel 56ah so they shouldn't be putting that much of a strain but nonetheless I am concerned. I measured my voltage today on the lighting circuit and it was showing 11.5 no load and with a about 1-2amp draw it dropped to 11.2v. The batteries themselves hover around 12 but with any use at all they drop. I will charge them up fully on the mains and see what happens. So far I haven't really being using them so I cant say how they behave under normal use.

I will email Udo Lang and ask him, thanks for the tip.

 

[JeanLuc]

Check that the EBL is set to gel. If it is set to lead-acid it will not fully charge the gels. I cannot see a switch in your picture but I expect there is one somewhere. Another question for Udo?

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[Triple7]

Ive managed to find the wiring diagram on their site. Im none the wiser as a lot of the info is on the panel but someone else might find a use for it... Elektroblock EBL 104

The 4 page manual confirms the polarity question 1 minus 2 in 3 out

 

[JeanLuc]

It's a different system to the later EBLs. I would definitely ask Udo for advice.

 

[Triple7]

definitely. Ive emailed him.

As a matter of interest what does the in/out switch to the right of the 240v plug do? And if I wanted to add another circuit how are the wires attached to the connector block? Is it a bullet?

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